Replies

This will be my final post to you because I sense by discernment that you are serving the father of lies, as your effort to purposely dissemble what I wrote attests.

You can post as much as you like, I am not stopping you. My purpose in posting is to engage in a discussion/reason, not to attack people as in what you are doing.

Having said that... let's see what we have based on your response....

Here is the entire sentence, then what you tried to lift out of context in order to mischaracterize the message:

My actual sentence: "With this question as a foundation for trying to make claims to tolerate the degenerate so long as they are resisting temptation, you reveal the twisted nature of your own thinking!"

Again, I fail to see where I have misunderstood or twisted what you said. I very clearly said that I DO NOT TOLERATE ANY DEGENERATE ACTIONS BE THEY THE RESULT OF LUST AFTER PERSONS OF ONE OWN SEX OR THE OPPOSITE. You obviously ignored what I said in order to indulge in some fantasy ideas of your own.

Let's continue...

Your plea is specious in that aspect of your twisting the issue to tolerate the unregenerate as leaders so long as they are not caught acting upon the lusts of their unregenerate soul.

Nope, do not misunderstand me... I did not say " so long as they are not caught acting upon the lusts of their unregenerate soul.". I said AS LONG AS THEY DO NOT ACT ON THEIR LUST OR TEMPTATION REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THEY ARE CAUGHT OR NOT.

Let me be clear about this --- character is who you are when no one is watching -- I believe this. You SIN when you ACT on your lust regardless of whether people know it or not. Having said that, I again re-iterate --- everyone, you and me and clergymen included are tempted by lust all the time. This lust come in various forms -- it can be lust after things, power, or men and women of the same or opposite sex outside marriage. Therefore, I re-iterate that because such temptation is common to us all, to disqualify a celibate and abstinent clergyman simply because he is tempted by lust ( regardless of its nature ) is to ascribe to oneself the power of omniscience. You cannot know the innermost inclinations of a person, you can only know it when he ACTS. A clergyman can only be disqualifed from serving when he ACTS on his lust.

Therefore, I submit that a policy that ostracizes a person who is tempted by lust for people of the same sex ( without acting on it ) without considering that there are those who are tempted by lust for people of the opposite sex is one sided and willfully blind.

Hence, a policy that says -- we recognize temptations in all forms. We do not disqualify qualifed men who are tempted from the clergy as long as they do not succumb to their respective temptations -- is a most reasonable one.

Let me be clear about this --- character is who you are when no one is watching -- I believe this. You SIN when you ACT on your lust regardless of whether people know it or not.

You are still confusing sin with temptation.

Remember the words of Jesus:

Matthew 5:28
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Therefore, sin is not just the action, but the sinful desire of the heart. It is the LUST that defines the sin, not just the looking(or physical action) at another person because of the LUST.

This is what MHGinTN has been trying to communicate to you.

Christ came to not just forgive men/women of their sins, but to give them power over their sins.

Furthermore, the last thing a regenerated sinner, be it a Homosexual or serial adulterer or anyone suffering from any other type of sin is going to do, is refer to themselves as a Homosexual, Serial Adulterer, or whatever the sin is. Because each of those labels imply an active condition which goes counter to the message of the Gospel of being free from your sin.

For as the Apostle Paul stated:

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Temptation is from the outside, not the inside.

Jesus said "Be ye holy as I am holy"

He did not say "Try to be holy". He did not say "You will not be holy until you pass over in death".

He commanded "Be ye holy as I am holy". A positive immediate command with no sub-clauses.