Posted on 05/07/2010 6:55:21 AM PDT by marktwain
Today's question:
Should people on the federal terrorism watch list be blocked from buying firearms and explosives? Why or why not?
Background reading here.
David Schanzer, director of the Triangle Center on Terrorism and Homeland Security, sai It is difficult to conceive of a reason why individuals who have raised sufficient level of suspicion to put them on the no-fly list should have an unlimited right to buy a firearms and explosives. The right to travel and the right to bear arms are both are constitutionally protected, but far from absolute.
John M. Snyder, Public Affairs Director of Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms, said:
While promoters of this idea agree with legislation enabling the Attorney General in this regard, they generally fail to inform the public about the nature of the list itself.
To a large extent, the list is a mystery. There really has not been a lot of information revealed about it. Who is on it? Why? Who puts one on it? How does one get his or her name placed on it? How does one get off it? Can a government official place on it the names of men and women considered unfriendly to or unsupportive of the government official? Can a journalist or anyone considered unfriendly to or unsupportive of a government official or policy be placed on it? Can this happen without the subject's knowledge?
Specifically, could anyone who supports the individual Second Amendment civil right to keep and bear arms be placed on it? Could one who is completing his or her military service, considered suspect last year in a Department of Homeland Security assessment document, be placed on it? Could one who supports, or opposes, any legislative program be placed on it?
(Excerpt) Read more at thehill.com ...
what terror, we don’t have no stinkin terror. well other then those right wing whackos
Is the criteria for being put on the list infallible? If you said yes then why have Congressmen appeared on it? Frankly being put on the list probably has little to do w/ reality and is/would be subject to error and abuse. I think I’m tired of putting anymore power in the hands of those in DC, to date they’ve shown little responsibility.
Tea party supporters beware.
The problem with this is threefold. The first is that while any number of government agencies can contribute to the watch lists, nobody is responsible either for the list overall, or to remove errors. So once you are on the list, even by mistake, you are boned.
The second is that the Attorney General has the sole discretion of who is denied guns. And who do you think Holder believes are the greatest threat? It ain’t al-Qaeda.
And the third thing is that it gives the government a permanent record of all gun purchasers, with no mess or fuss.
The only people this administration would use a ban against would be grandmothers, white middle class men and anyone conservative. Think “airport security”... terrorists jump on the plane while gram’s shampoo is checked.
Completely unconstitutional for American citizens to be denied their rights under the 2nd. Foreign visitors however are a different matter.
I’m trying to figure out if this is going to deny my right to purchase anymore or require that I register what I already have. There are no NICS checks required for ammo, and if they come knocking asking about my guns, my answer will first be, “Show me your warrant.” When they come back, there will be no words exchanged.
Dude! Think about what you just said. That's the only evidence we have that it works.
Not in favor, just clarifying.
No one has mentioned that the proposed legislation sets turns the instant check program into a national registration system”””
ANY legislation that this administration passes is never what we think it is.
They hide too many surprises in pages & pages of rhetoric.
The NO Fly list doesn’t keep them off the planes.
This is just an excuse to go after the persons who will keep this country from being totally taken over by NObama & his Czars who are accountable ONLY to NObama. No one vetted them—Congress didn’t get to even interview them—no one knows how much they are being paid—no one knows how they are being paid- no one knows who or what their staffs are-no one knows who or what is paying them how much.
I thyink it is a shadow government planning a coup against the USA.
This is an interesting question which actually brings into conflict two conservative values ... national security/ criminal justice and the right to bear arms.
It seems to me that a watch list is simply too shaky to attach actual punishment beyond “watching”. Watching is fine, search may even be reasonable due to suspicion ... but the removal of Constitutional rights, including the right to purchase firearms, requires due process of law.
I have no problem with banning firearms sales to terrorist convicts or people declared enemy combatants. I would also likely have no problem with restricting sales to non-citizens. But, to blanket-ban sales to anyone appearing on a “watch list” which has no check is over the line.
SnakeDoc
How is...
"The right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed"
not absolute?
No Fly List = Star Chamber.
(Sessions held in secret, with no indictments, no right of appeal, no juries, and no witnesses.)
As was pointed out by a talk show host: “it’s whose on the other end of the blackberry that we need to worry about”.
IIRC, at least one congress-critter was on the “no-fly list,” as have been very young children.
Without knowing how one gets on or off the list, and an appeal process is publicly implemented, there’s no way I would ever trust the government (especially the CURRENT regime) to just take away constitutionally protected rights.
Mark
Most likely they will show up as say something like: “I'm from the government, and I'm here to help”
These things happen because people are trusting and they don't expect the man in the nice suit to be evil.
And they don't figure it out until it's too late.
So is this how they are going to deprive us of our guns?
What about our First amendment rights?
After all if you're a “Terrorist” why should be ‘Allowed’ to speak and publish and spread sedition and ‘Counter revolutionary’ ideas.
Are our Constitutional rights solid until we just happen to show up on a watch-list and then, Poof! It's all gone?
LOL, I did. :D Some should (still) be there others maybe not. At any rate the idea is that little thought seems to go in to being put on this list. Its a hugely poor idea given that its administered by the fed. I cant think of anything that dont blight.
There's a bundling I expect to see more of, courtesy of the failed Times Square jihadist.
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