Posted on 04/22/2008 9:49:56 PM PDT by Choose Ye This Day
My family was polygamous on my fathers side. Brigham Young had honored my great great GF by instructing him to take four more wives as a commandment of sorts in from 1852-1857. (love those commandments)
Therefore, as a polygamist, GG GF married:
(2) Patience Perkins (1783-1862) in Salt Lake, 4 April 1852,
(3) Sally Maria Barber (1811- ) in Salt Lake, 7 April 1853,
(4) Mehitable Sawyer (1806-1886) in Salt Lake, 11 September 1857,
(5) Emma Nye (1837- ) in Salt Lake, 13 December 1862.
Additionally my Great Grandfather also had three wives.
Anyway, my mothers side had not experienced such grandeur from the prophet.
Here’s the funny remembrance: My mother had a meeting with me and my four brothers in which she admonished us to marry women with lines that were not connected to Weber County. She also told us to marry women with darker complexions.
I am certain this possibility is tied to eugenics which was actually being taught in the high school I attended from 1956-59. I also think it was very common knowledge among church members.
Just something for your “gee whiz” file.
Yes, that is true. In the 1840s at one LDS general authorities meeting, Smith demanded the wives of all 12 present. (Now later it was claimed he wasn't really interested in adding all dozen wives to his personal clain; that he was just testing their level of sacrifice & obedience to him...and that's likely true...I'm sure he wasn't planning on adding a dozen wives...but I'm sure he wouldn't have minded 1, 2, or 3 of them).
As it turned out, Smith's marriage to 14 yo Helen Mar Kimball was an outcome of that meeting. For Helen Mar's father who was at the meeting, it was a temporary personal crisis...would he yield his wife, or be disobedient to "the prophet?" As it turned out, Heber C. Kimball, who himself went on to accumulate 40 wives, elected to offer up his daughter instead:
From Changing World of Mormonism, pp. 236-237:
"The fact that Joseph Smith asked for other men's wives was made very plain in a sermon delivered in the tabernacle by Jedediah M. Grant, second counselor to Brigham Young. In this sermon, delivered February 19, 1854, Jedediah M. Grant stated:"
When the family organization was revealed from heaven—the patriarchal order of God, and Joseph began, on the right and on the left, to add to his family, what a quaking there was in Israel. Says one brother to another, "Joseph says all covenants are done away, and none are binding but the new covenants; now suppose Joseph should come and say he wanted your wife, what would you say to that?" "I would tell him to go to hell." This was the spirit of many in the early days of this Church....What would a man of God say, who felt aright, when Joseph asked him for his money? He would say, "Yes, and I wish I had more to help to build up the kingdom of God." Or if he came and said, "I want your wife?" "O Yes," he would say, "here she is, there are plenty more." ... Did the Prophet Joseph want every man's wife he asked for? He did not ... If such a man of God should come to me and say, "I want your gold and silver, or your wives," I should say, "Here they are, I wish I had more to give you, take all I have got" (Journal of Discourses, vol. 2, pp.13-14).
"In his book Mormon Portraits (pp.70-72), Dr. Wyl presents some revealing information:"
Joseph Smith finally demanded the wives of all the twelve Apostles that were at home then in Nauvoo....Vilate Kimball, the first wife of Heber C. Kimball,...loved her husband, and he,...loved her, hence a reluctance to comply with the Lord's demand that Vilate should be consecrated....They thought the command of the Lord must be obeyed in some way, and a "proxy" way suggested itself to their minds. They had a young daughter only getting out of girlhood; and the father apologizing to the prophet for his wife's reluctance to comply with his desires, stating, however, that the act must be right or it would not be counselled...asked Joe if his daughter wouldn't do as well as his wife. Joe replied that she would do just as well, and the Lord would accept her instead. The half-ripe bud of womanhood was delivered over to the Prophet.
"The fact that Joseph Smith asked for Heber C. Kimball's wife but actually married his daughter is verified in the book The Life of Heber C. Kimball, written by Apostle Orson F. Whitney:
Before he would trust even Heber with the full secret, however, he put him to a test which few men would have been able to bear. It was no less than a requirement for him to surrender his wife, his beloved Vilate, and give her to Joseph in marriage! The astounding revelation well-nigh paraly[z]ed him. He could hardly believe he had heard aright. Yet Joseph was solemnly in earnest....He knew Joseph too well...to doubt his truth or the divine origin of the behest he had made....Three days he fasted and wept and prayed. Then, with a broken and a bleeding heart, but with soul self-mastered for the sacrifice, he led his darling wife to the Prophet's house and presented her to Joseph. It was enough—the heavens accepted the sacrifice. The will for the deed was taken, and 'accounted unto him for righteousness.' Joseph wept at this proof of devotion, and embracing Heber told him that was all the Lord required....The Prophet joined the hands of the heroic and devoted pair, and then and there, ... Heber and Vilate Kimball were made husband and wife for all eternity (Life of Heber C. Kimball, pp.333-35).
Helen Mar, the eldest daughter of Heber Chase and Vilate Kimball, was given to the Prophet in the holy bonds of Celestial Marriage(p.339).
I didn’t have a Gee Whiz” file, but I do NOW! ;) This subject will provide more Gee Whiz moments, I’m sure.
Here is some of the evidence presented in the McMartin preschool trial courtesy of Wiki. There were hoards of news reports, wild speculations, rumors, conflicting interviews and media hysterics if you remember. I will wait, and I certainly won’t indict a whole religion based on an offshoot no matter what.
Some of the accusations were bizarre.[6] It was alleged that, in addition to having been sexually abused, they saw witches fly, traveled in a hot-air balloon, and were taken through underground tunnels.[4] When shown a series of photographs by Danny Davis, the McMartins’ lawyer, one child identified actor Chuck Norris as one of the abusers.[3] There were claims of orgies at car washes and airports, and of children being flushed down toilets to secret rooms where they would be abused, then cleaned up and presented back to their unsuspecting parents. Some children said they were made to play a game called “Naked Movie Star” in which they were photographed nude.[1][4]
“What surprised me as an investigative journalist was that nobody looked beyond the seemingly fanciful nature of the disclosures. Nobody tried to interpret what the disclosures might mean through a child’s frame of reference and perception. Nobody searched for plausible explanation....children talked about...improbable events like jumping out of airplanes and seeing a horse killed. Yet, investigators did not track reports that Raymond Buckey had a friend who ran a special effects studio or that Virginia McMartin’s sister owned a horse ranch.”[5]
Wayne Satz, at the time a reporter for the Los Angeles ABC affiliate television station KABC, reported on the case and the children’s allegations. He presented an unchallenged view of the children’s and parents’ claims.[13] Satz later entered into a romantic relationship with Kee MacFarlane, the social worker at the Children’s Institute International, who was interviewing the children. Another instance of media conflict of interest occurred when David Rosenzweig, the editor at the Los Angeles Times overseeing the coverage, became engaged to marry Lael Rubin, the prosecutor.[14]
While it is true that the LDS leaders were much more likely to have plural women & girls (wealthier men who could afford them; plus greater pressure on leaders & future leaders to do so by those already engaged in the practice), that amounted to still a high percentage.
B. Carmon Hardy estimates that during its peak in the late 19th century, 20-30% of Mormons were part of polygamous families. (LDS have often intentionally skewed these stats by counting percentages among men...but, if, say, the average polygamous man had 3 wives...you automatically dilute the %).
The PA Amish marry among themselves. They don’t socialize much with Amish in other states. Hence all their problems.
Even 20% or 30%, if that “estimate” is even remotely accurate, is not a “high percentage.”
Aragon, this is the informative ping I promised you.
I don’t understand how anyone can continue to birth defective offspring without conscience.
Not at all. Many of us have been part of those “other options,” and found them sorely wanting.
I covered it last week in my blog.
Burroak, here’s another bit of information about FLDS.
This is, indeed, sad for the children, but on a funnier note, the Westboro Cult is passing along the UGLY gene!
One wife is more than enough for me.So is one mother-in-law.
With all that inbreeding, you'd have fewer mothers-in-law than you'd expect.
I hadn’t heard about the Hutterites. Found some info on google along with this interesting fact:
Hutterites produce about 60% of the state’s pork, 50% of the eggs, and about 17% of the milk in Montana.
Thanks for posting.
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