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To: Man50D

More on “Natural Born,” i.e. citizen at birth

Currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are “citizens of the United States at birth:”

Anyone born inside the United States *
Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person’s status as a citizen of the tribe
Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S.
Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other parent is a U.S. national
Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year
Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not provided by age 21
Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time)
A final, historical condition: a person born before 5/24/1934 of an alien father and a U.S. citizen mother who has lived in the U.S.
* There is an exception in the law — the person must be “subject to the jurisdiction” of the United States. This would exempt the child of a diplomat, for example, from this provision.

Anyone falling into these categories is considered natural-born, and is eligible to run for President or Vice President. These provisions allow the children of military families to be considered natural-born, for example.

Separate sections handle territories that the United States has acquired over time, such as Puerto Rico (8 USC 1402), Alaska (8 USC 1404), Hawaii (8 USC 1405), the U.S. Virgin Islands (8 USC 1406), and Guam (8 USC 1407). Each of these sections confer citizenship on persons living in these territories as of a certain date, and usually confer natural-born status on persons born in those territories after that date. For example, for Puerto Rico, all persons born in Puerto Rico between April 11, 1899, and January 12, 1941, are automatically conferred citizenship as of the date the law was signed by the President (June 27, 1952). Additionally, all persons born in Puerto Rico on or after January 13, 1941, are natural-born citizens of the United States. Note that because of when the law was passed, for some, the natural-born status was retroactive.

The law contains one other section of historical note, concerning the Panama Canal Zone and the nation of Panama. In 8 USC 1403, the law states that anyone born in the Canal Zone or in Panama itself, on or after February 26, 1904, to a mother and/or father who is a United States citizen, was “declared” to be a United States citizen. Note that the terms “natural-born” or “citizen at birth” are missing from this section.

In 2008, when Arizona Senator John McCain ran for president on the Republican ticket, some theorized that because McCain was born in the Canal Zone, he was not actually qualified to be president. However, it should be noted that section 1403 was written to apply to a small group of people to whom section 1401 did not apply. McCain is a natural-born citizen under 8 USC 1401(c): “a person born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person.” Not eveyone agrees that this section includes McCain — but absent a court ruling either way, we must presume citizenship.


12 posted on 02/14/2010 12:57:48 PM PST by MindBender26 (Prezdet Obama is what you get when you let the O.J. jury select a president !)
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To: MindBender26

For purposes of the Constitution, the definition of natural born citizen has never changed. No Constitutional Term can be redefined without an amendment.


13 posted on 02/14/2010 1:54:06 PM PST by candeee
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To: MindBender26

MindBender your analysis is incomplete therefore leading to the wrong conclusion and definition of natural born citizen.

Go to Mario Apuzzo’s web site where he not only quotes the law but also case law on the subject, does it very thoughly/clearly showing Obama can’t be a Natural Born citizen:

http://puzo1.blogspot.com/


18 posted on 02/14/2010 6:39:28 PM PST by GregTM
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To: MindBender26
Yeah, that's what it reads CURRENTLY, but what about in 1961, or whenever Obamalamadingdong claims to be born? Wasn't there a provision about the mother's age that Stanley Ann didn't meet?
19 posted on 02/14/2010 8:08:12 PM PST by Southbound ("A liar in public life is worse than a full-paid-up Communist, and I don't care who he is." - HST)
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To: MindBender26
According to the US Dept. of State Foreign affairs manual: it has “never been determined definitively...whether a person who acquired US Citizenship by birth abroad is a natural born citizen” with respect to POTUS eligibility.

The manual also states, “ the fact that someone is a natural born citizen pursuant to a statute does not necessarily imply that he or she is such a person for constitutional purpose” of eligibility to be President.

Congress was given the power to establish a “uniform Rule of Naturalization”. There is doubt that Congress can constitutionally define the term natural born citizen as it pertains to the eligibility question.

A person born in the USA to parents who are both citizens are indisputably eligible for POTUS, as to other classes, there are doubts, and those doubts have yet to be definitively resolved. It is a legitimate issue.

41 posted on 02/17/2010 4:46:49 PM PST by greeneyes (Moderation in defense of your country is NO virtue. Let Freedom Ring.)
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To: MindBender26
Anyone falling into these categories is considered natural-born, and is eligible to run for President or Vice President. These provisions allow the children of military families to be considered natural-born, for example.

That turns out not to be the case. The children of military families fall under a separate "exemption" that existed before the Constitution was ever written, as do those of diplomats.

Congress cannot change the definition of "Natural Born Citizen", it is what is was in 1787.

Even the US State department aknowledges

This statute is no longer operative, however, and its formula is not included in modern nationality statutes. In any event, the fact that someone is a natural born citizen pursuant to a statute does not necessarily imply that he or she is such a citizen for Constitutional purposes.

The Supreme Court has ruled that persons not "born in the US" but citizens at birth by statute, are naturalized, despite what the statutes ( say. The statutes say they are not naturalized, but DO NOT say they are "natural born", despite what the state department manual says. Those words, "natural born" have not been part of the statute law since 1795, and even then, the 1790 Act said they "shall be considered as natural born Citizens. Not "are natural born Citizens". (required both parents to be citizens nonetheless .

"citizens of the United States at birth" is not the same as "Natural Born Citizens". They may be, for Constitutional purposes "naturalized citizens" or they may be, for want of a better term, "native born", but not Natural Born.

Citizens at birth born outside the US do not even fall under the 14th amendment definition of citizen, since they were neither born nor naturalized in the United States. They are citizens anyway, naturalized under the Art. I section 8 power of Congress to establish a uniform rule of naturalization.

54 posted on 02/17/2010 9:39:10 PM PST by El Gato ("The second amendment is the reset button of the US constitution"-Doug McKay)
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