Dual Citizenship - Barack Obama & Natural born status - John McCain

Law Library of Congress Public Services Division

[Lumper20]

Do you believe a child born to two US natural born citizens, one serving his country on an accompanied tour, delivered by a US Navy MD in a US military hospital, on a US Naval base would not pass the natural born test?

[RegulatorCountry]

It doesn’t matter what I believe. The Senate clearly didn’t see it as a sure thing, otherwise that error-riddled Resolution 511 would never have been put up for a vote. There is now at least one suit in the Supreme Court alleging that three candidates on the NJ ballot were unqualified under the Constitution, one of whom is John McCain. I hope the matter finds a just resolution.

[BonRad]

or poster 8, its the Indonesian q: http://texasdarlin.wordpress.com/2008/07/29/the-paper-trail-obamas-indonesian-background/

very lately put well enough w/ the “Rathergate II” art on WND:

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=81943

I am with Donofrio on McCain as well. I’m patriotic and hold JM in high esteem for his service, but
the rules are the rules. Goldwater shouldn’t have been allowed as he was born in the Arizona Republic. That he lost held off the need for definition. This CRISIS has been coming for a long, long time...ever since potential mothers began to travel regularly in governmental service or escorting spouses in such....to be short.

[FreedBird]

Those who served and died for this country did it to preserve our Constitution. The MSM and Elected Officials are now looking the other way on the Birth Certificate issue. It seems as if someone is trying to cover-up something by not releasing the original Birth Certificate in the long form.

[Mariebl]

No mention that Obama’s mother was not old enough at the time of his birth to bestow citizenship upon him.

I'm very baffled by the idea that so many people here, on a supposedly conservative forum, are convinced that the legislature had the ability to rewrite the Constitution in such a nit-picky way. Pure wishful thinking, it seems to me. Original intent, anyone? Anyone really think that when the Framers of the Constitution wrote 'natural-born', they were thinking that an American-born mother who was 18 could not confer natural-born status on her child, but an American-born mother who was 19, could?

[YellowRoseofTx]

BHO has never served a damn day in our nation’s miliary.

And further, I read something here in FR not long ago that BHO didn't even register for Selective Service until 2007.

[streetpreacher]

This should put an end to all of this unwarranted speculation:

[so_real]

Actually ... if you consider original intent ... an American born woman with a husband, or sperm donor, of foreign nationality could not have a “natural born” child at all. Rules were changed to politically permit “anchor babies”. I, personally, don’t believe they should have. Either way, however, Obama is ineligible. Though I don’t agree, I am willing to except the law. Again, either way, Obama is ineligible.

[Lumper20]

I do not know the date he registered, but; a retired Federal agent found that document to be highly suspect,too.

[Lumper20]

Thanks. It was always understood, I thought, that “dependents” of US military AKA “brats” were natural born. We shall see. Excuse me for thinking this. I guess we need SCOTUS to define things.

[Yaelle]

And how does that person, that librarian of Congress, know that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii? How would anyone know that fact? It’s probably true, but should we not know it upon the basis of actual documentation?

[YellowRoseofTx]

a retired Federal agent found that document to be highly suspect,too.

I remember that also. It is thought to be a forgery like the infamous BC that was posted.

[ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas]

>>I believe the lower court in the Berg case ruled that it was Congress’s responsibility to implement a vetting process if they wanted one.<<

That’s like saying that it’s a driver’s responsibility to stop for a red light if he wants to.

[DannyTN]

"That’s like saying that it’s a driver’s responsibility to stop for a red light if he wants to."

It is. It's like having a law that has no proscribed penalty. If there is no penalty, you can break it with impunity.

Since congress has neglected to implement a process to insure compliance with the constitution, it falls to the court to intervene. But the correct long term solution is for congress and state legislatures to legislate a preventive process.

[Technical Editor]

The statement you got in e-mail is WRONG. The United States does indeed recognize dual citizenship. That person needs a good talking-to!

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1753.html

Dual Nationality

The concept of dual nationality means that a person is a citizen of two countries at the same time. Each country has its own citizenship laws based on its own policy.Persons may have dual nationality by automatic operation of different laws rather than by choice. For example, a child born in a foreign country to U.S. citizen parents may be both a U.S. citizen and a citizen of the country of birth.

A U.S. citizen may acquire foreign citizenship by marriage, or a person naturalized as a U.S. citizen may not lose the citizenship of the country of birth.U.S. law does not mention dual nationality or require a person to choose one citizenship or another. Also, a person who is automatically granted another citizenship does not risk losing U.S. citizenship. However, a person who acquires a foreign citizenship by applying for it may lose U.S. citizenship. In order to lose U.S. citizenship, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship.

Intent can be shown by the person’s statements or conduct.The U.S. Government recognizes that dual nationality exists but does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. Claims of other countries on dual national U.S. citizens may conflict with U.S. law, and dual nationality may limit U.S. Government efforts to assist citizens abroad. The country where a dual national is located generally has a stronger claim to that person’s allegiance.

However, dual nationals owe allegiance to both the United States and the foreign country. They are required to obey the laws of both countries. Either country has the right to enforce its laws, particularly if the person later travels there.Most U.S. citizens, including dual nationals, must use a U.S. passport to enter and leave the United States. Dual nationals may also be required by the foreign country to use its passport to enter and leave that country. Use of the foreign passport does not endanger U.S. citizenship.Most countries permit a person to renounce or otherwise lose citizenship.

Information on losing foreign citizenship can be obtained from the foreign country’s embassy and consulates in the United States. Americans can renounce U.S. citizenship in the proper form at U.S. embassies and consulates abroad.

[Technical Editor]

And here’s more:

http://www.usimmigrationsupport.org/dual_citizenship.html

[Technical Editor]

The Supreme Court really needs to rule on whether dual citizenship of the sort that existed in Obama’s case was recognized by the United States at the time of his birth.

That is the outstanding question that I have.

[Technical Editor]

I did read on a non-government site something about how the U.S. recognition of dual citizenship had changed in the last ten years, so perhaps in 1961, it wasn’t recognized. But it’s hard to believe that Osama Sr. would have been prevented from exercising his parental right to take the child to Kenya if he so chose. In that case, I cannot believe the U.S. would have prevented him and said it was because Osama Sr. did not give UK allegiance to his son at birth.

Here’s the site: http://www.uscitizenship.info/citizenship-library-dual.htm

And here’s the text:

4. I heard that the US and Canada don’t allow Dual Citizenship. Is this true?

This is incorrect. Both the US and Canada now allow their citizens to hold multiple citizenships. Most references to the contrary are out of date since this has been resolved for at least ten years in the case of the United States and over twenty in the case of Canada. Note that the respective governments often couch dual citizenship in negative terms as few governments like to lose control over their citizens.

---

So, according to my lights, the distilled question can be stated this way:

In 1961, would the United States government consider a child born in Hawaii of an American mother and a UK subject to have dual citizenship?

---

What might be helpful to the cause is if a lot of people were to pose this question to their local office of the State Department in their respective cities. I’m in Boston, so I can do it here.

What do you all think? Where are you located? Are you willing to pose this question — in writing or in person — in order to further the effort to arrive at an understanding of the true circumstances of Obama’s citizenship?

Let’s do it! Or do you see a flaw in my “magic question”?

[Fred Nerks]

just ran across this from November 2008, did we see this?

It is not the job of the Legislative branch (Congress), the Executive Branch (President and the administrative agencies), or the Judicial Branch (Courts) to vet political candidates. It is the job of the Republican National Committee (RNC), the Democratic National Committee (DNC), and other party organizations to vet the candidates that represent their parties. None of these committees are government affiliated organizations; they are private.