L.A. contrail a missile launch? Retired general thinks so (op-ed)

Daily Inter Lake.com ^ | Sunday, November 21, 2010 2:00 am | Updated: 8:13 am, Sun Nov 21, 2010. | Jim Cash, retired brigadier general, U.S. Air Force

[TXnMA]

You have copied and pasted this idiotic post on at least three 3) threads.

The first time you did it, I called you on it and pointed out that you were making an invalid comparison:

"Also, use your (appropriate adjective) powers of observation and notice that the two photos you posted were at two different zoom magnifications. Think that might affect your conclusions?"

Well, apparently "getting a clue" doesn't help you -- because you posted -- verbatim -- that same entire WRONG post (at least) twice more -- including this one.

Here are the two frames - carefully superimposed. Of course, I had to magnify the second photo (taken with 210mm focal length) ~154% to make it match the first one (taken at 300mm focal length.)

Still think that's "comical CGI"? (And it was composited from the raw Warren files -- by me, TXnMA -- not by your so-called, "silly" contrailscience.com website.)

Still want to stand by your (triply-repeated) statement (for which I retired my Texan description):

"Those two photos are clearly NOT taken from the same location OR the clouds moved quite a bit from one shot to the next."

??? Well, do you????

~~~~~~~~~

Are you familiar with the term, "mental laziness"?

[TigersEye]

What I love most about those pics is they show the plane flying sideways faster than it moves forward. Really cool!!!

[TXnMA]

"What I love most about those pics is they show the plane flying sideways faster than it moves forward. "

Which only highlights your ignorance of the well-known relative angular velocity compression/expansion effects of long lenses. If I feel like it tomorrow, I may look up an explanatory post I made for another FReeper and point you to it.

Any experienced photographer would find your comment laughable...

[Dagnabitt]

I cannot beleive anyone is still flogging the mystery missle myth at this point.

Perhaps in about a year's time, FR should allow former Missileers to quitely delete their embarassing posts on the matter.

[TXnMA]

Yeah, the silence of the responses to all the challenges I posted last night is deafening. The MSM dupes/shills are running short on arguments... ;-)

[CodeToad]

““spin stabilized missile.””

Which missile is that exactly? I think you are confusing bullets with missiles.

[CodeToad]

“Anyone who knows anything about these matters “

Which obviously isn’t you. I’ve never seen a missile hang out for 10 minutes before and I’ve launched far more missiles than you’ve had birthdays. In 10 minutes any sub launched missile is long gone and over the horizon, not hanging out for paparazzi.

[piytar]

You show up how many days after the thread is essentially dead to toss out that tidbit? Really? LOL. Guess the General is an idiot, too, eh? Again, LOL...

[Dagnabitt]

If the facts, evidence and common sense are overwhelmingly against one's fantasy, then an "appeal to authority" might be the best option. But:

How many retired USAF generals are there in the USA?
Hundreds? A thousand?

How many besides this elderly gentleman have come out in support of the "secret missile from secret submarine operated by secret enemy flying to secret destination for secret reason" theory?

[piytar]

Really? Why are you two revisiting this dead thread and piling on? It’s kind of silly. I may have overstated, but I’m not being “conspiracy nuts” thinking that might have been a missile.

BTW, I’ll appeal to authority again: OldMissileer, who has more personal knowledge about missiles than you, me, and that other commenter combined, timely corrected some of my mistakes. However, he apparently hasn’t come to a conclusion. My take is that there is a chance it was a missile. (My guess is if it was a missile, it was a jihadi’s slow junk scud style missile shot from a cargo container that went way off course, as those are wont to do.)

That said, your timing, dismissiveness, and condescension are amusing. Your decision to revisit this dead thread is weird.

PS Copied you OldMissileer because I mentioned you. Know you’re sick of this debate, but wanted to abide by the posting customs.

PPS Contrails and missile exhaust do last a while. That said, “10 minutes” is pure hyperbole.

[piytar]

Oh, there aren’t two of you, just you. My bad.

Gonna watch Wisc cream NW now (dang). Have fun on the dead thread.

[DontTreadOnMe2009]

Former Assistant Director at NORAD, General Jim Cash says “there is absolutely no doubt that what was captured on video off the coast of California was a missile launch !!!”!”

[TigersEye]

I keep getting pinged back to it, Dograbbit.

[aruanan]

I did not convince you of anything. Your brain computed truth. Everyone who looked at this video and immediately saw a missile launch, were computing all that same information with regard to light angles, etc., subconsciously, intuitively. Our subconcious powers are mighty and it is idiotic to ignore or work against them.

Ha ha ha. If that's so, then why is the history of science and technology littered with the corpses of what the purveyors were convinced was the computed truth of mighty subconscious powers against which it was idiotic to work? Think phlogiston, abiogenesis (the Spallanzani one, not the one currently in fashion, though it's just as flawed), phrenology, the homunculus theory, and the "law of nature" that an electrical generator could never exceed 50% efficiency (See Edison, His Life and Inventions, Vol 2, pp 868-9) as just a few examples.

[TigersEye]

Which only highlights your ignorance of the well-known relative angular velocity compression/expansion effects of long lenses.

There used to be a guy in town that lived under bridges that talked like that. He finally started taking his meds.

[aruanan]

And finally, why is it that despite thousands upon thousands of photos of actual missile launches, none look like the photo taken off the coast of California? Given that you can actually identify an object leaving the "trail", if it were a missile, it is still expelling exhaust and must still be in its boost phase. That means it is still accelerating and unless it is flying horizontally (which you obviously don't agree with) must be climbing at several times the speed of sound. Yet, even in the video, it just kind of sits there toward the end. Nothing like any rocket or missile ever photographed or filmed. How do you explain that?

Hey, no fair, bringing reality into this discussion! The reason that it was still expelling exhaust many minutes longer than the longest known ICBM kind of missile and just appearing to sit there must necessarily be, since it is undoubtedly a missile, that it is a special, hitherto-unknown sort of missile that is made to travel more slowly through decreasing acceleration as well as to expel a chemical in its exhaust that keeps its color consistent so as to appear to be a contrail of a jet flying horizontal to the earth at this time of day. That is, it is a cleverly disguised missile that has probably landed at a nearby airport and is sitting there appearing to be a jet, only waiting for the right moment to detonate and blow the airport off the face of the earth.

[aruanan]

People have so much ego invested that when I and others note our personal experience witnessing real launches, those who haven't interpret it as "bragging" and thereby give themselves an excuse to discount our more qualified comparisons.

I don't think you're bragging, just mistaken.

[CodeToad]

“Guess the General is an idiot, too, eh?”

Being a General doesn’t make one right. But, I guess since you want to be a drama queen and sound the alarm that someone fired a missle, go ahead, even though that optical illusion violates the laws of physics and known missile performance. You just go ahead and be feeble minded enough to believe your lying eyes because your brain doesn’t know the difference.

[Finny]

C-Toad says to piytar: I guess since you want to be a drama queen and sound the alarm that someone fired a missle, go ahead, even though that optical illusion violates the laws of physics and known missile performance. You just go ahead and be feeble minded enough to believe your lying eyes because your brain doesn’t know the difference.

In other words, C-Toad must assume an IMMENSE amount of stupidity, kookiness, incompetence, and feeble-mindedness on the part of a wide range of people with either or both professional and empirical experience of the phenomenon in question. He MUST make that assumption in order to believe what he needs to believe.

Meanwhile, speaking for myself, I know perfectly well that FReepers like C Toad and Aruanan are as sane, smart, competent, and intelligent as me or any other long-time established FReeper. I do not, and never have, accused FReepers who fall for the airplane cover story as being "feeble-minded," and never will. I DO accuse them of being either frightened OR arrogant, overrating their own skills, and flattering themselves (or allowing themselves to be flattered) that they are "smarter" and "calmer" than people who've actually had quite a lot of empirical experience in comparable events at the location AND with the phenomenon in the Leyvas' video, as well as genuine airline contrails in the same location.

[piytar]

“But, I guess since you want to be a drama queen.”

Look in the mirror, bub. LOL.