Posted on 07/21/2011 6:52:42 AM PDT by Zakeet
CENTRAL FALLS, R.I. — The retirees came from near and far, gathering in a muggy auditorium here to listen to an urgent pitch: give back a big chunk of your pension or risk losing it all.
This city of 19,000 is broke and headed for bankruptcy, partly because it has promised retired police and firefighters millions of dollars in pensions and benefits that it cannot begin to afford.
And so Robert G. Flanders Jr., a state-appointed receiver who is trying to right the city’s finances, found himself on the stage at Central Falls High School on Tuesday, asking retirees to help solve “a horrible dilemma” by giving up a significant part of what they had always assumed was untouchable income.
“No one blames any of you for this situation,” Mr. Flanders told the retirees, many of whom appeared well into their 70s and 80s. “We understand, believe me, that we are asking for great unanticipated sacrifices. But there is simply no money in the city to continue on the current path.”
[Snip]
But the initial response suggested it would be no easy sell. Why should they be punished for the city’s financial missteps over the years, some retirees asked? Why not keep raising taxes instead?
[Snip]
Like many other municipal workers around the country, public safety employees in Central Falls do not pay into Social Security and thus get no Social Security benefits after retirement, a point that several complained about at the meeting.
Although many of the retirees were elderly, some in the crowd were still in their 40s and 50s, people who were allowed to retire early under the city’s rules.
(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...
“Most of those guys in the first few rows do not appear to be retirement-age. Do they get full pensions at 45?”
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I have a sh!tload of ~ age 55 “retired” teachers and firefighters in my practice.
I’m tempted to tell them: “Don’t worry, I’ll keep working and paying taxes so you can enjoy worry free, your 30+ years of retirement.”
By God, why didn't I think of that? /s
This is just a forwarning clap of thunder previewing the coming storm of pension failures likely to be occuring in the coming years and could likely make folks mad enough to start rebelling big time.
1) Every Central Falls teacher fired, labor outraged.
2) A Small City’s Depleted Pension Fund Rattles Rhode Island.
3) Central Falls, R.I., struggles to step back from financial abyss.
And the beat goes on.
It isn't.
“In my state the elederly can NEVER have their property taxes raise EVER... they are fixed at whatever they were when they turned 65. Quirks like this for certain “special” groups are contributing greatly to the problem.
This is the kind of nonsense that needs to end. Why should the elderly only a fraction of what everyone else is paying in property taxes?”
OK, I’ll bite.
On the one hand, we want retirees to accept a lower level of income. They are probably going to HAVE TO accept a lower level of income. This includes ordinary (non-public-employee) retirees (who live on Social Security, perhaps with a little savings) as well.
All well and good.
But then, you expect these same people — whose income is being reduced — to pay MORE each year in property taxes?
Let me ask a simple (and admittedly stupid question) - and I’m going to say quite frankly that I don’t expect a direct answer from you in return:
Where do you suggest these older folks (many who are past being able to work again) to get the money?
Just askin’...
In a rational world the politicians who blew these peoples retirement money would be hunted down and torn limb from limb by these pensioners.
[[Given this economy, the retort to seniors “then sell your house an move if you can’t afford the taxes” has become almost unfeasible in the past several years. What is the house worth? Who is buying? Where do seniors go if their kids and grandkids are close by and they cant afford to live here?? Rents are as high or higher than house expenses.
Like it or not, human body parts do start to fail when you hit 65. Is this the future?]]
Excellent response to a young whippersnapper who probably believes he’s got the answer to everything. I responded, as well, in post #47.
Just sayin’....
Just look at your school district and see what they've built. Then look at school administration and see what they're paid. Then look at all the personnel in the school system who aren't actual classroom teachers. All the Vice-principals and the Assistants to the Vice-principals.
Consolidation of school administration would go a long way.
second, I expect them to get the money from the same place that a young couple just starting out has to get it from to pay their mortgage and property taxes that are now much higher than they would otherwise be because they are having to subsidize the property taxes of those much wealthier than them that had their whole lives to work and save.
“The story says substantial cuts. I suppose most retired people on a Government pension could stand a 10% reduction without a lot of undue pressure,and hardship but what is substantial?”
I realize this is completely off-topic, but I find not a single proposal to the budget/debt ceiling brouhaha acceptable.
A “balanced budget” amendment is useless posturing and should be taken off the table.
Why not freeze the debt ceiling, and instead pass legislation that requires that ALL government expenditures be reduced by, say, 8% for two years? This would include ANY and EVERY payment the government makes to ANYone (individual, organization, government agencey, corporation, etc.), with the exception of interest payment on the debt.
To include Social Security, Medicare, Defense - NO EXCEPTIONS. EVERYTHING GETS CUT.
The reduction must be small, but it must be UNIVERSAL. EVERYONE must “bear the burden”. ASIDE: perhaps an exception might be made for military personal on active duty in combat zones.
Just dreamin’....
Notice how nobody ever mentions implementing a Federal Job Freeze? I wonder why?
Let's suppose the Nike tennis shoes were made in Central Falls, RI instead of overseas. Then income would be flowing into the city, and the tennis shoe factory workers would be paying taxes to the city.
That's the solution. Bring back the manufacturing base.
But no politician wants to do the ground work for this: rein in the unions, reduce regulations, and stop unfair foreign trade.
So instead we all behave like a bunch of animals fighting around a shrinking water hole.
of course everyone else has to pay more!
A city has expenses, many if not most of those expenses are fixed and only increase from year to year. So if special group X demands to pay less taxes everyone else will have to pay more to make up the difference.
Here’s the problem, special groups A B C D E F G .... keep demanding for a variety of reasons that they should pay less or nothing at all. Which means that a smaller and smaller group of those who remain have to pick up the slack and pay for everything else. Old people dont want to pay, poor people dont want to pay, minorities dont want to pay, illegals dont want to pay, disabled people dont want to pay, kids cant pay, the unemployed cant pay, the middle class is tired of paying... heck! who’s left to pay for everything?
Got a mirror?
Whatever happened to the exciting concept of INDIVIDUALLY funded pensions and retirement accounts that was to a cornerstone of the 2nd term of the Bush Administration?
One of the fundamental pillars of any economic recovery for America, HAS to include a return to the basic idea of personal responsibility and accountability.
Fat chance.
That bird has flown....
“I expect them to get the money from the same place that a young couple just starting out has to get it from to pay their mortgage and property taxes that are now much higher than they would otherwise be because they are having to subsidize the property taxes of those much wealthier than them that had their whole lives to work and save.”
Not sure how to reply, except to say that you have much to learn about the realities of life, young man.
Just sayin’....
Who was it that STOLE HALF A TRILLION DOLLARS from Medicare to fund Obamacare? Oh right, that would be the guy that AARP supported who is now the President.
I have observed that many however think they are entitled to start out at the level they parents achieved.
The difference between THEN and NOW is remarkable: It was unheard of for a teenager to own (or be given) a car when I was young. We didn't buy our first NEW car until our 40's. We didn't own a home until our late 40's. It's called "deferred gratification". Work, be frugal, save.
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