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To: Norman Bates
I'm pro-life, so I don't accept being marginalized into the pro-choice camp just because I'm not a believer.

I'm not accusing you of doing this. My point is only that I can debate with the best of the pro-abortion racketeers, and am able to give reasons for why I oppose it based on my point of view, and none of those reasons involve religion.

The pro-life community would do well to utilize the pro-life beliefs of non-believers, as you'll need all the help you can get considering who is in charge now. We'll be right there beside you ready to storm the gates when they pass FOCA and other obamanations.

With respect to Passover, I would assume that if a loving creator existed, he would treat all children equally, and not hold them accountable for the evils of their parents or their society. The little boys and girls of Egypt did not commit any injustice against the Jews, yet I'm supposed to accept their slaughter as a moral act? I say NO, NO, NO!

Let me ask another question. Would it have been moral for Joshua to defy the orders given to him at Jericho?

I would have told God that I am NOT going to slaughter innocent men, women, and children. If he's going to damn my soul, then so be it. I would have told God to take his genocide and shove it. Get some other credulous fool to perform your murders; I won't be a part of it.

I’d say an honest atheist would admit there is certainly much worldly wisdom in the Bible. Even putting aside that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, he was also simply the most remarkable and influential man in history.

No, I agree with this to a certain extent. I draw inspiration from Ben Franklin:

"As to Jesus of Nazareth, my Opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the System of Morals and his Religion, as he left them to us, the best the world ever saw or is likely to see; but I apprehend it has received various corrupt changes, and I have, with most of the present Dissenters in England, some Doubts as to his divinity; tho' it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and I think it needless to busy myself with it now, when I expect soon an Opportunity of knowing the Truth with less Trouble."

Strict atheism is a bad bet. I personally think it’s silly to be anything beyond agnostic.

I do not refer to myself as an atheist. The only label I accept is secularist, because it deals strictly with how to deal with religion in government and public society. I think that agnosticism, pantheism, deism, and atheism all have beneficial aspects that I variously draw on. I didn't leave the Christian faith just so that I could immediately join some other collective group. My ideals are not wholly dependent on the agendas or creeds of any one philosophy.

One more thing: there is a certain unhelpful stubborness in your refusal to capitalize the name of God. From your viewpoint, do you by any chance decapitalize names in a fictional novel when you discuss them? Try. It makes the conversation just a little more open on multiple levels.

You are absolutely correct here. I frequently discuss theology and the nature and particulars of various gods, goddesses, divinities, etc. I try to keep the capitalization straight, but also frequently freep from my Blackberry, where grammar is a little more difficult to keep straight. When referring to God as a proper name, I will make sure that I capitalize, just as I would for Thor, Athena, or Yahweh. I will not capitalize pronouns of the deities into Him, He, or His, since I believe that this is a practice that grammar only demands of believers.

I will try to be correct in the future, but I do so in the interest in good grammar and not divine instruction.

141 posted on 01/18/2009 4:39:22 PM PST by GunRunner
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To: GunRunner

Well I appreciate your concessions. Thank you.

Would you say that when a man brings dishonor upon himself he also brings it in come way upon his family which includes his children? I would say so.

God calls people away from this world all the time. When it is your time, it is your time. I have said God’s plans are inscrutable and that it true. But perhaps that was his way of punishing the Egyptians and also saving those children from becoming the terrible monsters they may have turned out to be. But that alone is known to God.

When you say you are a secularist explain to me if that includes forcibly removing God, religion, or any mention thereof except from behind closed home and church doors.


142 posted on 01/19/2009 8:35:59 AM PST by Norman Bates (Steele for RNC)
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