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To: AfricanChristian
Thank you for that compliment, but really, my knowledge of Africa south of the Sahara and Ethiopia is poor and inadequate. My knowledge of this pales to insignificance compared to my knowledge of Eurasian (bar China/Japan/Korea) history.

To respond to your points:

  1. 1. West African states -- there is not much information about this and a lot of them were still influenced by the more advanced Arab and Berber cultures. The Zulus and Xhosa were still warlords at the time of the Battle of Isandlwana -- they were in 1879, the same position the English were in the 10th-11th centuries -- not a stable state as it had no defined bureaucratic system or boundaries etc.

  2. I wouldn't club the Masai who had a defined society with rules etc. with the Pygmies and Bushmen who are/were hunter-gatherers. Also, the Masai being Buntu are of a different race from the Pygmies and Bushmen, both of which are of different races from each other. Yes, I agree that the Western media creates a warped view of African society -- but it does that about all societies, reducing everyone to a caricature

  3. Some Africans definitely do -- the Bushmen and pygmies in particular and secondarily the peoples of the Congo. The North Africans and East Africans were sufficiently advanced to not have their culture devastated when they interacted with Arabs or Europeans or Indians. West Africa is a mix of the two situations above. Also, please do note that you talk about the AFrican diaspora -- I specifically pointed out that this was to do with societal groups and not individuals. Individual black Africans can be as smart or dumb, cultured or barbaric as whites or browns or East Asians. Again, I humbly state that you also use the collective term "African diaspora in ..." -- the Somalis are not doing so well as the Kenyans or West Africans as they bring their culture across which is endemic war. The North Africans do better than folks from Congo etc.

    The absence of opportunities -- this is caused due to bad boundaries cutting across tribal lines and also because some societies haven't progressed beyond clan lines. This is not only an "African problem" but also visible in Afghanistan, Albania etc.

  4. Thanks -- I did not know about the other groups. Who is this Hausa-Fulani from Kano that you refer to?

  5. Possibly. Indians are racist, but I thought the Chinese were racist as well and didn't know about Chinese marrying local girls

  6. Yes, I agree, as I referred to in point 4.

  7. We can only pray -- predicting over decades is really no more than a guessing game. Nearly anything is possible.

31 posted on 04/28/2011 12:01:55 AM PDT by Cronos (Christian, redneck, rube and proud of it!)
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To: Cronos

Benin and the Yoruba states for example, were not influenced by Arab and Berber culture - they were forest states.

The Masai, Pygmies and Khoi Khoi represent the Western caricature of Africa. These groups are largely resistant to the modern World so the West assumes that Africa is resistant to the modern World. (the Masai like the Luo are usually classed as Nilotic, not Bantu).

The problem with the Somali diaspora is similar to the problem with certain segments of the Pakistani and Algerian diaspora - the impact of a flavour of Islam that is yet to reconcile itself with the 21st Century.

The Hausa-Fulani I referred to is Aliko Dangote.

The Chinese carry much less cultural baggage than Indians, they don’t have a caste system and religious mythology built around caste. This is not say that Chinese are not racist but I do not know a society as obsessed with caste and class as Indian society.

There are pockets of the Indian diaspora in Africa that are more open to interaction such as the Indian community in South Africa but in general, Indians do not interact socially with locals.

Please also note that Western expatriates interact even less with locals than either the Chinese or the Indians. Do not let National Geographic documentary film makers, graduate researchers and movie stars fool you. These people have only a transient interest in Africa and they don’t represent the average Westerner in Africa.


32 posted on 04/28/2011 6:54:00 AM PDT by AfricanChristian
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To: Cronos

Old story from the Times about Chinese men and Tanzanian women: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/africa/article6871900.ece


34 posted on 04/28/2011 7:27:51 AM PDT by AfricanChristian
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