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To: dangus

“(I’ll pray to St. Oscar for you.)”

Every time I’ve asked a Catholic about them praying to saints, they said it wasn’t true. Was that wrong?

I just ask for my own understanding.


7 posted on 01/23/2010 3:15:14 PM PST by chuck_the_tv_out ( <<< click my name: now featuring Freeper classifieds)
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To: chuck_the_tv_out; dangus

Please do not confuse Bolognites with Catholics. They are totally separate religions.


8 posted on 01/23/2010 3:18:24 PM PST by Tax-chick (I haven't tried it, myself, but I'm told it's a delicacy in Japan.)
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To: chuck_the_tv_out

Best answer yet... Read Purgatorio by Dante. We follow the saints and Our Lady up the Holy Mountain of God.


14 posted on 01/23/2010 3:45:35 PM PST by Mercat (wherever the people are well-informed they can be trusted with their own government)
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To: chuck_the_tv_out
The Saint thing is actually very simple. We believe that living and deceased Christians are all part of the Body of Christ. The divide that we see between the living and the dead does not exist in terms of our souls.

So, just as I can ask for my fellow living Christian brothers ans sisters to pray for me now, so can I ask the Saints to implore Christ to aid me in my daily walk.

If you look at many of the formal prayers involving Saints, they all point to Christ; none edify the Saint either as an equal to God or above God -- NONE.

Catholic Saints are not perfect. They have the same human weaknesses and temptations the you and I experience on a daily basis. Rather, they are persons who lived their Christian walk in exemplary fashion and in a manner we should emulate.

So, as Catholics, we ask the Saints and the entire Body of Christ (living and deceased) to intervene on our behalf to God.

And yes, we can certainly pray directly to God, as we do. Its just like asking your Christian friends to pray for you. No difference. The key is that in terms of our souls, there is no living or dead; but rather a transition from life on earth to the beatific vision of God in heaven.

Hope this helps clear up any confusion.

16 posted on 01/23/2010 4:05:22 PM PST by CWW (Palin & Jindal in 2012!!)
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To: chuck_the_tv_out

Patrick Madrid was pulling up to a Catholic Church once, and saw Our Lady of Fatima, with the three children kneeling in front of her. He said, “Look! Even our statues worship statues!”


18 posted on 01/23/2010 7:29:32 PM PST by Arthur McGowan (In Edward Kennedy's America, federal funding of brothels is a right, not a privilege.)
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To: chuck_the_tv_out

No, Catholics don’t worship saints. To pray to God is worship, because by doing so you are placing your will in the service of God. (That’s what it means to worship.)

To “pray” is old English for “request.” You’ll recall how Brits are always saying, “Prithee?” Prithee is a contraction of “Pray, thee.” Also, (at least in Virginia; perhaps some courts have modernized their language) a request to a court is referred to as a prayer! (An “appeal” is a “prayer” to a higher court.)

At issue, then, whether a prayer is idolatrous, is the content. Because Protestants pray only to God, “pray,” to a modern Protestant, means a form of worship. But what are Catholics doing when they “pray” to a saint?

The most common prayer to a saint is the “Hail Mary.” It has two parts: a biblical citation, offering a basis why Mary is “safe” to pray to. And then the prayer part: “Pray for us now, and at the hour of our death.”

That’s right! The “Hail Mary” is a request that Mary join us in our subsequent prayers to God.

“But can’t we pray ourselves?” object many. The bible says that prayers are answered, “when two or more are gathered in my name.” The Church commends many prayers for its members when they can be gathered in the Lord’s name: The Sacred Mass, the Liturgy of the Hours, and the Stations of the Cross are the most favored. You’ll notice that the prayers in these are made directly to God... they are worship in and of themselves.

So what do we do when we’re alone, then? The Christian is never alone. He is accompanied at all time by the Church Triumphant, that portion of the Communion of the Saints consisting of those who have already passed (as opposed to the Church Militant, which are those on Earth.) So when he wants to join his prayer to another, he needs only to invoke the fellowship of the Church Triumphant, to join him in prayer.

But we don’t just seek out the prayers of anyone who has died. Those who are not in Heaven are either in purgatory, where they are insensate to our prayers and in need to be prayed for, not to, or in Hell, where there will is in opposition to God.

Precisely because Catholics wish to avoid the sins of idolatry or blasphemy, then, they request the prayers only of those they can have certitude are in Heaven. For this reason, the church maintains a canon of those it can be certain are in Heaven. Through these “Saints,” who number a small fraction of total saints, God has worked miracles which have been affirmed by the Church, so that we may know their will is joined with God’s.

So, no, using a Protestant’s understanding of the word, “pray,” Catholics do not pray to saints. But you will see reference in Catholic literature of praying to someone, which is why Catholics need to be very clear when they deny worshiping saints.


23 posted on 01/23/2010 8:28:10 PM PST by dangus (Nah, I'm not really Jim Thompson, but I play him on FR.)
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