Skip to comments.UCC Pastor to read Quran in Response to Dove Quran Burnings
Posted on 09/07/2010 10:48:17 AM PDT by mbarker12474
If They Can Burn It, We Can Read It.
A UCC Ministers Response to Burning the Quran.
Posted on August 19, 2010 by Zachary| 81 Comments
There are some things that really get under my skin. One of those things is religious intolerance, be it from Christians, Muslims, Jews, Agnostics, Pagans, Pastafarians, or the like.
Larry Reimer, a minister of the United Church of Gainesville, has decided to read scripture from the Qur'an in worship service in response to a local Qur'an burning. Its good to know that Im not the only one, then, who sees Gainesville, Floridas Dove World Outreach Centers plan to burn as many copies of the Quran as possible a stab in the heart to groups of religious followers that care about tolerance. Larry Reimer is a minister at the United Church of Gainesville, a deep advocate of civil rights, and the man responsible for what seems to be a very intelligent response to Doves outlash at Islam.
If they can burn it, then we can read it, said Reimer from an armchair across from mine in his office, lined with bookshelves and photos from many events canvassing the years. On a side table next to me, theres a statue of the Buddha, along with various other spiritually-themed trinkets that seem to indicate that this office does not belong to a spiritually firm-handed man.
Reimer, along with other Gainesville religious leaders, will read scripture from the Quran as part of worship services on Sunday, September 12.
When asked about how he came about with the idea, Almost right away, members of the congregation here asked me, what are we going to do about this? Originally, I had the intention of giving [Dove Center] no more attention in the media. But as I thought about it, I asked myself what we could do that would be effective and proactive in promoting cooperation among our religious relatives.
I prodded further about religious relatives. Christianity, Judaism, and Islam are all part of the Abrahamic tree of faith. We all believe in the same God, and in many aspects we are all trying to accomplish the same goals. And in Islam, there are things that I think any follower of any other religion could learn from. Take prayer, for example. In Islam, one prays at least five times a day. The discipline to do that? Few of us have it. And like Christianity and Judaism, there is a strong call to love God and your neighbor.
We chat on for a bit about the differences and similarities that each of the Abrahamic religions have when he says to me, You know, we learn best from our rival siblings. We might not always agree with them, but they always point out our shortcomings. And in the end, we have the most in common with them. We pull from one another and make each whole.
Look at FSU and UF, or Michigan and Ohio State. All students who grew up together, went to the same high schools, and in reality should be the most understanding of one another. Now that theyre on opposite sides of the stadium, they act like they have nothing in common. But they do, and if each member stopped for a minute and thought about it, they would realize theyre the same students, with the same dreams, looking and hoping to do the same things when they graduate.
Then I ask him why he thinks these negative attitudes toward Islam exist. The average American inherently assumes that Islam is violent and decidedly anti-American because we havent taken the time to experience Islam from an individual perspective or as a faith up close. A friend of mine was in Egypt when news of Dove Outreachs Quran burning hit, and he told me that it was represented as mainstream Christianity, much in the same way that the violent acts we hear about here are represented as mainstream Islam. Here, Islam is still associated with terrorism. The acts of September 11th were not acts that were Islamic in nature. They were acts of fanatical extremists. And fanaticism is not confined to any one faith. I think that theres no better time than September 12th to remind ourselves of this, and to read from Quran in worship to point out how much we really do have in common.
Then I asked him the big one. If you could preach to the members of Dove Outreach Center for even five minutes, what would you say? The danger to our faith comes not most from outside, but from the shadows within. We must pay attention to our neglect to look at ourselves, instead of automatically pointing the finger elsewhere. Gods call is for constant opening.
Already, Larry has been interviewed for the New York Times. As of now, Fifteen religious leaders in Gainesville have agreed to share verses from the Quran on Sunday, September 12th. And he thinks that more will follow. Im not trying to make this a national or international event, but I feel that those who understand that allowing [the Qur'an burning] to pass silently by allows Dove Outreach to win in the fight against tolerance and religious compassion will stand up and share scripture from the Quran.
Not a moment too soon. In the words of German poet Heinrich Heine written in 1820, now enshrined on a plaque at the site of Nazi Propoganda Minster Joseph Goebbels book burnings, There, where they burn books, they will in the end burn people.
It may be in that church that the Koran is read more than the Bible.
Is he going to read the good parts, about killing infidels?
The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
Any religion consisting of idiots that go to war when their religion is slighted deserve no respect.
And - if that religion was founded by a child molester, that makes the lack of respect even more justified.
Sorry, I just do not give a smelly Obama for Islam.
Used to halfheartedly respect it.
Heck, I even respect Scientology more.....(gasp, choke).
You have that right!!
This confuses me. If he doesn’t think Christianity is correct, why is he Christian?
So is the road to Sharia.
Then how about writing a screed against the Saudi Islamic state's prohibition all religious texts other than muslim texts? How about denouncing Saudi Arabia's death penalty for non-muslims who dare enter the segregated cities of Mecca and Medina?
When the capital of the Islamic empire is deeply intolerant of other faiths, you can expect a cold shoulder for the moderates who say nothing about that intolerance.
....it’s just as violent as they say!!!
If I went to such a church, I would loudly announce “I’m outta here!” and I’d make for an exit once the Koran reading started.
Bowing to Mohammed's capital of Islam 5 times a day serves the empire, not God.
2 Corinthians 6:14-15
Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness? What harmony is there between Christ and Belial[a]? What does a believer have in common with an unbeliever?
what are ‘Pastafarians’? Jamacains that get stoned and eat spaghetti?
The UCC’s real symbol is the hammer and sickle, not the cross. It was one of Clinton’s main accomplices in the kidnapping of Elian Gonzales. The Rev Wright’s secret mosque, aka “church,” is also UCC.
Be sure you read this, Rev:
Christians will be burned in the Fire. 5:72
Whoever says Muhammad was black must be killed (Ash-Shifa, Tr. Aisha Abdarrahman, 2004)
Ahmad ibn Abi Sulayman, the companion of Sahnun said, “Anyone who says that the Prophet was black should be killed. (ibid, p.375)
In one Hadith, Mohammed referred to Blacks as Raisn Heads (Sahih Al Bukhary vol. 1, no. 662 and vol. 9, no. 256), and as pug nosed slaves in Sahih Moslem vol. 9 pages 46 and 47.
Christians are wrong about the Trinity. For that they will have a painful doom. 5:73
Give tidings (O Muhammad) of a painful doom to the rich and greedy Christian monks and Jewish rabbis.9:34
Jesus was not the Son of God. Those who say he was (Christians) are going to hell. 19:35-37
Scourge adulteresses with 100 stripes. Do not show them any pity. Have a party of believers watch the punishment. 24:2
Sura 33 “And he bequeathed to you their lands, their homes and their possessions, together with land you have never trodden” (33.27) .
“Be patient with unbelievers until you have strength” (86.17).
Quran 3:28 Don’t have unbelieving friends unless it is to deceive them. Remember the final goal is to Allah.
Allahs law (Sharia) is binding to all 4:135
Allah accepts only Sharia and no other laws 7:29, 57:25
Allah is the Law-giver; He appointed Muhammad to implement the only correct laws (Sharia laws) 45:18
Quran 9:33 ISLAM WILL PREVAIL OVER ALL RELIGIONS
Apostasy in Floriduh.
This would be even more powerful if in a joint show of religious tolerance, a Mosque in Saudi Arabia, Jordan or Iran read a passage from the Bible at the same time. Maybe you could fly over there and set that up Jerry.
Comparing a football rivalry with the clash of civilizations is a measure of just how shallow the gene pool has become in the religion business. The failure to discern critical differences is a hallmark of incompetence and this screed is no exception.
In fact, as you imply, "tolerance" is not a serious virtue as it tends to blur these critical differences in the service of basically no good end. When will pusillanimous preachers like this UCC phoney focus on the lack of tolerance by the moslem "faith." It does not just burn books(although they have burned plenty of Bibles), it kills people. Maybe the frauds at the UCC ought to consider which side they want to be on after all.
In his church all religions are just as good. One is not better than any other. So of course it makes sense to read from the handbook of the Jew-haters. Sure. Just skip over the part where it says to kill Jews and Christians.
Now if these people will let me select the parts of the Koran to read I think I can find plenty of stuff that should make them think twice about their stupid idea.
Here is a man who knows nothing about the faith he professes.
That’s like reading Mein Kampf in a Synagogue.
Is there a difference between an Imam reading the Koran and an UCC Pastor reading the Koran?
Wonder which of Christ’s teachings this pastor uses to allow himself to break the first two commandments on a continual basis, not just by reading holy scriptures from an apostate religion?
1. You shall have no other gods before me.
2. You shall make for yourself no graven image.
UCC is one of those churches that fags like to join to make them feel all religious.
dang....and I thought I was being funny.
They'll still want to saw your head off with a dull knife, Larry.
That's what I was wondering.
Yes, the Imam is probably a good person. That’s always a question when it comes to UCC “pastors” or “members”.
I’m with you and that was my first thought - if the homily on Sunday at our parish consists of reading from the unholy book, I am standing up and walking out, and taking my family with me. BS on that, we are Christians, and the only Book we need to hear readings out of at Mass is the Bible. We certainly don’t need to hear readings from a book which says we should all be converted, subdued, or killed because of who we are. What kind of nutty pastor is that guy?
Both of these guys are wrong, but in the USA they both still have that right. (For now)
I hope he reads the part about killing infidels.
I wonder if muslims would consider taking a Koran into a christian church and putting on a Christian podium to be a sacrilige, worthy of beheading.
I wonder if this pastor will make sure to properly clean his hands so he has no chance of getting his bacon grease from morning breakfast onto the pages — surely an act worthy of death.
I hope he won’t touch the pages with his left hand, lest that hand be cut off.
And I certainly hope he won’t accidentally put the Bible on top of the Koran at any time, because I’d hate to see the Muslims forced to blow up his church or anything like that.
Still, I think it would be helpful for his church to hear some passages from the Koran. Chosen correctly, they might just scare his church into doing something productive.
Anybody who takes a Koran into their possession I think is being reckless at this point. It’s just too easy to do something wrong and get yourself targeted.
Also joined by university eggheads, ACLU lawyers and other assorted upscale libs to ward off speculation that they're really atheists.
Exactly, they probably haven’t read anything from the Bible, but now they’re going to read from the Koran.
I went to a wedding in one this last summer, and on the church calender of events board they listed three weekly Yoga Workshops in the church and a weekly Buddhism class.
I think it's pretty stupid for a Christian Church to do a Fred Phelps and burn a Quran. They have the right to do it, but it's just plain dumb. But for a church that claims to be Christian to teach from the Quran is sacrilegious.
Tolerance? Sure! Muslims will kill simply because someone follows a non-muslim religion. Compare that to the burning of a book, and let’s talk tolerance, shall we???
I have worked with some of the nuts at the UCC (tbe “Christian” church that sanctions, within their denomination, the pulpit of Rev Jeremiah Wright, a practitioner of Black Liberation Theology, an offshoot of Marxist Liberation Theology).
It’s a blight on Christian history that they are, in part, the successors to the Congregational Churches, who were, in part, successors to the Massachusetts colony “Pilgrims” and “Puritans”.
As for Islam being an Abrahamic religion — no way. All of the people who wrote the Bible were Jews. Jesus was a Jew. Whether you are talking about the old or new Testament, you are talking about a tradition that comes from the Jewish people. What was Mohammed? An Arabian pagan who plagiarized the Bible. He even changed the meanings of the Jewish and Christian scriptures.
My understanding is that Jesus comes from the marriage of Sahra and Abraham up through Isaac,Jacob and David.That is also the Jewish heirarchy. Mohammed comes from the lineage of Abraham and Haggar who was a maid servant of Abraham and who was to be cast out from Abrahams ‘family’. With this scenario it is no stretch of reasoning that the hatred of muslims against Jews and Christians is so deep rooted that time acts to propagate differences rather than ameliorate enmity between blood lines going back many centuries. Another interesting link is Islam apparently recognizes Jesus as a prophet of Abrahams lineage but not as in Christian belief as being of God: thereby making Jesus higher than Mohammed in the greater scheme of things which obviously the Muslims cannot accept.
Mohammed not only plagerized the Bible but he actually changed the meanings of the Bible scriptures. Today Muslims believe that they have the true understanding of the scripture and the Jews and Christians are fallen away from the true faith which is Islam. They even claim that Moses was a Muslim. In addition, they claim that the temple mount in Jerusalem was not the site of the ancient Jewish Temple.