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Air Force firings reveal culture clash
The Austin American-Statesman ^ | Saturday, June 07, 2008 | Bob Deans

Posted on 06/06/2008 10:58:17 PM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach

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To: SkyPilot

Yes, and when Loren Thompson at the Lexington Institute changed his tune from “shut-up Boeing and stop yer belly-aching” (http://lexingtoninstitute.org/1260.shtml), to “hold-on a second, something doesn’t smell right here” (http://lexingtoninstitute.org/1268.shtml), that is very telling.

Word is, Loren is none to happy about being played by deceptive and misleading information.


81 posted on 06/08/2008 1:12:25 PM PDT by Hulka
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To: Chinstrap61a

So here’s a question: is there still a need for an independent air force?


82 posted on 06/08/2008 3:02:17 PM PDT by starlifter
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
"I've been wrestling for months to get more intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance assets into the theater," Gates told the war college students...Moseley and Wynne, by some lights, represented an old guard

It's not like there was a war on or anything with American lives, mission success and American prestige at stake.

Remember folks. Wynne was a Bush appointee. When folks get on me about my views of the incompetence this administration's appointees, it is this stuff that really gets me angry as hell. How many years did we flounder around in Iraq before we started to get it together? And how much of this floundering was a bunch of good 'ol boys more concerned about nest feathering than any semblance of doing their jobs?

And $3.5 Trillion in debt and a war that has dragged on for years, losing a Republican majority wasn't enough to break the backs of this? They actually had to go out and loose some nukes to get the axe.

83 posted on 06/08/2008 3:14:57 PM PDT by AndyJackson
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To: Hulka

Thank you for one of the more informative posts I have seen on FR in a long time! Good show!


84 posted on 06/08/2008 3:22:23 PM PDT by Enchante (Barack Chamberlain: My 1930s Appeasement Policy Goes Well With My 1960s Socialist Policies!)
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To: Hulka
But to me he is near-sighted and myopic in focusing on the “now” as opposed to the Big Picture.

You make excellent points and I support this perspective. Unfortunately, however, getting through "now" is important to getting to the future. It is an incredibly expensive now, and a lot of bungling got us bogged down in this now for a lot longer and a a lot higher than was necessary.

85 posted on 06/08/2008 5:21:56 PM PDT by AndyJackson
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To: SkyPilot
"we'll just cut everything else so I can get the F-22 anyway."

This is a brilliant [warning - deep sarcasm] strategy and you see agencies try it all the time in DC. Of course, Congress is happy to take the savings they have identified off the table for their own pet [pork] projects. They cannot whine when Congress takes money they said they didn't need. But Congress will just keep the money, blame them for wasting it in the past, and tell them they still have not justified their new program. So they lose the money. [Warning - do not try this strategy at home with your wife. No woman is THAT dumb] [/deep sarcasm]

86 posted on 06/08/2008 5:46:45 PM PDT by AndyJackson
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To: starlifter
"So here’s a question: is there still a need for an independent air force?"

Good question. I think that we really do need an Air Force - but a different organization than we have now. The USAF we have now seems to be frozen in the 50s and 60s, but with better (and far more expensive) equipment. They seem to be oriented towards fighting the Russkies and occasionally lifting some equipment and dreaming of weaponizing space but also seem to never read a newspaper to see where the world is going now. They'd almost serve as a museum display, except they cost so much..

The realy criminal part is their desertion of the Army's need for close air support. When you can really get the Joint Air Forces Component Commander to shake a few sorties loose from all of the scheduled missions, they bomb from way up high and a long ways off (except for the A-10s which happily bomb and strafe us - can anybody in the Air Force bother to learn what our vehicles look like?). Really a shame - and since they insist that they "own anything that flies" the army is stuck with only rotary wing support.

I suspect that the only solution is to fire anybody above the rank of Lieutenant Colonel and completely rebuild the Air Force as a supporting institution - supporting the ground-gaining arms - as it always should have been.

87 posted on 06/08/2008 5:56:05 PM PDT by Chinstrap61a
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To: bboop

Unfortunately with a shortage of Priest and 11 Places to serve Airforce Chaplin services one sometimes two Camps.. The Other Catholic Chaplin services the rest... They are Bad!


88 posted on 06/08/2008 7:16:49 PM PDT by philly-d-kidder (Contractor From Arifjan Kuwait where the Weather is over a 120 F and we don't sweat it!!)
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To: Chinstrap61a

Agree that we need the missions the air force performs today. But the Key West agreement is long past its useful life.

Leave the nukes a unified command. Divide transport between the Army and the Navy. Bomb droppers and air superiority to the Army.

Despite all the rhetoric and doctrine [sic] air power alone will never be sufficient to win a war.


89 posted on 06/09/2008 6:51:56 AM PDT by starlifter
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To: Virginia Ridgerunner
"The solution, I think, to getting more USAF UAV pilots trained and on duty is to implement a new "Warrant Officer" grade just like the Army's for its chopper pilots."

Not a bad idea, but there is ample precedence for NCO pilots...Flying Chevrons

90 posted on 06/09/2008 7:08:10 AM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: Enchante

Thank you, I appreciate the comment.


91 posted on 06/09/2008 1:02:09 PM PDT by Hulka
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