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To: Seizethecarp
Obama has a COLB from HI which meets the federal rules of evidence as being "self-authenticating".

Does he?

I know of no one not firmly in the 0bama camp or with even the slightest clue how to determine authenticity of a birth certificate who even claims to have actually seen the alleged document.

OTOH millions of people have seen an image of the alleged document on the internet.

It's on the internet, it must be true...

58 posted on 12/15/2009 10:26:59 AM PST by null and void (We are now in day 328 of our national holiday from reality. - 0bama really isn't one of US.)
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To: null and void
“I know of no one not firmly in the 0bama camp or with even the slightest clue how to determine authenticity of a birth certificate who even claims to have actually seen the alleged document.”

Fine.

As far as I am concerned, without a court hearing I cannot be certain that the public COLB is authentic or not.

The COLB has not been submitted for independent forensic analysis. Claims that the COLB is fake or altered are interesting but not legally meaningful out of court.

Let me be more precise. Obama’s campaign claims that they have a COLB which, if genuine, would be “self-authenticating” under the federal rules of evidence absent any probative evidence to the contrary.

Absent a court order such as a best evidence discovery order, the burden of proof is on those who challenge a self-authenticating document to prove it is invalid, not on the person who offers the self-authenticating document.

So far no court has granted standing to any plaintiff to demand discovery of the vital records behind the COLB, which is the ultimate fact issue, not whether the COLB was doctored (although that would be criminal it wouldn't make Obama ineligible).

We do have actual legal proof that HI has a birth vital record for Obama that HI was forced to disclose. The vital record only discloses Obama’s name, Barack Hussein Obama II. D’Onofrio claims that FOIA requests have further nailed down the date of the record to within a few days after Obama’s reported birth date, but that could still be due to a report of home or foreign birth by a family member.

HI has gone so far to confirm that Obama’s vital record confirms that Obama was born in HI. They do not specify whether the records were from a home birth or were amended. HI will not disclose whether the word “filed” instead of “accepted” on the public COLB means anything.

Yes, HI has refused to explicitly confirm the Obama publicly disclosed COLB, but they haven't refuted anything on it either.

We do not know yet whether Obama could actually show up in court with a self-authenticating COLB, but from what HI has been willing to say to date they have given the appearance that such a COLB could be produced, perhaps identical to the one Obama already has shown. We just can't know without a court proceeding, so Obama remains protected at this time.

67 posted on 12/15/2009 11:49:54 AM PST by Seizethecarp
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