Natural-born Citizens (This was money about the BC four days ago)

tea party tribune ^ | 4/23/11 | jim funkhouser

[HMS Surprise]

First, it must be stated unequivocally, that the confusion surrounding the “birther” controversy is completely contrived. This issue is not complicated… at all.

Natural-born citizens are quite simply, and forever and for all time: citizens born in America of parents who are both citizens.

Was that difficult?

Whether or not Barack Obama was born in Hawaii could not matter less. The unassailable fact is that his father was a Kenyan. If it’s the intention of birthers to have Obama impeached over this issue, arguing about his post-partem nexus doesn’t help their efforts. If fact, arguing about that aspect of this controversy probably helps secure the tenuous perch to which Obama is clinging.

[HMS Surprise]

The Tea Party Tribune on top of things quite nicely.

[buccaneer81]

The only common trait I share with Obama.

[Godebert]

Is Being a Born Citizen of the United States of Sufficient Citizenship Status to be President of the United States and Commander in Chief of Our Military? The Founders and Framers Emphatically Decided It Was Not!

[cram91]

so the parents also have to be natural born citizens also??

[mlo]

"Was that difficult?"

No. It's just wrong.

[Godebert]

"so the parents also have to be natural born citizens also??"

No.

Natural born Citizen requires both parents are Citizens at the time of birth.

[Mr Rogers]

(page 246)
And the constitution itself contains a direct recognition of the subsisting common law principle, in the section which defines the qualification of the President. “No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of this constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President,” &c. The only standard which then existed, of a natural born citizen, was the rule of the common law, and no different standard has been adopted since. Suppose a person should be elected President who was native born, but of alien parents, could there be any reasonable doubt that he was eligible under the constitution? I think not.

(pg 250)
6. Upon principle, therefore, I can entertain no doubt, but that by the law of the United States, every person born within the dominions and allegiance of the United States, whatever were the situation of his parents, is a natural born citizen.

http://tesibria.typepad.com/whats_your_evidence/Lynch_v_Clarke_1844_ocr.pdf

[Mr Rogers]

“Natural born Citizen requires both parents are Citizens at the time of birth. “

Source? And here is a hint: Vattel never wrote about natural born citizens...

[Godebert]

My source is the Constitution of the United States of America. See Article II.

[faucetman]

Here we go again, you pop up on every thread with this BS.

[HMS Surprise]

No, the parents only have to be citizens.

[faucetman]

Before the Constitution the closest reference we have to Natural Born Citizen is from the legal treatise “the Law of Nations,” written by Emerich de Vattel in 1758. In book one chapter 19,

§ 212. Of the citizens and natives.

“The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages. The natives, or *****natural-born citizens*****, are those born in the country, of parents who are citizens.

[HMS Surprise]

You don’t read what you post. If the child bears allegiance, it can only be because the parents have proscribed his condition naturally, by not being aliens, or more perfectly... Kenyan.

[HMS Surprise]

True, but common sense tells us the same. Being born on the soil cannot be of more importance than the nationality of the parent(s), especially if the parents are transient, as is the instant case, i.e., Dear Leader.

[Fred Nerks]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/bloggers/2702976/posts?page=1566#1566

[SarahPalinForPresident2012]

“My source is the Constitution of the United States of America. See Article II.”

Your source is the constitution? Then you must be right.

[abigailsmybaby]

http://www.freerepublic.com/~rxsid/

[Vendome]

MuBarak is an idiot to have released this “Copy of Date Points” on a Wednesday!

What moron doesn’t know that if you want a story to die you release it over the weekend or on a holiday?

Further, it may have been enough to convince Lieutenant Lakin to continue following orders of deployment as he had done so many times, honorably, as a decorated veteran would do and does.

But no... He let an honorable man hang in the wind, under a cloud of doubt and ruin his career and life. For What?

This settles nothing and I want to see the one he found among his mother’s belongings when she passed in 1995, as well the one that is sealed in his admissions for kindergarten and preschool.

Barak, if this settles it for you then you screwed a fine man and you should be ashamed!

You have no honor.

[Vendome]

This whole BC thing is a put up.  A Fairy Tail!

 

It's a slight of hand and there is no reason to have not put an original copy of his Long Form Birth Certificate out there in the 1st place.

 

But, think of it.  There are three that are known to exist or have existed and has at least two in his possessoin:

 

• The Birth Certificate that was submitted for his admission into the Hawaiian school system.  The files containing that BC and his records for immunization are sealed by court order on MuBarak's requrest.

 

• "If" he used an American Passport for travel to Indonesia and Pakistan, when he turned 18, he would have a copy of his birth certificate from that event.

 

• He absolutely has a Birth Certificate, in it's original black & white format, that "He Found" Among His Mother's belongings, when she passed in 1995.

 

• A friend just reminded me that one gets married they are required to present a Long Form Birth Certificate!!!  NO KIDDING!??  I had completely overlooked that!!!

 

• I do wonder if he had to submit another BC when he returned back to the Hawaii school system to re-enter school???

 

 

 

Let them claim there is no long form.

 

1st.  They and everyone has said all along the COLB is an abstract.  A COLB is a walkup document, meaning you can walk up to the desk, ask for your BC and they will provide an abstract, called a COLB in about 10 minutes.  That means there is a long form and Hawaii statutes, starting at (318)

 

2nd.  Hawaii already said they have seen Barry O.'s vital records and issued two statements - blah, blah, blah, right?

 

3rd.  Barry O. never had to show his long form BC ever, in his life, for anything?  Like obtaining a passport.  That one document is better than a drivers license.  It saying to the world you are who is contained in the passport document, which is based on an investigation of your background and YOU MUST provide a Birth Certificate as foundational proof of who YOU say you are.  From there the State Department does their background check on you and if you are who you say you are with no ammendments, modifications or whatever to your identity they issue it clean. 

 

Most adults can go to a desk or filing cabinet in his house and produce a birth certificate in a few minutes?

 

Barry O. tried to pass of something that was inconsistent with what the rest of have and know to be a “Birth Certificate”.

The so called COLB has many flaws with it:

• His father’s race could never have been listed as “African”.  That was not the nomenclature at all, in the 1960’s.  So that begins the suspicion of a fraudulent document.
•  The COLB is also cropped in many of the pictures that claim it is a scan.  If it is a scan, why not leave the document and size intact?
• The COLB also has no artifacts such paper folds.  A scan does not make those disappear and in fact will highlight them.
• The COLB that is scanned mysteriously does not show the Seal of Hawaii.  Why?  Because it was computer generated and not scanned.  Guess they forgot to add that back in.
• More over, many of us are concerned and want to know why he wasted time producing a document that is inconsistent with what we know a Birth Certificate looks like.

 The best part and even more confusing is why he didn't release any of the three Birth Certificates we know already existed before 2007.

• His kindergarten records and the BC, that should be there, have mysteriously disappeared.
• The BC he used to get into college, apply for loans and most definitely used for his passport. That wasn't available?
• Why couldn't he just present the one he found among his mother's belongings upon her death.   He waxed on and wondered about it and his father in one of his books.  Why not post that one?

Those were most certainly BC’s and not a COLB. There is no reason to create confusion but, for the fact he is hiding something. That something will be discovered, though and this is a long process.

“I discovered this article, folded away among my birth certificate and old vaccination forms, when I was in high school. It’s a short piece, with a photograph of him. No mention is made of my mother or me, and I’m left to wonder whether the omission was intentional on my father’s part, in anticipation of his long departure. Perhaps the reporter failed to ask personal questions, intimidated by my father’s imperious manner; or perhaps it was an editorial decision, not part of the simple story that they were looking for. I wonder, too, whether the omission caused a fight between my parents.”

From “Dreams From My Father” (Pg. 26 last paragraph)

So with all these Birth Certificates lying around, why did he feel it necessary to produce a "Certification of Live Birth" that is inconsistent with a Birth Certificate and wholly lacking all of the information you would find, in you know, a Birth Certificate?

He seemed to have some emotional attachment to the Birth Certificate found among his mother’s belongings.  Why wouldn’t he just slap that one up, for all the world to see?

It seemed important that he found a document that is called a “Birth Certificate” and it is highly unlikely he would not know what one looks like.

Hope no one brings up some house fire that vaporized his BC.  That was in 1972 and none of the documents listed here would have been affected by that “fishy” event.

 

The point of the birth certificate is to uncover this man's past for it's factual existence and not the narrative we have been told.

 

We want to know if he ever traveled, went to school in America, obtained loans, etc in another name or as a foreign student or as a foreigner!!!!

 

That is what we are after at a minimum.

 

Finally, there can be no doubt Barak was in fact born with a divided citizenship.  He proudly admits as much.

 

That means if we were conscripted by draft into the United States Military during a conflict, when he was 18, he could have avoided the draft by simply returning to another country of his citizenship.  We know and he admits he was a citizen of Kenya at the age of 18 so he could have returned with no penalty, to Kenya and not even I would call him a draft dodger if had under those circumstances.

 

You are wholly one thing or another but not two distinctly different and separate things that conflict with each other's existence.

 

He was born with a divided allegiance and is "Not a Natural Born Citizen".  Might be a citizen but, he ain't a Natural Born Citizen.

[TigersEye]

Note to the forum: I already called Mr Rogers on this obvious omission earlier but he ignored me and continues to post this drivel.

(pg 250)
6. Upon principle, therefore, I can entertain no doubt, but that by the law of the United States, every person born within the dominions and allegiance of the United States, whatever were the situation of his parents, is a natural born citizen.”

It is interesting that you omitted the sentence that immediately follows that statement.

"It is surprising that there has been no judicial decision upon this question."