Alan Keyes and the Neocon Destruction of Third Parties

Lets have the 1%er third party loons fight each other in the ring.

WWF rules.

Like they don't have enough circus atmosphere here already.........

Get lost, RINO troll.

He pings the list.

*rolls eyes*

oooooooooh. Skeery.

Such a brave, brave, man.

Now tell us how that Baldwin vote of yours was so intelligent and pure again, okay? "the only conservative in the race"

Bwahahahahahaha.

Now tell us how that Baldwin vote of yours was so intelligent and pure again, okay? "the only conservative in the race"

What's your point, Sharky?

Voting for someone who suggests that US black ops caused the Haitian earthquake doesn't say much about your political judgment does it?

If there was such a thing as a loonier candidate than McCain, he's it.

“Neocon” is one of those malleable terms that can mean a lot of things, seemingly, but the most virulent of those who tend to use it mean either “Jew,” or “Jew-lover,” or “pro-Israel,” or “not an isolationist like me.”

The American Independent Party of California left the Constitution Party, many of whose members tend to use that amorphous but derogatory term a lot, some of them in exactly the way I’ve described.

AIP then affiliated nationally with our new party, America’s Independent Party, which is a 100% Reagan peace through strength party, not an isolationist party, one which is also very much pro-Israel. (I’m the chairman, by the way.)

That’s what is at the core of the dispute.

But, in any case, the Paulite/CP/Baldwin faction no longer has any say in the course of the American Independent Party of California. It’s a new day. That’s the bottom line.

From our Platform:

Peace through Strength

We believe in a supremely strong, prepared, and well-equipped civilian-controlled United States military, and a bold, visionary and intelligent program of principled constructive engagement with the rest of the world. For us, “peace through strength” is not a mere slogan. It is the means of survival for our country in a very dangerous and often hostile world. Our friendship should be a sought-after possession of all men and women of good will everywhere in the world. Our enmity should be something that all rightfully fear.

As Ronald Reagan opposed and defeated the designs and desire of the Soviet Union to dominate the world and place it under the tyranny of their Evil Empire, we stand unalterably opposed to all who approve of, plan or commit terrorist acts. Since the first principle of America is the protection of innocent human life, any who would use acts of terrorism targeted at innocent civilians to forward their political, ideological or religious aims incur our effective and determined enmity.

http://aipnews.com/mxPage.asp?ID=3

AIP’s “Peace through Strength Institute”:

http://www.aipnews.com/talk/forums/forum-view.asp?fid=101

By the way, the article at the top of this thread is shot through with inaccuracies.

Author's response:

“Neocon” is one of those malleable terms that can mean a lot of things, seemingly, but the most virulent of those who tend to use it mean either “Jew,” or “Jew-lover,” or “pro-Israel,” or “not an isolationist like me.”

I married a Jew, so that argument is not going to wash. The last name of Bloom should have been your first clue. I used to post on FR as farmfriend so y'all can search my posts and see if you find ANYTHING anti Semitic or non conservative there. I was and am straight up and honest. Always have been, always will be.

The American Independent Party of California left the Constitution Party, many of whose members tend to use that amorphous but derogatory term a lot, some of them in exactly the way I’ve described.
AIP then affiliated nationally with our new party, America’s Independent Party, which is a 100% Reagan peace through strength party, not an isolationist party, one which is also very much pro-Israel. (I’m the chairman, by the way.)
That’s what is at the core of the dispute.

I don't support what the King faction did, holding their own convention, by any stretch but they didn't call a "phone Convention" at 11:59pm to be held the next day. And they aren't passing out loyalty oaths to county central committees. They are the ones who put up a slate of constitutional candidates ( http://www.nightingaleforgovernor.com/ ) only to have those candidates told they can't be part of this years State Convention, another phone convention BTW. The wiki link is pretty accurate for what happened but it leaves out the part about the convention being a last minute phone convention, nor does it explain how they got a quorum. Note only a minority of the officers attended. So with a fake convention and a fake quorum they voted to disassociate with CP and associate with Keyes' new party.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Independent_Party

2008 split

A split in the American Independent Party occurred during the 2008 presidential campaign, one faction recognizing Jim King as chairman of the AIP with the other recognizing Ed Noonan as chairman. Noonan's faction claims the old AIP Web site address while the King organization claims the AIP blog address. King's group met in Los Angeles on June 28-29, elected King to state chair.^[4] Ed Noonan's faction, which included 8 of the 17 AIP officers, held a convention in Sacramento on July 5, 2008. Issues in the split were US foreign policy and the influence of Constitution Party founder Howard Phillips on the state party.^[5]
The King group elected to stay in the Constitution Party and supported its presidential candidate, Chuck Baldwin. It was not listed as the "Qualified Political Party" by the California Secretary of State and Baldwin's name was not printed in the state's ballots.^[6] King's group sued for ballot access ^[7] and their case was dismissed without prejudice.^[8]
The Noonan group voted to pull out of the Constitution Party and join a new party called America's Independent Party, put together by perennial candidate Alan Keyes as a vehicle for his own presidential campaign.^[5] Since Noonan was on record with the California Secretary of State as (outgoing) party chairman, Keyes was added to the state ballots as the AIP candidate.^[9] This group elected Markham Robinson as its new chair at the convention.
The issue of who are the true officers of the AIP has not been decided in the ballot access court case.^[8] The future of the party after the November election is not clear. The King faction has removed all references to the American Independent Party from their website and is now billed as the Constitution Party of California.^[10]
By the way, the article at the top of this thread is shot through with inaccuracies.

No it isn't. Everything is well documented. If he believes that there are inaccuracies then he has been given false information. And he needs to post supporting evidence as is customary on forums like this.

Neoconservatism........Sounds like a bunch of washed up Neo-Leninists falsely using the "conservative" mantle to push their new utopia.

You got that right.

Neocon poobahs are rank opportunists who squatted in the Repub Party for stealth purposes-----they are actually former Trotskyites that flew the coop when Stalin executed their hero.

As punkneo guru, Irving Kristol, pontificated, " The historical task and political purpose of neoconservatism is.....to convert the Republican Party and American conservatism in general, against their respective wills, into a new kind of conservative politics suitable to governing a modern democracy."

Irving was Fox pundit Billy Kristol's Dearest Departed Daddy (Irving was Giuliani's "foreign policy" advisor).

BTW, there is a reward out for anyone who can determine what the pukeneos actually do for a living. None of the pukeneos have any visible means of support, unless you count: (1) media prostitution, (2) infiltratng the US government, (3) endless think-tank pontificating on how nice it is to have US troops invade foreign countries, (4) squatting in the Repub Party, hoping to destroy it from within, and, (5) kicking so/con Repubs to the curb.

========================================

The opportunistic Us-First pinkneos blow whichever way the Beltway Winds are blowing-----spewing their elitist Endless War agit/prop-----co-opting whoever's got the power.

Obama’s sex life is really improving as the pukeneos line up under the Oval Office desk. I hear Rahm installed a Take-A-Number machine to control the neo traffic. Here's hoping Obama's got the stamina for all the neo-lewinskys coming his way (/snix).

The King faction has removed all references to the American Independent Party from their website and is now billed as the Constitution Party of California.

End of story.

By the way, that reply is also fraught with inaccuracies.

Author replies...

By the way, that reply is also fraught with inaccuracies.

He keeps saying that but he fails to rebut any of it.

It’s not worth it. They lost and they need to just get on with their lives.

Author reply:

The following are excerpts from emails circulating in a large group of AIP members. The discussion is about the up coming state convention. My comments will be in blue.

___________________________________________________

Just to show how the Robinson faction is breaking the rules let's look at Don Grundmann's eligibility to be on the State Central Committee. (FWIW I have personally called for the leadership of both factions to resign for the good of the party) I would love to see EV's answer to this but I know one will not be forth coming.

As I understand it, these are the relevant facts (ignoring the Los
Angeles convention and SCC meeting):

1. At the June 2006 Primary Election, you were elected as the AIP U.S.
Senator candidate (6 year term).

2. At the September 2006 AIP SCC meeting, you were elected as an AIP
National Committeeman (2 year term).

3. You are running for AIP U.S. Senator candidate in the June 2010
Primary Election.

And, these are the relevant EC sections:

7550. The state convention shall consist of one delegate for
each of the following officers:
   (h) All Senators and Representatives of Congress from
California.
   (j) National committeemen and committeewomen.

7551. The state convention shall be composed of the following
delegates:
   (a) Each officer named in Section 7550 who was nominated and
elected as a candidate of the party and whose term of office
extends beyond the first Monday in December in the case of
legislators and the Monday after January 1 in the case of other
officers next following the direct primary election, or the
appointee or successor appointed, elected, or otherwise
designated by law to fill a vacancy in the office of any such
officer. These delegates are "holdover delegates."
   (b) Each candidate of the party in whose behalf nomination
papers were filed and who was nominated at the direct primary
election by that party. These delegates are "nominee
delegates." Nominees for an office the term of which extends
beyond two years are delegates to each succeeding state
convention until that following the direct primary election at
which nominations for the office are again to be made. If a
candidate is a "nominee delegate" to the state convention held
in the year in which he or she is nominated, and is elected to
the office at the succeeding general election, he or she shall
be considered a "holdover delegate" to the state convention of
his or her party in the next odd-numbered year, if his or her
party is required to hold the convention.

7561. If a person is a delegate to the state convention and
qualified independently of that fact to be a delegate to the
same state convention, he or she shall be a delegate by reason
of the most recent election at which he or she becomes a
delegate. The resulting vacancy shall be filled pursuant to
Section 7557.

Applying the EC to the facts:

1. Your 2006 U.S. Senator AIP candidacy makes you a delegate to the
2006, 2008, and 2010 conventions.

2. Your 2006-2008 National Committeeman office makes you a delegate to
the 2008 convention.

3. If you win the 2010 U.S. Senator AIP candidacy, you will be a
delegate to the 2010, 2012, and 2014 conventions.

Summarizing your eligibility by convention year, '*' indicates
eligibility conditional upon winning the 2006 Primary Election:

2006 -- 2006 AIP U.S. Senator candidate

2008 -- 2006 AIP U.S. Senator candidate
National Committeeman 2006-2008

2010 -- 2006 AIP U.S. Senator candidate

2010 AIP U.S. Senator candidate *

2012 -- 2010 AIP U.S. Senator candidate *

2014 -- 2010 AIP U.S. Senator candidate *

Therefore, you are a 2010 convention delegate whether you win or lose in
the 2010 Primary Election.

Do I now have it right?

Sincerely yours,

David Christensen
2010 Candidate, U.S. Rep. in Congress, 11th Dist. (AIP)

The Reply from Mark Seidenberg, AIP Vice Chair

Everybody,

I now know how to reply all thanks to a telecom with David C. Thank you David C. for the

help in posting.

David C. asked "What is Division 7? ANSWER: "Political Party Organization and Central Committee Elections".

I will not turn the AIP Convention into a circus. Therefore, Dr. Don Grundmann will not be

let in to the 2010 AIP Convention, because he is not a delegate to the convention. He was termed out on the AIP SCC, His last day was September 2, 2008. The cabal in Los Angeles on June 28 - 29, 2008 was not a convention of the American Independent Party. The 2008 Convention of the AIP took place in the Auditorium of the California Secretary of State Building on July 5, 2008 at Sacramento, CA. Dr. Don J. Grundmann

was a seated delegate to that convention, because he was a National Committeeman at

that time. At the September 2, 2006, AIP Convention in the City of Rancho Cordova, Sacramento County, CA, Dr. Don J. Grundmann was seated as a "Nominee Delegate"

because he was elected to be the AIP Nominee for the US Senate seat and the SOS

acted on August 7, 2006 to that election. However, on September 3, 2006, Dr. Don

Grundmann was elected to the National Committee at the AIP SCC for a two year term.

California Election Code Section 7561 states: "If a person is a delegate to the state convention and quilified independently of that fact to be a delegate by reason of the most

recent election at which he or she became a delegate. The resulting vacancy shall be

filled pursuant to section 7557."

__________________________________________________

Everyone:

Someone asked me to please forward the following message to the list
anonymously.

David

1. You contend that Don Grundman does not now qualify to be a delegate
because his designation as a nominee delegate (and thus later as a
holdover delegate), due to his nomination for US Senator in 2006, was
superseded by his election as a national committeeman--which also made
him a delegate-- the same year. Let's assume, strictly for the sake of
argument, that you are correct about this contention.

Are you not still overlooking at least two ways in which he could be
lawfully selected to serve as a delegate at the AIP State Convention in
2010? One possibility would be that he wins the primary election and is
thereby nominated for US Senator for 2010. The other is that (since
there are people running for County Central Committee in Alameda
County--including his mother) that he could be appointed as a vacancy
delegate under the provisions of Elections Code Section 7557 (a) and (b)
at the time the new County Central Committee for his county organizes.
[It is my understanding that the AIP, over the years, held these
meetings in August (even after it was no longer mandated that they occur
on the last weekend of the month) so as to allow time for nominees to
become certified, make their appointments of State Central Committee
members pursuant to 7600, 7602, 7604 and 7608, and to allow the County
Central Committees (SCC) to organize make their vacancy appointments of
delegates and likewise allow those delegates to make their SCC
appointments as well] Further, even if not selected as a delegate in
one of the two ways as set forth above, is it not also possible, even
probable, that Don Grundmann could be appointed, at least, to serve as a
member of the SCC, by someone who is a 2010 nominee or vacancy delegate?

2. As an example, if there was a candidate for Congress, who ran
unopposed in the primary, and therefore qualified as a nominee delegate
for the State Convention under the provisions of 7550 and 7551, as will
other AIP congressional candidates, Jerry Leidecker, Jerry Denham, Bill
Lussenheide, David Miller, John Smith and Dion Clark. Do you intend to
recognize the full and complete nominee delegate status for purposes of
the 2010 State Convention and SCC organizational meeting--with all
rights and privileges appurtenant thereto--to each of us who are
candidates? Do you intend to recognize the same rights of Board of
Equalization (and unopposed in the primary) candidates (nominees) Shawn
Hoffman and Terri Lussenheide? Do you intend to recognize said rights,
as well, for State Senate candidate, Ivan Chou, and State Assembly
candidate, Robert Gosney, each of whom are unopposed in the primary and
will be nominated. There are also the following unopposed candidates
running for office (holding aside the office of Insurance Commissioner
which is omitted by the code): Diane Beale Templin for Attorney General,
Robert Lauten for State Treasurer, Merton Short for Secretary of State
and Jim King for Lieutenant Governor. They will be nominated in the
primary. Do you intend to recognize the rights of each of these
individuals under the terms of 7550 and 7551?

We were told by Seidenberg or Markham one that these people would not be certified at the time of the state convention and thus would not be delegates.

3. If Chelene Nightingale wins the primary election for Governor, she
will also also be entitled to be a nominee delegate for 2010 under the
above mentioned Election Code provision. Do you intend, in that case,
to accord her full and complete rights as a nominee delegate? I would
repeat this question as to the case of Nathan Johnson, in the
eventuality that he defeats Larry Beliz for Controller in the primary.

4a) Would a nominee for office, under the terms of Section 7652, be
entitled to serve as an Ex Officio member of their own County Central
Committee. In the case of my county, since nobody else has run for
County Central Committee, that would mean that I would be entitled to
organize a county committee in July and that committee would be entitled
to appoint delegates for any vacancies that exist in Assembly or state
senate districts all or mostly existing in my county, pursuant to the
provisions of Section 7557 (a) and (b). Do you intend to recognize,
protect and preserve my right to act in such manner? If so, would not
holding a State Convention and State Central Committee meeting prior to
the time that my county (and all others) may first meet and make such
appointments, thwart this process and, in effect, deny the participatory
rights of these nominee delegates and disenfranchise those who signed
their nomination papers and voted for them in the primary?

4b) Also, for sake of example, my committee could organize and elect
someone other than myself to be county chairperson. That County
Chairperson would be entitled to be a member of the State Central
Committee under Code 7600. Would you agree that person, once elected,
should be recognized as a member of the state central committee? Would
it not be more fair, just to hold the State Central Committee
Organizational Meeting at a time, such as early August, when it can be
inclusive to all of those who could possibly be selected (or appointed)
as a result of the primary election and by the terms of the above
mentioned Election Code Sections?

5. It is my understanding that, unlike recent previous years, there are
individuals running for county central committee in several counties
including, but not necessarily limited to, Orange County, Stanislaus
County, Tuolomne County, Alameda County and Merced County. Does it not
make more sense and more fair to have the State Convention and SCC
organizational meeting in late July or August so as to allow those
committees to organize (in addition to those where, like mine, they can
be organized by Ex Officio members, which would include Sacramento, Los
Angeles, Contra Costa, San Bernardino, Butte, San Diego and possibly
others) and make their appointments of vacancy delegates, so that we may
expand participation in our State Convention and SCC meeting in order to
make them more inclusive and to give full effect to the results of the
primary election?

6. In what manner do you intend to convey notice of the date, time and
place of the AIP State Convention and State Central Committee
Organizational Meeting to all nominee, holdover, vacancy and any other
delegates and to members who are entitled to attend the SCC?

I was informed on June 12th through emails by a third party that the convention would be on June 26, 27. Does this constitute proper notice of ANY meeting let alone a state convention?

_________________________________________________

David,

Whoever wrote this long letter does not understand the Election Code or the By-Laws. I

will give a reply to this letter after June 8th. I am spending my time on the No on Prop. 14

campaign until then. If Prop. 14 passes there will no longer be "Nominee Delegates" so the

questions of who and when will become moot.

Let's all get out and work to stop Prop. 14. The media now is show that Prop. 14 will pass

over 2 to 1, viz., 60 % yes to 27 % no.

...

Sincerely, Mark Seidenberg, Vice Chairman, American Independent Party

Interesting that after the passage of Prop 14, Chairman Robinson sent out this twitter:

BraveLad

Free at last! Great God Almighty-

We're free at last! Why" Prop 14

passed in CA. It frees the AIP from

the chains of the Election Code!

#TCOT

If the “Robinson faction,” which controls the party, succeeds, there is hope that the American Independent Party will become a viable Reaganite conservative political force in California. If not, it will continue to accomplish pretty much what it has accomplished for the last 40 years. In other words, not that much.

Robinson opposed Prop 14 for very good reasons. It was driven by Democrat and Republican political forces that did not have the best interests of the people of California in mind, and it was sold deceptively. Its intent was to further dilute any challenge to their political hegemony over the state. That’s why Robinson and the others worked against it.

But, the law of unintended consequences has now kicked in. The huge silver lining is that Prop 14 unshackles AIP from the chains that have been imposed on it by the two incumbent parties over many decades.

The American Independent Party now has a chance to follow America’s Independent Party’s model in establishing a truly bottom up grassroots process for nominating and electing candidates. Our new meta-party concepts are perfectly suited for dealing with whatever they throw at us, including Prop 14.

That’s why Robinson is crowing now. More and more people are seeing that the voters actually did us a big favor, if we simply continue to push to establish a truly grassroots-driven, personhood pro-life, peace through strength, pro-family, pro-border security, pro-Constitution party.

Neoconservatism is a right-wing political philosophy that emerged in the United States of America, and which supports using American economic and military power to bring liberalism, democracy, and human rights to other countries.[1][2][3] Consequently the term is chiefly applicable to certain Americans and their strong supporters. In economics, unlike paleoconservatives and libertarians, neoconservatives are generally comfortable with a welfare state; and, while rhetorically supportive of free markets, they are willing to interfere for overriding social purposes...

Don't sound like conservatives to me. More like neoliberalsof the worstorder.

But I thank you for your definition.

From the Author...

The Robinson faction is the minority. They will only succeed by disenfranchising the bulk of the party! How is this a good thing?

Chelene Nightengale won the primary with 58% of the vote compared to Robinson's 41%. How can the Robinson faction win except through corrupt practices?

RE: "Don't sound like conservatives to me. More like neoliberalsof the worstorder. ...But I thank you for your definition."

LOL. I don't think I can take much credit for that, good or bad...was me quoting the Author, who was quoting 'wikipedia'. I wondered the same.