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Green Dreams Shattered: EU Biofuels Program Will Increase Carbon Emissions
Somewhat Reasonable ^ | 11/11/10 | Jim Lakely

Posted on 11/11/2010 8:01:08 AM PST by seamus

I love all those "green future" commercials companies like Exxon and BP ("Beyond Petroleum") run. They never fail to get a chuckle out of me, no matter how often I see them.

I can’t remember who is responsible for the latest one in which an “engineer” and a “teacher” (both actors, of course) speak almost simultaneously in split screen. They both talk about how we need to get off of carbon-based fuels like petroleum. I’ve only seen it once — and will likely see it 100 times more — but my initial guffaw line was when the “teacher,” in exasperation, wonders why our cars aren’t running on compost already! … or something.

The Heartland Institute has labored mightily over the last several years to expose the “green economy” scam. So it’s nice to see the MSM — at least in Britain — get wise and report on it. The November 10 Independent of London reports a story with the headline: “Biofuel plan will cause rise in carbon emissions.” You don’t say!

The first four graphs of the story lay it out in refreshingly clear terms:

Britain’s promise to more than double its use of biofuels by 2020 is “significantly” adding to worldwide carbon emissions, the Government admitted yesterday. Britain is signed up to a European guarantee to source 10 per cent of its transport fuel from renewable sources, such as biofuels, within the next 10 years. ...

(Excerpt) Read more at somewhatreasonable.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: belongsinbloggers; biofuels; climate; climatechange; envirofascism; eu; globalwarming; globalwarminghoax

1 posted on 11/11/2010 8:01:18 AM PST by seamus
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To: seamus

No matter what the project, plan or promise ... if the loony left supports it, you KNOW it’s a lie.


2 posted on 11/11/2010 8:03:46 AM PST by oh8eleven (RVN '67-'68)
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To: seamus

It doesn’t matter. This isn’t about carbon. It’s about envy. Leftists want to punish people who use energy.


3 posted on 11/11/2010 8:06:50 AM PST by Hoodat ( .For the weapons of our warfare are mighty in God for pulling down strongholds.d)
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To: seamus

Instead of taking the consumers tax dollars to create something that costs the consumer more money to have, try letting the marketplace create something that will save the consumer money and is affordable enough to make the consumer want it more than anything else.


4 posted on 11/11/2010 8:11:32 AM PST by Dixie Yooper (Ephesians 6:11)
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To: seamus

Oops.


5 posted on 11/11/2010 8:19:29 AM PST by savedbygrace (But God.)
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To: Hoodat
Leftists want to punish people who use energy.
That's more like it! ;-) Global Warming, Climate Change, Global Climate Disruption ... whatever the left calls it doesn't matter. This has never been about saving the planet. It's been, from the start, about controlling the people who live on the planet -- which is reason enough to resist even if the science wasn't bogus.
6 posted on 11/11/2010 8:27:45 AM PST by seamus
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To: seamus; NormsRevenge; steelyourfaith; Grampa Dave; SierraWasp; tubebender; Carry_Okie; ...

Well....now what?


7 posted on 11/11/2010 8:40:17 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach ( Support Geert Wilders)
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**********************************EXCERPT******************************************

The study, from the Institute for European Environmental Policy, found that far from being 35 to 50 per cent less polluting, as required by the European Directive, the extra biofuels will be twice as bad for the environment.

8 posted on 11/11/2010 8:41:52 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach ( Support Geert Wilders)
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*******************************************EXCERPT****************************************

This is yet another reason why it’s a shame that Prop 23 didn’t pass in California. The voters of the former Golden State condemned their economy to stagnation because they believed the fantasy that a major industrial economy can simply state that they will “go green” and (1) it will not result in economic disaster and (2) it’s even a “good” thing for the environment.

9 posted on 11/11/2010 8:44:07 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach ( Support Geert Wilders)
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To: seamus
Britain’s promise to more than double its use of biofuels by 2020 is “significantly” adding to worldwide carbon emissions, the Government admitted yesterday.

They are idiots, and I know this is not news to anyone other than the Kos/DU trolls who occasionally lurk. Without getting terribly advanced, a little technical but not overboard at least, all educated people who think for themselves should be able to recognize that biofuels have no net carbon emissions. Zero. None. Zilch. Nada.

Suppose that I decide to grow corn, soy, and switchgrass for biofuel purposes. When they are burned, they will, of course, release all that carbon into the air. But where did the carbon in my switchgrass come from? Hint: high school biology; 6CO2 + 6H2O + Energy ---> C6H12O6 + 6O2 [carbon dioxide plus water plus sunlight gives sugar plus oxygen]. The carbon in our biofuel crops comes from . . . atmospheric CO2.

The morons in the environmental movement are somewhat silly to count CO2 as pollution at all, but to count a closed cycle with no net CO2 release at all as worse than the open cycle that releases carbon from coal or from oil is insane even by environmentalist standards.

10 posted on 11/11/2010 8:54:18 AM PST by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: Pollster1

A little picture of what I said. All carbon in plant matter comes from the air. Growing crops for biofuels, burning them, and re-releasing the carbon is carbon neutral.

11 posted on 11/11/2010 8:56:39 AM PST by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: seamus

He has missed the ignorant GE commercials with the neon green posts sticking out of the fround that everyone is suppose to plug in thier “electric” car.
And don’t forget their mercury lightbulbs.

I wonder if “mad cow disease” was really a disease?

If it comes from a greenie it is a LIE.


12 posted on 11/11/2010 8:57:19 AM PST by Marty62 (Marty 60)
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To: seamus
Blasphemy! ...... Call out ............ The Spanish Inquisition ...........
13 posted on 11/11/2010 9:00:32 AM PST by fella (.He that followeth after vain persons shall have poverty enough." Pv.28:19')
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To: Pollster1
Doesn't the making of ethanol...( The actual distilling, or whatever they do...) take energy of some sort?

Isn't that the point they are making.

14 posted on 11/11/2010 9:07:24 AM PST by Osage Orange (MOLON LABE)
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To: Pollster1
From the UK article:
This is because Europe will need to cultivate an area somewhere between the size of Belgium and the Republic of Ireland with biofuels to meet the target, which can only be done through land conversion – and more controversially, deforestation. The work will be on such a scale that the carbon released from the vegetation, trees and soil will be far greater than those given off by fossil fuels they are designed to replace.

15 posted on 11/11/2010 9:14:40 AM PST by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: oh8eleven
No matter what the project, plan or promise ... if the loony left supports it, you KNOW it’s a lie.

Of course, which is why the major stockholders of energy companies are big donors to green groups. In fact, I have never seen a major environmental initiative that did not consume MORE oil and gas. Not one. Everything from replacing trees with cement and plastic to the pumping and transportation of raw material feedstocks, it's all the same.

16 posted on 11/11/2010 9:16:34 AM PST by Carry_Okie (Grovelnator Schwarzenkaiser, fashionable fascism one charade at a time.)
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To: Pollster1
OTOH, cutting trees, converting them to charcoal, and burying the charcoal as a soil amendment that accelerates the accumulation of carbon in soil as decaying roots is not a carbon-neutral process.

I don't give a hang about anthropogenic CO2, but I do think improving soil fertility is a big deal, particularly in mesic and xeric systems.

17 posted on 11/11/2010 9:20:57 AM PST by Carry_Okie (Grovelnator Schwarzenkaiser, fashionable fascism one charade at a time.)
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To: Pollster1
All carbon in plant matter comes from the air. Growing crops for biofuels, burning them, and re-releasing the carbon is carbon neutral.

Good point. However, you can go even beyond that. The net OXYGEN production of any tree, plant, or grass, from seed through growth and maturity to death and decay, is exactly ZERO. Planting trees, or anything else, does not add one single oxygen molecule to the atmosphere, once you take into account the fact that after the plant dies, it will be oxidized again (burned, eaten by termites, etc.).

18 posted on 11/11/2010 9:30:23 AM PST by JoeFromSidney ( New book, RESISTANCE TO TYRANNY. More @ www.book-resistancetotyranny.com)
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To: Osage Orange
Doesn't the making of ethanol...( The actual distilling, or whatever they do...) take energy of some sort? Isn't that the point they are making.

I don't think that was their point. The actual energy for distilling is relatively low because of the use of heat exchangers. One of their points was the deforestation for crops, but I didn't find that convincing either. My impression is that we have farmland that is no longer used for that purpose as crop yields continue to rise, so there is no major need for new deforestation.

19 posted on 11/11/2010 10:32:09 AM PST by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: Pollster1

As long as we don’t care about eating maybe.

Then again refining those things into fuels is also causing pollution


20 posted on 11/11/2010 10:37:32 AM PST by GeronL (http://libertyfic.proboards.com <--- My Fiction/ Science Fiction Board)
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To: seamus

It’s about time people got a memo about what the French got right. Yes Nuclear Energy, a nuclear power grid. It’s about time America got more nuclear too.

Come on folks, nuclear energy is the future! WHY TRY TO GET AROUND IT?!!!!


21 posted on 11/11/2010 10:50:18 AM PST by Morpheus2009
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To: Osage Orange
Doesn't the making of ethanol...( The actual distilling, or whatever they do...) take energy of some sort? Isn't that the point they are making?
This is correct. Studies in the US have shown that the net-energy expense is either equal or exceeds what it takes to produce ethanol, truck it to refineries, add the right mixture, etc. And then there's the separate issue of how taking corn out of the food supply and pouring it into our gas tanks artificially inflate food prices -- all done with enormous taxpayer subsidies to the ethanol industry. It's a sick cycle.
22 posted on 11/11/2010 1:38:01 PM PST by seamus
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To: seamus

btt


23 posted on 11/11/2010 3:49:52 PM PST by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach; Clive; scripter; Darnright; WL-law; bamahead; carolinablonde; SolitaryMan; ...
Thanx Ernest !

 


Beam me to Planet Gore !

24 posted on 11/11/2010 4:03:20 PM PST by steelyourfaith (ObamaCare Death Panels: a Final Solution to the looming Social Security crisis ?)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

It just gets better and better, doesn’t it?

I’ve noticed lately that there is less and less talk about “global warming” and “climate change”. The BS is starting to dissipate, even though the slimestream media doesn’t want to report on the discoveries of all the fraudulent claims, the vast amount of money that was intended to be sucked out of the populace and basically what was the grandest fraud/scam ever attempted. It’s the story of the new century, yet what do we hear from them?

Crickets.


25 posted on 11/11/2010 4:42:50 PM PST by chilltherats (He was born with a roaring voice, and it had the trick of inflaming half-wits against their betters)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach; AdmSmith; Arthur Wildfire! March; Berosus; bigheadfred; ColdOne; ...
It ain't about biofuels, it's about gov't programs -- the latter are not designed to actually accomplish what they're said to be for, but rather to put some money in certain people's pockets. :') Thanks Ernest.
26 posted on 11/11/2010 5:52:58 PM PST by SunkenCiv (The 2nd Amendment follows right behind the 1st because some people are hard of hearing.)
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Mostly the results from a "green" title search: Note the spin in the second version: Obama's earlier plan, spin cut out, stupidity left in:
27 posted on 11/11/2010 5:54:48 PM PST by SunkenCiv (The 2nd Amendment follows right behind the 1st because some people are hard of hearing.)
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To: Pollster1
The actual energy for distilling is relatively low because of the use of heat exchangers.

What does that mean?

The heat input to the heat exchangers is energy and has to come from somewhere.

28 posted on 11/11/2010 6:39:26 PM PST by SteamShovel (UTOPIA...Isn't)
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To: seamus

29 posted on 11/11/2010 10:23:17 PM PST by VeniVidiVici (Defund National Peoples Radio!! Democrats are for free speech. Just not for you.)
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To: SteamShovel
"The actual energy for distilling is relatively low because of the use of heat exchangers." What does that mean? The heat input to the heat exchangers is energy and has to come from somewhere.

The energy input lasts a long time and distills quite a bit of alcohol or whatever you are processing out of the biofuel mass. It's quite efficient compared to the country still making moonshine that we often visualize.

30 posted on 11/12/2010 2:26:54 AM PST by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: VeniVidiVici

Nice image, Veni.


31 posted on 11/12/2010 7:00:54 AM PST by seamus
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To: Pollster1
The energy input lasts a long time and distills quite a bit of alcohol or whatever you are processing out of the biofuel mass. It's quite efficient compared to the country still making moonshine that we often visualize.

So you are saying the fermentation creates heat that is then recovered and used in other areas of the process, if I read that correctly.

32 posted on 11/12/2010 3:47:42 PM PST by SteamShovel (UTOPIA...Isn't)
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To: SteamShovel
So you are saying the fermentation creates heat that is then recovered and used in other areas of the process, if I read that correctly.

Not quite. Fermentation only produces a little heat, too little to recapture profitably. It's distillation that allows for reusing the heat through a regenerative heat exchange system. As alcohol-free liquid flows out, it pre-heats the alcohol-laden fluid that is ready to be distilled, cooling to room temperature as the fluid is heated to near the boiling point with negligible loss. The design is copied from nature:

"Counter Current Circulation": Arctic animals try to keep their temperature constant, but their legs remain cold, while their head and body core remain warm. This seems like a difficult feat, but with an adaptation called countercurrent heat exchange it requires little energy. In this system of circulation arteries, which carry warm blood from the heart to the extremities, lie very close to the veins, which carry blood from the cold extremities of the body back to the heart. In this way, heat from the warm arterial blood is transferred to the colder blood in a vein, thereby cooling the blood in the artery and warming the venous blood. Thus, as blood from the body reaches the extremities, it is already cooled and loses very little additional heat to the environment. Conversely, cool blood from the extremities is warmed prior to reaching the body core and does not shock the heart or reduce internal body temperature. The countercurrent exchange system has been well studied in both the arctic fox and the caribou, which maintain their core temperature nearly 30°C higher than their appendages.

33 posted on 11/13/2010 2:46:18 AM PST by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
"Well....now what?"
I could asked the same question.
34 posted on 11/13/2010 7:45:15 AM PST by Marine_Uncle (Honor must be earned....)
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To: Goldie Lurks

fyi


35 posted on 11/13/2010 1:10:10 PM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach ( Support Geert Wilders)
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