Volt Fraud At Government Motors

IBD Editorials ^ | October 19, 2010 | Investors Business Daily staff

[Morpheus2009]

Don’t forget nuclear.

Exactly, and nuclear is the prime opportunity for the new younger generation to appeal for now. It’s more efficient than fossil fuels, and the air pollution is close to none. France has gotten ahead of us on this, but I think if we put our minds to it, we can catch up.

[Hop A Long Cassidy]

>>>So, this overpriced pile of tin gets city mileage of about one fifth what was claimed, maybe.

There’s fraud going on! Who stole the mileage!

[Still Thinking]

Fair enough.

[Still Thinking]

France has gotten ahead of us on this, but I think if we put our minds to it, we can catch up.

Geez, trailing France in the roll-out of a politically incorrect tech. How embarrassing is that?

[SeeSac]

and at eighty miles per hour it won’t do any better and probably not as well as my 2004 Mercury Grand Marquis Limited Edition

It can go from 0 to 100 mph without even starting the engine!

[SeeSac]

On the highway it fails to equal cars that were available in the seventies with very simple drive trains and at eighty miles per hour it won’t do any better and probably not as well as my 2004 Mercury Grand Marquis Limited Edition, a car that is very comfortable to drive and not cramped at all even for me and I am six four barefoot.

It's designed as a city commuter that would with most commutes never have to run the engine. Even on the engine, 31.7 mpg in the city is not bad and 33 mpg cruising at eighty blows the socks off your Grand Marquis.

[Morpheus2009]

Nuclear energy isn’t as feared by the younger generations as by the older ones. Expect to see more and more of it in the future.

[palmer]

33 mpg cruising at eighty blows the socks off your Grand Marquis

Not quite. They will get similar upper 20's at highway speeds. You should look into it, you might be surprised.

[SeeSac]

Not quite. They will get similar upper 20's at highway speeds. You should look into it, you might be surprised.

I looked at a real world tests. 33 at 78 mph. You should not make claims that are so easily disproved.

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/car/10q4/2011_chevrolet_volt_full_test-road_test

[palmer]

26 in the thread above. Your unproven claim is that 33 “blows the socks off” a Grand Marquis. The factors of momentum and wind resistance are all that matter at 80 on the highway and in that regard the Volt and Grand Marquis are about equal.

[SeeSac]

Your unproven claim is that 33 “blows the socks off” a Grand Marquis. The factors of momentum and wind resistance are all that matter at 80 on the highway and in that regard the Volt and Grand Marquis are about equal.

I can assure you that the Grand Marquis does NOT get 33 mpg at eighty ...

And you are wrong. Momentum has nothing to do with the mileage unless you are going up and down hills. You forgot to factor in all the mechanical losses. The GM has more losses in the drive train which eats up gasoline. I take it you are not an engineer.

[SeeSac]

Your unproven claim is that 33 “blows the socks off” a Grand Marquis.

You stated the GM gets in the high 20's (really doubtful at 80 but nevermind the details). I gave you a link for the Volt (33 at 78). Not even close.

[palmer]

Mercury. Same as Crown Vic, I gather you have never driven one at 80? It’s comfortable, quiet and quite fuel efficient. The volt with its gas engine running full time at that speed will be comparable. Perhaps your laws of physics are different from those in the real world?

[SeeSac]

Perhaps your laws of physics are different from those in the real world?

Perhaps you will take the time to show me where you think my laws of physics are incorrect instead of popping off on a subject you have no background in.

[SeeSac]

The volt with its gas engine running full time at that speed will be comparable.

The Volt in real world use gets 33 at 78 mph. The GM gets how much? Low 20's?

[palmer]

28 to 29.

[GunRunner]

truthguy, are you saying that IBD lied about the true MPG in testing?

I think with as much unpaid whoring as you've done for this car and GM truthguy, you owe us a response on this question.

I mean, they're singing your praises over at DU:

One lone poster called "truthguy" is trying to talk sense into the others, but it ain't workin'.

IBD is claiming that not only are the MPG numbers for the Volt wrong as broadcast by GM and the administration, they almost constitute criminal fraud. Are Obama and GM correct in their claims about the Volt's mpg capabilities or not?

[truthguy]

truthguy, are you saying that IBD lied about the true MPG in testing?
I think with as much unpaid whoring as you've done for this car and GM truthguy, you owe us a response on this question.
I mean, they're singing your praises over at DU:
One lone poster called "truthguy" is trying to talk sense into the others, but it ain't workin'.
IBD is claiming that not only are the MPG numbers for the Volt wrong as broadcast by GM and the administration, they almost constitute criminal fraud. Are Obama and GM correct in their claims about the Volt's mpg capabilities or not?

Ok, I have the time to respond to some of your questions:

Yes, IBD didn't state the facts correctly. Accessing the MPG on the Volt is difficult because it depends on your driving patterns. If you only use it as a commuter vehicle and you stay under 40 miles per day, then in theory you would get infinite gas mileage. But that's ludicrous. The 230mpg figure came from a formula given to GM from the Dept of Transportation. Using their data, they came up with 230mpg. So they didn't lie. It's all about driving patterns. The DOT is still struggling to come up with numbers for the Volt. It has them puzzled.

I have no control on what DU says about me. I've never been on their website till today when I was linked there from your post. From what I've read DU is scum. Leave it at that for now.

I'm not a shrill for GM and have never worked for them or any other Auto Company. I'm simply someone who has always been fascinated by electric drive. So to conclude I will leave you with a post I made back in July. This will explain my interest in electric drive and why I'm enthusiastic about the Chevy Volt. Lastly check out my postings and you will not find a bigger critic of Obama than me. Nov 5, 2008 was one of the worst days of my life. I've posted many times about Obama. Check it out. Here's my post from July explaining my views on the Volt:

Why your affection and support for GM?

I'm an electrical engineer and for all of my professional life I've been fascinated by and interested in electric drive. Electric Motors have always been more efficient than ICE. This has been know forever. They have instant torque. This is why many countries have them for their passenger rail system. Most other locomotive are diesel electrics. In a diesel locomotive the diesel engine generates electricity and the electric motor powers the drive. In this way you can get heavy loads moving at very slow speed. Anyway electric motors have tremendous advantages over ICE. But no one have ever solved the problem of a practical way of getting electricity to a motor in a passenger car. Batteries were heavy, and didn't last long. This is why electric cars never caught on. Even Thomas Edison worked on this but concluded that the battery technology wasn't there. You see a gallon of gasoline weighs 7 pounds. No battery in the world has as much energy for that weight. But now along comes Lithium Ion technology. Much lighter and much longer lasting. Much faster recharging. Bob Lutz (GM hero) had the idea that a battery that would satisfy most American commutes AND could also give you an extended range feature when you wanted to go farther just might have a market. So GM started working on this concept back about 2005-6. The Volt was the result of this. You can read about it in detail at GM-Volt.com. I get a lot of grief about supporting GM and also Chrysler. Many think I'm a Obama supporter in disguise. Nothing could be further from the truth. I despise this man and his administration as much as anyone on this site. But remember the Volt was conceived of long before Obama came along. I'll be damned if I allow him to take any credit for this without making a stink. I also hate the UAW with a passion. They are responsible for most of the problems in the Auto Industry. But we still need American Manufacturing and GM and Chrysler (and Ford) are a huge part of it. Obama and his people orchestrated a lousy deal for GM (and Chrysler) but what choice did they have? Do people think we would have been better off if both companies would have gone Chapter 7? Would any good come out of that? I don't think so. So I'm encouraged by the new EREV technology. I'm hoping the Volt is a sucess. I've been following it very closely for nearly 3 years so I have knowledge most of the posters here do not. Many of them are lashing out stupidly. They are angry and I don't blame them. GM should have been allowed to go through a standard Chapter 11. And remember this. GM was moving as fast as they could to make the necessary changes to their company when they got clobbered by this nasty recession. If not for this recession (government caused) GM would have been able to make it without a bailout. I hope this explains where I'm coming from.