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Choosing a Lawyer for Self Defense Shootings
ammoland.com ^ | 10 June, 2010 | KL Jamison

Posted on 6/11/2010, 1:44:07 PM by marktwain

In any given year, a small number of gun owners will make a desperate call from jail searching for that One Lawyer to simplify their lives…

United States Concealed Carry Association

United States Concealed Carry Association

USA - -(AmmoLand.com)- There is a legend of a Texas sheriff who telegraphed the Texas Rangers for help with a riot. He found his rescue was only a single Ranger. He asked why only one Ranger had been sent and was told “One riot, One Ranger.” Like most such stories, if it isn’t true, it should be.

In any given year, a small number of gun owners will make a desperate call from jail searching for that One Lawyer to simplify their lives. The question is always “which one?”.(1)

Other inmates of the jail will be connoisseurs of the legal abilities of various lawyers. Their opinion may be colored by recent results, which may have been affected by a turn of circumstances. Bail bondsmen are a source of information. However, the recommended lawyer may simply be the attorney who collects his bad debts.

Any phone book will devote a substantial number of pages to lawyers. It is possible to select one by calling the first listing, and profitable to the firm of Aaron, Aaron and Aaron, but not practical. The Aaron’s may confine their practice to estates and trust law, personal injury law, or endangered species law, and no matter how endangered one might feel, they would not help. Advertisements help to narrow the field. A U.S. Supreme Court Justice once said that he would never hire an attorney who advertises. This justice was never in the position of making a frantic call from jail, and when he practiced law would be more likely to meet prospective clients at his Club than the jail. Legal ethics limit the amount of information advertisements can contain, which is further limited by extortionate fees for larger ads.(2) Advertising makes it possible to determine which lawyers practice criminal law, in what states, and if they take credit cards.

State Bar Associations are closed shops; in order to practice law in a state an attorney must be a member of the State Bar Association or have local counsel who is a member. In any given location three separate jurisdictions exist: federal, state and local. Each jurisdiction has its own unique rules and practices. In the nature of these things, some attorneys are more experienced in one jurisdiction than the others.

Local Bar Associations can suggest lawyers in specific fields.

Clients often reject lawyers in their own area in the belief that they are hopelessly corrupt. These people go to great pains and expense to get a lawyer from elsewhere. It is not clear why they think lawyers from elsewhere are different. It is said that a good lawyer knows the law, but a great lawyer knows the judge. There is something to be said for this saying. A lawyer who knows the judge knows how he will react to evidence or argument. A judge who knows an attorney is more likely to believe him. This is not a conspiracy it is human nature.

Attorneys want to get paid up front. Once an attorney enters his appearance in a case, he is stuck with it. Taking payments may not be possible. Every attorney has stories of clients who stopped paying, leaving them suffering indentured servitude. In 1924, in a real “Trial of the Century,” Clarrence Darrow took the case of Leopold and Lobe without a retainer. He made new law in saving the spawn of obscenely wealthy families from a well-deserved execution. He was also stiffed for his fee. Many law firms take credit cards, as do bail bondsmen. Few people can meet unbudgeted expenses in the thousands or tens of thousands of dollars in the course of an evening. When the banks are open, it is possible for Grandma to tap her life savings, negotiate a second mortgage on the house, or a title loan on the car.

The NRA’s Civil Rights Legal Defense Fund provides funding, but only in cases of general significance, and only after its Board votes.(3) All these resources take time. Nothing beats a credit card for immediate payment; the ultimate cost may be less than a stay in jail. Keeping a couple of unused credit cards, one for bond and the other for lawyers could come in handy. It is also possible to hire an attorney by assigning the bail bond. However; this is only possible when the defendant pays the entire bond himself.

Three different jurisdictions have their courthouses in a two block radius of Kansas City Missouri.

The amount of bond and legal fees will vary with the severity of the case. When there is blood on the ground or a constitutional principle at stake the client has a “55 Gallon Drum” problem. This problem is addressed by stuffing $100 bills into a 55-gallon drum, cramming them in as tightly as possible, then wheeling the barrel into my office.(4) Many persons shop around for the lowest price. However, the objective is not a bargain, but freedom. One often gets what one pays for. It does not take much effort to plead a person guilty or go through the motions of a defense; it is therefore less expensive. Some lawyers go for volume, some are expensive.

Legal ethics prohibit a guaranteed legal result.(5) If a lawyer offers a guaranteed result, he is likely to violate other legal ethics as well, and this cannot work well for the client. It is therefore not possible to charge one fee for a successful result, and another for a guilty verdict.

It is less stressful to find a lawyer in advance of trouble. This is not a matter of finding loopholes, but of learning the rules before engaging in an activity. There are rules for scuba diving, mountain climbing, carrying a gun and self-defense; the wise participant learns them in advance. The person consulted should be an attorney. Some persons espouse “sovereign citizenship” and “common law” theories which allegedly exempt the person from any law of which they disapprove. Apostles of these unlikely superstitions claim legal success. I have been unable to confirm any such victory. I do know of two such individuals who made their situations worse. One turned a speeding ticket into a jail sentence; another turned the chance of a fair trial into a conviction. A lawyer is necessary. A weekend hunter will not find a trophy animal in the wilderness without a guide. A defendant will not find justice in the thickets of the law without an attorney.

Talk can be expensive.

The National Rifle Association provides a reference list of attorneys, as does the Second Amendment Foundation.(6) These attorneys can be accepted as “gun people,” but are not otherwise vetted. Computer search engines may turn up others. Attorney referral services may be found in yellow pages and the internet. These resources may reflect lawyers who have purchased a place on the list more than any qualifications. Local Bar Associations may provide referrals to attorneys in relevant fields.

Armed with a selection of lawyers to interview, one must have an idea of the purpose of the interview. The first objective is to convince the lawyer of one’s innocence. Criminal defense lawyers usually represent people who are guilty of something. For a criminal a conviction is a cost of doing business, for the survivor of a gunfight, it is a tragedy. It is a completely different mindset to represent an innocent man who cannot afford to lose. Next is to determine what the attorney can do for the client. Bad things usually do not happen during office hours.(7) It must be possible to reach the lawyer at two in the morning, not his voice mail but a human lawyer who can give human advice. The lawyer’s retainer will be unknown until a charge is filed, although it will be some function of a 55-gallon drum, and perhaps two. The lawyer’s hourly rate will give some indication. For every hour spent on the case, the hourly rate is deducted from the retainer. When the retainer is reduced to zero, bills are sent. Certain expenses become extra bills. Charges for expert witnesses, process servers, and investigators are typical. Some firms also bill for photocopies, faxes, and office staff.(8) General advice the lawyer can give about weapons and self-defense law will be useful in preventing problems. It is also important in helping the client decide if he is willing to entrust his future to the lawyer’s decisions.

Some lawyers will take a small fee to be on call in the same way that they are registered agents for corporations. This gives the lawyer the advantage of a file to work from with contact information of persons to underwrite bail and perhaps an extra credit card.

Criminal defense lawyers keep prosecutors honest, a more difficult project than one gathers from watching “Law and Order.” If the worst thing happens, your One best friend in the world will charge by the hour.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: banglist; gun; law
Worthwhile information. I would say that if the worst thing happens, you will not need a lawyer, because you and your loved ones will be tortured and dead.
1 posted on 6/11/2010, 1:44:08 PM by marktwain
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To: marktwain

I would not hire him for any other type of a case, but there is a local attorney who frequents the same gun store that I do. Both times I have seen him in there he was discussing his full-auto Uzi.

He’s my go-to guy if I ever need him.


2 posted on 6/11/2010, 1:49:59 PM by CholeraJoe ("Here is something you can't understand...")
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To: CholeraJoe

I’m all for that guy from “My Cousin Vinny” (Joe Pesci).


3 posted on 6/11/2010, 2:01:34 PM by JD91
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To: marktwain

So they never really give any advice, just who NOT to go to.

In every tactical handgunning and self-defense course I’ve taken, the instructors tell us to ask the local LEOs who they have on retainer for the department. Get that attorney’s business card, and if ever brought up for defending yourself, demand a lawyer and hand them the attorney’s business card.

Puts the department in a pickle, because they have to provide a lawyer, even if that lawyer normally represents them. I’ve never had to do this, but the lawyer for my county sheriff told me that they would represent me if I called them. I didn’t mention this situation, but I would take them at their word.


4 posted on 6/11/2010, 2:02:44 PM by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: rarestia
Puts the department in a pickle, because they have to provide a lawyer, even if that lawyer normally represents them.

Why? I don't see any conflict there unless the other person involved in the shooting is a LEO, so the lawyer will by definition already be representing the other party.

5 posted on 6/11/2010, 3:34:09 PM by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Still Thinking

That’s a good point. I suppose I never thought about it that way. I suppose the logic is that if the attorney is good enough for the LEOs, he/she would be good enough to protect a citizen in the event of a lawful self-defense suit.


6 posted on 6/11/2010, 3:58:00 PM by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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