Skip to comments.Senate clears way for 'don't ask don't tell' repeal
Posted on 12/18/2010 9:33:26 AM PST by RatherBiased.com
The Senate has just voted to end debate on a bill that would lift the ban on gays serving openly in the military, essentially clearing the measure for passage and signature by the president.
Lawmakers voted 63 to 33 to end debate on the current policy, put in place by former president Bill Clinton, informally known as "don't ask don't tell."
The Senate could vote on final passage of the measure as early as today but it will most likely happen on Sunday or Monday.
"We are on the verge of ending 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' for good," Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., said after the vote "This is one of those moments in our history when we stepped up and squared our policies with the values this nation was founded upon."
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonexaminer.com ...
This is really mind boggling in its stupidity, beyond the disgust in engenders.
[Answer a question for me, if a gay person goes to battle for this country and dies in the process, is his sacrifice less than a heterosexuals?]
No, but when half a platoon is gay and the hetero half is descriminated against by the leader, and it is time to go into battle and one half of the platoon gets fragged by the other half, then the sacrifice for the homos has been devastating. You have no idea what harm this will cause.
I see no reason to speculate. I guess I am still trying to understand what is the positive benefit to the gay solder / sailor / airman / Marine?
I just do not see it. And I suspect the ones who pushed this do not care anything about those people. "Leave well enough alone" never applies to those in a wrecking mentality.
Your comment here though, "Think of the cost: will our military now pay for AIDS treatment for openly gay soldiers? For housing for domestic partners and their health care? For adoption services for gays? This is a big hot mess that takes away from the militarys mission." deserves more attention and others have mentioned the cost to the military for this nonsense. This is for the FisCons who always keep reminding us that we should focus on the economic issues and don't bother with the social issues. Here's how a social issue ties directly with an economic one.
This nation is broke. Period. That is a fact. How are we going to afford this change in policy, which will run into the billions? Remember now, the same bunch in Congress pushing for homosexuals to serve openly is usually the same bunch who always, without fail, want to cut the defense budget, stop funding weapons and defense systems and make sure our troops don't have what they need to win.
So, they will vote to stop funding missile defense systems, etc. but they will order the Pentagon to allow homosexuals to have housing, BAQ, and order sensitivity training to those who refuse to bow at the altar of political correctness, etc. all of which COSTS MONEY?! Not to mention the increase in sexual harassment lawsuits because homosexuals are a "protected class" now and anything they do, it's the other guy's fault. The unintended consequences of this is going to be very costly.
And something else. Let's say folks do start dropping out of the military because they refuse to work with open homosexuals. Suppose recruitment numbers fall below target, then what? Reinstate the draft? Okay. Make sure open homosexuals and those who cheered them on are the FIRST ones drafted though. Wonder how many of them will flee to Canada, after cheering for this crap?
And I value (both of) your side(s) of the discussion. I will consider your words.
Well if i state what I wanted to truly say I would be banned from FR. My tagline I have had to change because the moderator did not like it.
having been a Marine, this is going to cause trouble in the military if it passes. Notice a republican whom voted Scott Brown All I can say is Brown is a RINO, and he is yellow and he fits right into the new Democrat Logo. It reminds me of the toilet. Yellow let it mellow and Brown goes down. brown has no backbone and no cahhones (sp).
Remember the myth of "Jessica Lynch as Zena, Warrior Princess"? That was contrived by feminist activists in the Pentagon who wanted so desperately to get women into ground combat MOSes. The facts came back to blow up in their faces then, and it will eventually blow up in the homo's faces as well (no pun intended). Only problem is, it will be too late, and irreparable damage will have been done to our national security.
I served in the US Army from 1985-1996, and attitudes would have to had a shift of catastrophic proportions in those 14 years for that survey to be accurate.
Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!
I guess the question is, why is conservative talk radio so afraid of homosexual activism? Are hosts being intimidated or just unprincipled, caring more about ratings and avoiding boycotts?
good question .
I do not know if the likes of Hannity agrees with the homosexual agenda and will not say so as he will lose viewers or he does not agree and has been silenced or he does not want to be called a name by the pro MSM .
Either way I do think it would be good and about time that he and others now spoke up and got involved in this conservative fight instead of always talking budget like Hannity does.
He’s sounding like a broken record .
If people knew what their agenda was and saw their freak parades then the public would be outraged and rise against their agenda IMHO.
You're so right. But they'll be doing it without my teenaged sibling who for years was looking forward to signing up in 2011. We're very sad about it.
Wouldn’t it be better to give the rest of us a chance to speak reason to people.. to DEBATE.. rather than just ZOT everone who doesn’t toe your line?
So, if they can pass this, what would be wrong with coed showers in the military?
“Imagine now going on base and seeing two men kissing or some men wearing women’s clothes after work?”
I noticed recently there has been more and more references to transgender along with gay and lesbian in reference to DADT. I believe that the military will be forced to eventually accept transgender as depedents and eventually recruits. Or at least after repeal of DOMA that is the intent. I am a former Marine as well, Devil Dogs imagine what the “Ball” will look like 5 years from now? Two male Marines in dress blues slow dance and.....barf. Sorry guys!
Actually the rise in homosexuality may be a consequence of single parent families from divorce, and adultery can include homosexuality. So, hey, its all on the road to hell.
They have made their minds up due to crap of “well I know one and they’re nice” or some are simply trolls pushing their agenda , you know like sign up and leave a post then quickly disappear to post on another thread., aren’t they?
We’re not a liberal debating society. We do not debate those who are trying to destroy our Liberty. We zot them.
Well stated and completely true.
Having served 6 years in the silent service I can only see problems with this. It is bad enough that these idiots push for women on submarines expecting no problems. I see many problems coming not including those unintended that these clueless social engineers without any perspective could never imagine. It is always the same with these elite types who 'feel' they know better how to dig the ditch than those who actually are in the trenches breaking their backs doing the work...
Imagine the new recruits finding out when they graduate, and even worse for the poolees!
Well, that last zottee had been around since 2001. Express an opinion.. get zotted. super.
Its too late, Monday gays will be official and they can complain but Sean has not even had Elaine Donnelly on recently. I am done with both as so many others should be. Rush has spent more time on his beloved Steelers than this or any other social topic, He is going the way of Arnold. Marry a liberal become a liberal.
I served in the Army for 11 years, ruining a knee and both shoulders in the process. My father, brother, one uncle and one grandfather served in either the Army or the Air Force. I still have a few buddies in uniform, and have had a couple who were killed or maimed in the service of our nation.
If homos are allowed to serve openly and defiantly in the military, it will be because the Obammunist, Congress, the sodomite lobby, and today's "don't know, don't care" American citizenry (the vast majority of which has never served a day in boots), took a big collective dump on my service, the service of my family members, the service of my buddies who have sacrificed their bodies or their lives, and each and every American who served before us. Mad? That doesn't even begin to describe it. Spitting nails is a little closer to accurate, but I can't use the words I need to fully describe my thoughts and feelings on this forum.
Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!
yea... I see that.
Personally, I didn't feel my "liberty" all that threatened by post #54. It was an opinion... that was being rebutted, effectively.. IMHO.
Why are you so afraid of debate?
I hope everyone voting yes today on repealing DADT comes down with scabies.
C-Span will talk to the senators after the vote.
VA needs to find a solid GOP candidate one the Tea Party will back. Fire Webb and make sure this his DADT vote is one of many reasons to fire him. VA voted against Bush more than for Webb, time to make them vote against Webb.
Guess I’m a better shot than debater?
Seriously, newbie, I don’t want FR’s pages filled with obnoxious leftist pushing tripe. Don’t like it? Move on to a less exclusive God, Family, Country, Life & Liberty site!!
so what is the policy now? ask and do tell?
It will be. How else can they make sure that gays aren’t being “discriminated” against in promotions, assignments, evaluations, etc. unless they have a way to track it? There will be a data field for it in all the personnel systems just as there is for race and gender. Count on it.
Thank you for your service. I have never served, but mad doesn't begin to describe it for me either. To your point in a previous post about, "Zena the Warrior myth": I speak as a woman and will be the first to say I am no warrior. Yes, I would fight to the death to protect myself and my family, however, I am no match for a man. No woman is and the ones that were pushing that agenda knew it. I look for them to be back to pushing the very same agenda soon.
And what will you say to the young soldier or Marine who contracts AIDS from a future battlefield blood transfusion, because the blood used to save his life came from the arm of one of the homos serving in his unit? After all, even in today's relatively low-intensity combat in Iraq and Afghanistan, safe, tested blood doesn't always reach field hospitals in sufficient quantities, or on time. So, as soldiers have always had to do, even today, they roll up their sleeves and donate blood which goes right into their wounded buddies.
According to the CDC, and to common sense, AIDS has always been, is still, and will always be a male homosexual disease. Each and every homo we allow to serve in the military weakens us that much more, for that reason alone. That doesn't even take into consideration that the presence of even a single homo weakens unit cohesion, which I have seen first hand. Our military is on the verge of being stabbed in the back, weakened, and set up for defeat on some future battlefield. Lord, please forgive us.
Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!
Seriously, newbie, I dont want FRs pages filled with obnoxious leftist pushing tripe. Dont like it? Move on to a less exclusive God, Family, Country, Life & Liberty site!!
Newbie??? Really?? That's all you got? Damn, you really DO stink at debating....
With all due respect Jim, zotting "obnoxious leftist" is a good thing... NO ONE wants that here. But, "codercpc" was far from an "obnoxious leftist"... She was a long-time Freeper who has gotten a little twisted in her opinion on this issue. I think, she was recoverable... with a little help from people who could explain the flaws in her logic.
Are you just ZOTTING people today to release the anger over passage of DADT?
Not all things are open to debate. There are truths self evident and there is the natural law -these 'things' not open to debate premise the foundation of this great nation.
You want to debate the merits of anything premised in homosexual sex which objectively is counter to natural law go to DU and join in with other 'open minded' debate idiots.
I’m outraged enough for both of us.
The Army already has a policy where if a soldier contracts HIV (not full-blown AIDS), then they will not discharge him/her. Not only that, but that soldier also becomes PERMANENTLY nondeployable and will not be assigned to duty outside of the United States. So, now, they’re basically taking stateside assignments away from other soldiers and other soldiers have to deploy more often because these soldiers cannot deploy. I don’t know what the policies are in the other branches, but I would guess that they’re probably similar.
there is no debating these people, they have made their minds up and certainly they always try the civil right equal rights angle.
Well because they like hairy arse should we then give equal rights to people who have sex with animals to get off?
Should those with 9 wives have the same equal rights.
All of this is based on how they get off and what turns them on.
I hope you rethink this, or at least keep your contempt under wraps when you meet those who enlisted after today. I will still respect those who enlist or reenlist to protect us. I may disagree with changes, but I won't take it out on those who serve.
Laws being DEBATED on the floor of Congress should be open to debate in a land of LIBERTY.
Just ignoring the opinions of people who don't agree with you won't make them go away. You have to CHANGE hearts, and minds.... with logic and discussion.. and, sometimes, time.
Look pal, I shouldn’t have to explain and reexplain my policies over and over and over again. FR is not and has never been a liberal debating society. I’ve been zotting liberals, abortionists, homosexualists, environmentalists, gun-grabbers, big government tax and spenders, socialists, progressives and other assorted trolls since inception. If you seriously have a problem with that, then you are on the wrong web site.
is it so hard to understand?
This is not a site to push the homosexual agenda and note they are not gay either.
This message is for trolls coming on the site new old and it seems quite simple to understand.
In the case of gay activists, I agree with you. They've got their own perverted personal lifestyles they're trying to get others to accept. There's no debate possible with them.
codercpc didn't strike me as one of those people... Just as someone trying to rationalize what they see happening in the Congress.
Maybe.. I couldn't really say though... I have no real history with that poster.
See post #14. Only after you respond to that and admit your sentence made no sense do we have a basis on which to have a conversation.
It has passed now.
Huge pandora’s box has just opened.
Exactly. The fundamental building blocks and supports of our society are being premised on how a minority of perverts wants to have sex. Unbelievable.
That’s not what FR is about.
I know... It SUCKS! (no pun intented)
In fairness, if you go back and look at the posts, I don’t think codercpc was trolling. Wrong? Yes. Misguided? Yes. Trolling? No.
The other one that Jim zotted was a troll for sure. There’s a third on the thread who somehow managed to escape unscathed, but he’s a raving NYC social leftist from way back anyways, so I guess Jim’s just used to his antics.
what on you on, where are you in our state?
You have not answered one question about eh homosexual agenda why is that?
As for the first post if you cannot understand it then that is not my problem but it does seems yours.
As for having a conversation with you, well who said I wanted one?
ANYONE VOTING TO END THIS IS SICK AND UN-AMERICAN.
I'm not some 19th Century "women should be kept barefoot and pregnant" macho jerk, but I am a realist. It takes more to be a tanker, an infantryman, an artillery crewman, or a Cav Scout like I was, than simply pulling a trigger. If so, the handicapped, kids and the elderly could do it. It takes a level of brute force and upper body strength that many men don't even have. Trust me, when you spend all day on your knees in the back of a Bradley, lifting 70 pound TOW missiles over your head to load them into the missile launcher, even a 6-3 225 lb (at the time) gorilla like me gets tired very quickly.
Reality is reality, and by nature, women just aren't designed for ground combat in today's modern military. It's true that gear and weapons keep getting lighter as technology advances, but the grunt's load never gets any lighter...he just gets more stuff...ammo and gear...to carry.
Similarly, reality is reality when it comes to homosexuals. Their lifestyle alone makes them a hazard to the blood supply. Their lifestyle creates distrust among their heterosexual colleagues, and when unit leaders begin to come out of the closet, it will lead to a wholesale breakdown in discipline. This is bad...beyond bad. This is a death sentence for the military, and for our national security.
Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!