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Canadian Health Care We So Envy Lies In Ruins, Its Architect Admits (crushed in only 40 years!)
IBD editorials ^ | 6/25/08 | DAVID GRATZER

Posted on 06/18/2009 7:48:10 PM PDT by Libloather

Canadian Health Care We So Envy Lies In Ruins, Its Architect Admits
By DAVID GRATZER
Posted Wednesday, June 25, 2008 4:30 PM PT

As this presidential campaign continues, the candidates' comments about health care will continue to include stories of their own experiences and anecdotes of people across the country: the uninsured woman in Ohio, the diabetic in Detroit, the overworked doctor in Orlando, to name a few.

But no one will mention Claude Castonguay — perhaps not surprising because this statesman isn't an American and hasn't held office in over three decades.

Castonguay's evolving view of Canadian health care, however, should weigh heavily on how the candidates think about the issue in this country.

Back in the 1960s, Castonguay chaired a Canadian government committee studying health reform and recommended that his home province of Quebec — then the largest and most affluent in the country — adopt government-administered health care, covering all citizens through tax levies.

The government followed his advice, leading to his modern-day moniker: "the father of Quebec medicare." Even this title seems modest; Castonguay's work triggered a domino effect across the country, until eventually his ideas were implemented from coast to coast.

Four decades later, as the chairman of a government committee reviewing Quebec health care this year, Castonguay concluded that the system is in "crisis."

"We thought we could resolve the system's problems by rationing services or injecting massive amounts of new money into it," says Castonguay. But now he prescribes a radical overhaul: "We are proposing to give a greater role to the private sector so that people can exercise freedom of choice."

Castonguay advocates contracting out services to the private sector, going so far as suggesting that public hospitals rent space during off-hours to entrepreneurial doctors.

(Excerpt) Read more at ibdeditorials.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Editorial; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: bhohealthcare; canada; canadian; care; castonguay; health; healthcare; hussein; obamacare; socializedmedicine
Castonguay, the man who championed public health insurance in Canada, now urges for the legalization of private health insurance.

That's a really sad situation.

From a blog -

It will be interesting to see if, or how, American Liberals and Progressives talk about this issue and if they do, how they will either dismiss the above story or arrogantly proclaim that "they can do a better job."

To what country do kings, queen, royalty, celebrities and heads of state travel to, to receive medical treatment? Do they seek treatment in Canada, Cuba, the U.K.? Or do they travel to the United States? In what country did Ted Kennedy receive treatment for his tumor?

Do yourself a huge favor and read the entire IBD story. Become informed on the myriad of downsides and problems associated with socialized healthcare. Don't let the Democrats pull the wool over your eyes. The United States has the best healthcare system in the world. Does it need some reform? Yes it does. Does it need to be "socialized"? No, not now, not ever.

http://mrssatan.blogspot.com/2008/06/canadas-healthcare-in-ruins.html

1 posted on 06/18/2009 7:48:11 PM PDT by Libloather
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To: fanfan

Ping.


2 posted on 06/18/2009 7:51:11 PM PDT by Army Air Corps (Four fried chickens and a coke)
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To: Libloather

Just contracting out services to the private sector won’t work. The key to the efficiencies achieved by private enterprise is market pricing. As long as the government is setting prices nothing will change.


3 posted on 06/18/2009 7:55:08 PM PDT by SeeSharp
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To: Libloather

“We thought we could resolve the system’s problems by rationing services or injecting massive amounts of new money into it,” says Castonguay. But now he prescribes a radical overhaul: “We are proposing to give a greater role to the private sector so that people can exercise freedom of choice.”

what a freeking concept!


4 posted on 06/18/2009 7:55:14 PM PDT by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: Army Air Corps

Think about it: a lottery decides when you get a physicians’ visit.


5 posted on 06/18/2009 7:55:21 PM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Libloather

Great article!!

Everyone in America should read it.

Notice how we never hear ANY success stories of socialized medicine? NONE!


6 posted on 06/18/2009 7:56:56 PM PDT by KoRn (Department of Homeland Security, Certified - "Right Wing Extremist")
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To: Libloather

Obama was talking about how socialized medicine had succeeded in “some nations” yet when Robert Gibbs was asked to NAME one of those nations, he couldn’t. But he was sure that “they” (the people of that mythical country) were happy with their health care.


7 posted on 06/18/2009 7:59:34 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Socialism is the belief that most people are better off if everyone was equally poor and miserable.)
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To: mylife

Socialism, in every form, has totally and utterly failed every where and every time it has been tried, yet the Moron In Chief is sure that it will succeed here because HE is in charge.

But then, I guess you have to define success. If you set out to destroy the US and bring us down to turd world status, socialism is a roaring success. Just look at Cuba.


8 posted on 06/18/2009 8:03:32 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Socialism is the belief that most people are better off if everyone was equally poor and miserable.)
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To: Libloather

ping


9 posted on 06/18/2009 8:03:51 PM PDT by Beowulf9
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To: Blood of Tyrants

Socialism and Communism look good when you are a party leader,eating caviar.

They dont look so good when you are one of the masses fighting over a rotten potato.


10 posted on 06/18/2009 8:06:42 PM PDT by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

Everyone associated with the president is a fool or a dork.


11 posted on 06/18/2009 8:13:45 PM PDT by Marysecretary (GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL!)
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To: Libloather

Everyone seems to miss the point.

“Health care reform” has nothing what so ever to do with health care reform.

It is all about seizing more vast power over our lives, down to the tiniest aspect of our enslaved existence.


12 posted on 06/18/2009 8:18:43 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (When the past no longer illuminates the future, the spirit walks in darkness.)
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To: mylife

I heard someone (maybe Rush) mention in jest that the media was fawning over how physically fit and trim the zeros were and maybe they should write a diet book and call it “The Obama Diet”. It would begin like this: “Have your government paid private chef prepare two $125/lb imported Japanese steaks....”


13 posted on 06/18/2009 8:22:32 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Socialism is the belief that most people are better off if everyone was equally poor and miserable.)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

Not only that, those who now have sugar plum visions of nationalized health care dancing in their heads also probably figure more state and national lotteries would help FINANCE their Big Plan.


14 posted on 06/18/2009 8:25:36 PM PDT by supremedoctrine ( YOUR AD IN THIS SPACE)
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To: Marysecretary

I wish it were so. I personally believe that know exactly what they are doing and are traitors.


15 posted on 06/18/2009 8:27:01 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Socialism is the belief that most people are better off if everyone was equally poor and miserable.)
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To: SeeSharp

Just as with Chrysler, govt will determine not only price, but which and how many doctors will be included in approved ‘provider groups’. Large numbers of solo and small group doctors will be excluded and access to the number of MDs accessed now will be reduced.


16 posted on 06/18/2009 8:30:34 PM PDT by givemELL (Does Taiwan Meet the Criteria to Qualify as an "Overseas Territory of the United States"? by Richar)
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To: Libloather
I think this is fairly hugh and series - our next door neighbor did exactly what Obama is shoving through, and is now admitting fundamental structural defects that led to the failure of the model. Since, oh I don't know, a trillion of so dollars and the lives of a third of a billion people are at stake (not to mention the last remnants of the Constitution), it seems this situation in Canada should merit just a little bit more attention than it's getting - especially right now.
17 posted on 06/18/2009 8:33:17 PM PDT by Talisker (When you find a turtle on top of a fence post, you can be damn sure it didn't get there on it's own.)
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To: Libloather

40 years... Obama will be in his 10’th term when our new system is that old.


18 posted on 06/18/2009 8:33:33 PM PDT by Cementjungle
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To: Blood of Tyrants

Ah yes...Boureugois Beef.


19 posted on 06/18/2009 8:34:35 PM PDT by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: SeeSharp

I had some surgery once and commented to the doc “That sure is expensive! But I would also hate to see your insurance bills.”

He replied that is one problem, but more so was that he can only charge a little to many of his patients. I’m not sure if it was rates dictated by insurance, if he was compelled by law to still treat them even if they couldn’t pay much, or if he was personally motivated to help them without charging more - although what he said next seemed that it was forced: “Whoever tells you we don’t already have socialized medicine - don’t believe them.”


20 posted on 06/18/2009 8:41:54 PM PDT by 21twelve (Drive Reality out with a pitchfork if you want , it always comes back.)
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To: mylife

Lazy fair capitalism looks good when you’re an overpaid executive. It don’t look so good to the working man, sometimes.

parsy, who thinks things need changing.


21 posted on 06/18/2009 8:43:46 PM PDT by parsifal ("Knock and ye shall receive!" (The Bible, somewhere.))
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To: parsifal

eggzackly


22 posted on 06/18/2009 8:45:18 PM PDT by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

My sister lived in Amsterdam in the late 1970s and had both her babies there. She said it cost her nothing and she even got home visits from a nurse to make sure everything was ok.

However, Holland at that time wasn’t overrun with illegal immigrants and I believe they’ve since caused problems for the system. My sister’s father in law has a very nice retirement courtesy of the government - better than you’ll get here for sure. But Holland isn’t spending money all over the world the way we are....i.e 900 million for Palestine, 8 billion or something for ACORN...etc. etc.etc.


23 posted on 06/18/2009 8:46:15 PM PDT by Aria ( "The US republic will endure until Congress discovers it can bribe the public with the people's $.")
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To: Aria

As long as Holland can maintain it’s cultural identity and not get watered down with Muslim immigrants, it will probably do okay. But unfortunately for Holland as with most European countries, the death rate exceeds the birth rate. It is only a matter of time before they extinguish themselves through birth control and abortion on demand.


24 posted on 06/18/2009 8:52:10 PM PDT by Blood of Tyrants (Socialism is the belief that most people are better off if everyone was equally poor and miserable.)
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To: Aria
One of my best friends is Dutch, when her mother became sick, she could not get the care she needed because she was elderly. The system ignored her. They couldn't even buy care for her in Holland. The went over planning to take her to Germany where they could pay for her care but she died before they could get her there.

She had been declining for 5 years or more because of the “fabulous” Dutch healthcare system. sarcasm///>

25 posted on 06/18/2009 8:54:09 PM PDT by Ditter
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To: Blood of Tyrants

You are right.


26 posted on 06/18/2009 8:56:04 PM PDT by Aria ( "The US republic will endure until Congress discovers it can bribe the public with the people's $.")
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To: Ditter

I do think their system has changed for the worse. I’m going to ask my sister about your comment. Just disgusting that the state decides when one is expendable.

This story will be happening here if Obama gets his way. In fact, I know it’s happened in Oregon - a woman was told by the State that she couldn’t have anti-cancer drugs but that the State would pay for suicide drugs.


27 posted on 06/18/2009 9:00:19 PM PDT by Aria ( "The US republic will endure until Congress discovers it can bribe the public with the people's $.")
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To: Libloather

Our health czar won’t read negative news stories - so we’re doomed to repeat... I mean we can follow in the illustrious footsteps of Canada...


28 posted on 06/18/2009 9:02:09 PM PDT by GOPJ (...those who make non-violent revolution impossible make violent revolution inevitable.- JFK (Iran))
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To: SeeSharp
Good points, but it should be noted that there will never be such a thing as "market pricing" as long as health care is delivered directly to patients but financed by third-party entities. It really doesn't matter whether the "third party" in question is a government or an insurance company.

Under this type of an arrangement you're always dealing with: (1) a patient who doesn't care about the cost of the service because he's not paying it; and (2) a third-party entity that doesn't care about the quality of the service because it's not directly affected by it.

29 posted on 06/18/2009 9:02:19 PM PDT by Alberta's Child (God is great . . . beer is good . . . and people are crazy.)
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To: Alberta's Child

It’s so easy to reform the American system. Just charge $10 per visit for medicaid participants. That’s just a pack of smokes and a 40 ounce beer. It will eliminate 90% of the deadbeats who inhabit the average ER. Problem solved.


30 posted on 06/18/2009 9:30:05 PM PDT by boop (Democracy is the theory that the people get the government they deserve, good and hard.)
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To: boop

Socialized medicine and universal healthcare are pipedreams only Koolaid drinkers have. They are completely unrealiztic and so prohibitively expensive whixh is why you see Canada and Europe in shambles economically socially and financially. Socialist systems are doomed to failure. History proves it.


31 posted on 06/18/2009 9:33:16 PM PDT by Ev Reeman
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To: Ev Reeman

The elite class feeds the manager class that feeds the working class that feeds the sit on my ass class. It is doomed to failure as the sit on my ass class gains more power.


32 posted on 06/18/2009 9:38:18 PM PDT by eyedigress
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To: Libloather

Great.... Obama should bring this man to the White House for advice. Of course this will never happen because “free health care” is a Democrat power grab


33 posted on 06/18/2009 9:59:52 PM PDT by dennisw ("stealth tribal warfare" is what the Sotomayor nomination is about)
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To: Army Air Corps; Clive; exg; kanawa; backhoe; -YYZ-; Former Proud Canadian; Squawk 8888; ...
Thanks for the ping, AAC.


34 posted on 06/19/2009 4:30:58 AM PDT by fanfan (Why did they bury Barry's past?)
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To: dennisw; Liz; AT7Saluki; writer33
Great.... Obama should bring this man to the White House for advice.

Or - the Republicans can use him as evidence...

35 posted on 06/19/2009 5:21:19 AM PDT by Libloather (Tea Totaler)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Think about it: a lottery decides when you get a physicians’ visit.

Norwalk, Ontario is not in Canada . It's in Ohio.

This is an old article and today , Gratzer is still a paid mouth piece , repeating the same old antidotes.

36 posted on 06/19/2009 6:14:25 AM PDT by Snowyman
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To: parsifal
Lazy fair capitalism looks good when you’re an overpaid executive. It don’t look so good to the working man, sometimes.

We don't really have much left of laissez-faire capitalism anymore. If we simply eliminated double-taxation of dividends, so corporations weren't taxed on dividends,there'd be strong pressure to increase dividend payouts and that would reduce the overpayment of executives. Right now, it's expensive (because of taxes) to pass cash to the stockholders, so the the corporate boards feel free to overpay in an attempt to buy growth.

With this socialist intrusion (income tax), we are approaching the same class structure as the USSR. The nomenklatura (business bosses, political bosses) get all the money and stature. The fight between R and D is just between which part of the nomenklatura gets the biggest chunk.

Name someplace else where it looks better for the working man. And be sure to compare contrasts rights and freedom against private vs public payment for medical care.

37 posted on 06/19/2009 6:19:29 AM PDT by slowhandluke (It's hard work to be cynical enough in this age)
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To: Blood of Tyrants

Yes, that too.


38 posted on 06/19/2009 2:46:10 PM PDT by Marysecretary (GOD IS STILL IN CONTROL!)
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To: slowhandluke

Europe.

parsy, who is thinking of becoming a cheese eating surrender monkey.


39 posted on 06/19/2009 3:03:15 PM PDT by parsifal ("Knock and ye shall receive!" (The Bible, somewhere.))
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To: parsifal
Lazy fair capitalism looks good when you’re an overpaid executive. It don’t look so good to the working man, sometimes.

Gee I wonder who gave that "working man" his job? You don't suppose it was some eeevil capitalist do you?

40 posted on 08/08/2009 5:05:15 PM PDT by hinckley buzzard
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To: Libloather
But now he prescribes a radical overhaul: "We are proposing to give a greater role to the private sector so that people can exercise freedom of choice."

Common sense bump

41 posted on 08/08/2009 5:08:10 PM PDT by Principled (Get the capital back! NRST!)
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To: Snowyman
Norwalk, Ontario is not in Canada . It's in Ohio.

Little bit confused are we? Maybe you should see a gubbermint psychiatrist and get your head clear.

42 posted on 08/08/2009 5:08:47 PM PDT by hinckley buzzard
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To: Libloather

Think of all the people who paid for this clown’s narcissism with their lives...I hope he a Robert McNamara get to spend eternity together...


43 posted on 08/08/2009 5:13:02 PM PDT by mo
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To: mo

.I hope he AND Robert McNamara....


44 posted on 08/08/2009 5:13:25 PM PDT by mo
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To: hinckley buzzard

I have recently learned a better term —Anarcho-capitalism.

And yes, while capitalism provides more and better jobs than alternatives, the reality is that one’s attachment to it as a a system can be broken when it is perceived to be overtly unfair or that the game is rigged.

parsy, who is learning new words all the time.


45 posted on 08/08/2009 5:14:52 PM PDT by parsifal ("Where am I? How did I end up in this hospital room? What is my name?" Anonymous)
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To: KoRn

There is a reason for that....there aren’t ANY! Don’t stop fighting people do not let them decide who lives and who dies.


46 posted on 08/08/2009 6:49:21 PM PDT by chris_bdba
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To: Marysecretary

“Everyone associated with the president is a fool”

That makes him the King of the fools literally!


47 posted on 08/08/2009 6:52:22 PM PDT by chris_bdba
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To: hinckley buzzard
Little bit confused are we?

Only in that Norwalk is in Ohio and apparently Norwalk, Ontario is in Wisconsin USA .

Maybe you should talk to Gratzer . You could help him with his geography. He , your spelling.

48 posted on 08/09/2009 9:11:02 AM PDT by Snowyman
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To: parsifal
And yes, while capitalism provides more and better jobs than alternatives, the reality is that one’s attachment to it as a a system can be broken when it is perceived to be overtly unfair or that the game is rigged.

But only if you don't bother to carry the thought out far enough to consider that socialist and communist systems are far more certain to be overtly unfair and rigged to the core than capitalism. After-all their whole reason for being is to socially engineer the outcome.

49 posted on 08/10/2009 10:58:33 AM PDT by Red Boots
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To: Red Boots

When people get p*ssed, they don’t give a hoot sometimes. Thats what the American Revolution was about. We left the ambit of England, which was a pretty free and liberal nation at the time because we were p*ssed. We jumped into a system that had never really been tried before.

When a nation becomes too heavily imbalanced between the haves and the has less you risk the same thing. Jumping out of a frying pan into a fire happens all the time.

Better to have some social justice than risk the alternative, IMHO.

parsy, who is happier if his neighbors ain’t starving, cause he don’t have to worry as much about his house.


50 posted on 08/10/2009 12:36:53 PM PDT by parsifal ("Where am I? How did I end up in this hospital room? What is my name?" Anonymous)
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