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To: Billthedrill
Does Rand think, then, that masochism is an integral part of female sexuality? Actually, yes, she does.

This is the chapter where Rand begins to lose me. IMHO, here is where AS begins to read like a smutty romance novel. I'm trying to be fair here: And, in all fairness, Rand was writing at a time when it was common/acceptable for Hollywood to portray men slapping women and vice-versa onscreen. Rand does make her character, Dagny, strong only in that she does not cry nor wince when she has been given a bloody lip. But, the fact that she enjoys having caused a strong reaction from Francisco isn't a sign of strength, as Rand seems to believe; it's a sign of weakness because she is measuring her self-worth by the emotional reaction she receives from him. That she doesn't strike back and, the next summer, begins a sexual relationship with him could be explained away as a youthful indiscretion and gullibility. But, as we see later, Rand does not see a need to excuse Dagny's behavior or thinking; rather, she tries to justify it as superior. I don't want to spoil the story, so I'll stop right there. More in later chapters...

138 posted on 02/14/2009 11:49:10 PM PST by Tired of Taxes (Dad, I will always think of you.)
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To: Tired of Taxes
This is the chapter where Rand begins to lose me. IMHO, here is where AS begins to read like a smutty romance novel. I'm trying to be fair here: And, in all fairness, Rand was writing at a time when it was common/acceptable for Hollywood to portray men slapping women and vice-versa onscreen. Rand does make her character, Dagny, strong only in that she does not cry nor wince when she has been given a bloody lip. But, the fact that she enjoys having caused a strong reaction from Francisco isn't a sign of strength, as Rand seems to believe; it's a sign of weakness because she is measuring her self-worth by the emotional reaction she receives from him

I get an entirely different reaction to this scene. I believe they are equals and Francisco's reaction to her statement was guttural. Dagny's reaction was one of pride. Pride that he felt she was better than that and felt so passionately about that, he reacted with force. He literally slapped her out of her slip into passivity.

146 posted on 02/15/2009 6:39:13 AM PST by tndarlin
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To: Tired of Taxes
Just a quick observation re:

And, in all fairness, Rand was writing at a time when it was common/acceptable for...

If you watch the Rand/Wallace video posted at the beginning of this thread, the contrast of the era is quite evident. In my opinion Wallace is a product of the popular culture of the time w/cigarette constantly in hand and stereotype questions. Rand, on the other hand seems to be ,well, timeless. I mean that this interview if it was held today would be conducted differently by the interviewer but Rands answers would not have changed.

(Thanks for the posted video links ISee)

153 posted on 02/15/2009 7:33:02 AM PST by whodathunkit (Shrugging as I leave for the Gulch)
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