Plant Prejudice vs. the Constitution

PatriotPost.US ^ | Aug 13, 2008 | Jacob Sullum

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

The fact that neither Marijuana nor drugs in general are mentioned in the Constitution means that the federal government has not been granted any power concerning drugs.

Marijuana is an agricultural product that is an imported plant. Marijuana is not a native species to North America.

The regulation of trade is certainly a Constitutional power.

Also, the use of drugs has been a chemical warfare agent used against the young people of this country by the Left wing since the 1960s...

You know in your heart this is true. It is pure villainy.

[fr_freak]

The regulation of trade is certainly a Constitutional power.

Don't start with this. The Commerce Clause has absolutely no bearing on whether the federal government can regulate what a person ingests, or what a person grows for his own use, or what he grows for sale within the state. Period. Any argument that you may present which includes the position that it does will be immediate classified as complete fallacy.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

The Commerce Clause has absolutely no bearing on whether the federal government can regulate what a person ingests, or what a person grows for his own use, or what he grows for sale within the state.

Marijuana is an imported agricultural product, it has nothing to do with the "Commerce Clause" and everything to do with international trade...

[fr_freak]

Marijuana is an imported agricultural product, it has nothing to do with the "Commerce Clause" and everything to do with international trade...

Marijuana is the number one cash crop in California and a number of other states. Quite a few people have little grow closets for themselves. Neither of those is international trade (necessarily).

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

Marijuana is the number one cash crop in California and a number of other states. Quite a few people have little grow closets for themselves. Neither of those is international trade (necessarily).

Marijuana is an imported agricultural product not native to North America...

[fr_freak]

Marijuana is an imported agricultural product not native to North America...

I'm getting the strangest feeling of deja-vu here.

Are you saying that the true test of whether the federal government has the authority to regulate an object is merely whether that object is native to the continent? Does this mean the federal government can regulate which Walmart products I buy?

The stuff is grown here. Sticking to a repeated mantra of "imported agricultural product...imported agricultural product" does not make it so.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

Like I said earlier, I think marijuana should be legalized, but stop trying to bullshiite me about it being some magic cure all...

I think those who use the crap are scum.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

I'm getting the strangest feeling of deja-vu here.

Put down the bong...

[fr_freak]

Like I said earlier, I think marijuana should be legalized, but stop trying to bullshiite me about it being some magic cure all...

I never said that it was a magic cure all. In fact, I have never bothered to argue the medical side of it at all, although I have absolutely no doubt that it has some legitimate medical uses, as well as legitimate industrial uses (and has for thousands of years). I also have no doubt that many of the proponents of medical marijuana are using that angle as an excuse to get the camel's nose of legalization under the tent. All of that is irrelevant to me. What is relevant to me is that the powers given to law enforcement and the actions of law enforcement that are tolerated by the public in the pursuit of the War on Drugs is a cure that is worse than the disease.

My position can be boiled down to a few main points:

1) Drug usage, to include alcohol, is unhealthy and should be discouraged. However, each adult must make these choices for himself.

2) The US Constitution does not grant the federal government the power to regulate drug usage. Twisting the Commerce Clause into a justification for the federal government to regulate what a person ingests or grows in his backyard is a blatant, Animal Farm-type corruption of the Constitution.

3) To the extent that state governments outlaw marijuana or other drugs (that, at least, would be constitutional), the US and state constitutions should still be in effect. That means no no-knock raids, no pre-conviction asset forfeitures, etc.

4) Outlawing drug use in a free society is a waste of time and energy. You simply cannot do it, because the level of control over the citizenry that would be required in order to enforce the ban adequately would require a virtual police state. A better answer would be to leave the local governments in charge of regulating it, in the way they regulate alcohol or tobacco usage/sale. For instance, a city or county could outlaw smoking marijuana in public areas, or being stoned in public, or displaying paraphernalia, etc., so as to maintain civil behavior.

5) Everything we need to know about drug prohibition, we should have learned from alcohol prohibition. How did that work out again?

[fr_freak]

Put down the bong...

Only after you put down the beer bottle, or the cigarette.

I made that deja-vu comment only after you repeated, for the 2nd or 3rd time, the meaningless mantra of non-native agricultural product. Given that this mantra was one of your key arguments, I'd say you have no business mocking the clarity of anyone else's thinking.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

I'd say you have no...

Don't really care what you say...

[fr_freak]

Don't really care what you say...

Of course you don't. Nor, do I imagine, do you care what you read, hear, or see. Your mind is made up.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

Your mind is made up.

I have said REPEATEDLY I think marijuana should be legalized, but that is not good enough for you a-holes...

The druggies, like the sex perverts, can only perpetuate an ever increasing market for their filth by molesting the minds and bodies of the young ones.

I think you are a villain.

[Smokin' Joe]

There’s been a lot of progress since then, including a synthetic pill form of the same ingredients of MJ. There is no reason to buy pot for “medicine”.

I know a guy who had chemo for non-Hodgkins Lymphoma who said the pills were not only no where near as effective as the plant, but at the time were 4-5 times as expensive.

Make of that what you will, but the guy owned his own oilfield business at the time, and finally sold it well after he was cured to finance a shop specializing in restoring cars. Not some wasted hippie by any standards.

[Smokin' Joe]

Marijuana is an imported agricultural product not native to North America...

By that standard, the FedGov should be regulating horses, too.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

By that standard, the FedGov should be regulating horses, too.

They already do for a number of reasons... Disease being the biggest of them.

Like I said REPEATEDLY, I think marijuana should be legalized, but that isn't good enough for you a-holes.

I also think pot heads are scum and have no use for them.

[TnGOP]

mary jane creates total wastrels where real people used to be

Don't forget,that means everyone who drinks is a drunken sot. Everyone who gambles in a casino is a gambling addict who ruins himself and family, and loses everything.

I'm soooo tired of all this rehashed '60's stuff. I know several people that smoke regularly, and have happy families, great jobs, and great outlooks on life. They are also conservatives, for the most part. Lumping everyone into stereotypes does no good, and convinces no one of anything, except not to listen to you.

[Smokin' Joe]

I think marijuana should be legalized, but that isn't good enough for you a-holes

"A-holes"?

I don't drink, smoke pot--or tobacco.

I work as a geologist on oil rigs where all on location are subject to random drug-tests.

Far fewer people have been maimed or killed since the pre-hire testing started.

I don't have time for stoners either, but I watched a friend lose 60 lbs trying to eat until he finally gave in and smoked grass and got his appetite back--the chemo made him that nauseous. His wife was thrilled that he lived, not to mention their three kids.

The pills were not getting the job done, and frankly, like so much patentable chemistry, are a mere shadow of the natural combinations of compounds found in the herb they are intended to mimic physiologically.

For this you call me an asshole?

I happen to think the planet would be better off without sanctimonious pusbags who ignore evidence that marijuana does indeed have medicinal uses because the more popular use is to get loaded.

As for generally legalizing it? No, I am not for it.

But I am dead set against waging war on people, the Fourth Amendment, and the Fifth Amendment, as well as against no-knock raids replete with military style CQB gear by keystone cops (especially at the wrong address), and the killing which has gone on, often in error, over a frigging weed.

[Sir Francis Dashwood]

As for generally legalizing it? No, I am not for it.

For this you call me an asshole?

Yep, just as I said...

---

I'm also tired of the double-talking platitutudes:

But I am dead set against waging war on people, the Fourth Amendment, and the Fifth Amendment, as well as against no-knock raids replete with military style CQB gear by keystone cops (especially at the wrong address), and the killing which has gone on, often in error, over a frigging weed.

Legalize it and shut the "f" up already! Stop trying to bullshiite me!

[Trailerpark Badass]

I think it should be legalized, but don't try to con me with that "medical" bullshiite.

I agree with you. There may be isolated cases where someone may believe that marijuana is helping them with some malady, but, by and large, the medical marijuana movement is a fraud.

Not saying that I think people shouldn't be able to decide on their own course of medical treatment, but as of now, most claims about medical marijuana are spurious at best.