[nathanbedford]

You touch on a great schism in the Western Christian Church. My roots are in the Reformed Protestant church which has deep Calvinist roots and which, therefore, was for a long historical span taken a up with the doctrine of predestination. I'm not interested in arguing the pros and cons of the doctrine but, because this is after all essentially a political forum as I pointed out in my last post, it is worthy of consideration to the degree which the doctor affects political behavior.

A political scientist might ask: why should a Calvinist struggle against evil if the issue is predetermined? You come close to this question in your remarks:

Faith can (and I think must) inform our political activities, but it should never be, as it is so often in the West, completely detached from those political activities; or far worse, that religion should be distorted and used by politics for its own cynical ends. To tell you the truth, I have always been mystified by the mixture of religion and politics here, whether on the right or the left. I suppose that as an Orthodox Christian I have less confidence that politics can effect the world for good than that the metanoia we are told we will experience will transform a bit of the world around us into its original created state.

Clearly, we all see the interplay between faith and reason, the question is which one animates in a given situation. How do we overcome the dilemma posed by Calvin? I gather from your post that you are at least not brought up in America and will not immediately recognize the allusion I make to Robert E. Lee who, when questioned whether the Confederacy might win the war between the states replied: "we shall win if every man does his whole duty, and it be God's will." I have heard a minister say "you should pray as though the outcome were entirely in God's hands but work as though the outcome is entirely up to you."

The West has never been noted for its mysticism but for its empiricism.

These simplistic bridges we use to overcome the gap created for us because Calvin is so stubborn become less intellectually inconsistent and more practically useful as we age.

[Kolokotronis]

“I gather from your post that you are at least not brought up in America and will not immediately recognize the allusion I make to Robert E. Lee....”

Actually, I was both born and brought up here.

“The West has never been noted for its mysticism but for its empiricism.”

Well, with that I can heartily agree!

“These simplistic bridges we use to overcome the gap created for us because Calvin is so stubborn become less intellectually inconsistent and more practically useful as we age.”

Aging does have its advantages!

[kosta50]

[Herr nathanbedford to Kolo:] I gather from your post that you are at least not brought up in America and will not immediately recognize the allusion I make to Robert E. Lee

LOL! Kolo, how do you manage to get such rap? I can't think of too many Americans I know who trace their ancestry to "The Mayflower" and are constantly asked to show their "green card!" :) How many generations does it take?/sar/