Pat Robertson: "It's time we stop locking up people for possession of marijuana..."

Reason ^ | March 6, 2012 | Mike Riggs

[Antoninus]

Your invideous analogy falls apart immediately. Crimes like rape and theft directly harm others; smoking or using poison, whether it's marijuana, crack or alcohol does not. Collateral damage can be dealt with within the legal system much as we do today with alcohol.

That is a libertarian attitude and has little or nothing to do with real life. You do not have a God given right to do harm to yourself and laws may legitimately be put forward and enforced which prevent such acts in accordance with the cultural norms of our civilization.

Do you consider US a fascist state because cocaine is illegal?

Prohibition does not measurably affect usage; it only increases the cost.

...which affects usage. When something is more expensive, people are much less likely to purchase it. Nice job refuting your own argument.

And guess what? Legalizing drugs will necessarily expand the government because government institutions (and those receiving funds from the government) will be the ones who have to deal with the massive increase in societal problems stemming from increased drug use. And with the government-run healthcare trajectory we're on, this will only get worse.

Tell you what. Let's have this conversation again when we live in a country where taxpayer money is not forcibly extracted from some to pay for the irresponsibility of others. Until then, you're just expanding the power of the "fascists on the left" with this kind of nonsense.

[muir_redwoods]

Please point to the constitutional authority for outlawing a vegetable. The state of Ohio may, at it’s peril, outlaw, say, Hubbard squash; the federal government may not.

[JustSayNoToNannies]

You do not have a God given right to do harm to yourself and laws may legitimately be put forward and enforced which prevent such acts in accordance with the cultural norms of our civilization.

Once you cede to government the power to define and ban "self-harm" you've opened the door to the liberals' food-policing and War On Tobacco. Real conservatives know that government power can easily be used against them and so grant government no more power than absolutely necessary.

the massive increase in societal problems stemming from increased drug use.

There's no reason to expect a "massive increase." Alcohol is a more popular drug than any currently illegal drug would ever be, and we're handling the problems of alcohol use just fine - they are certainly less of a burden than the problems caused or exacerbated by the War On Drugs.

[Shadowstrike]

It is already illegal to drive stoned, because it is ILLEGAL to BE stoned.

Or did I miss something.

[GunRunner]

Or did I miss something.

Yes, you did. You missed just about everything there is to miss.

You missed the absolute and total failure of the War on Drugs, which has cost us over a trillion dollars and given the federal government the opportunity to seize freedom and spend tens of billions annually in the name of "fighting drugs".

And people still drive stoned; your precious unconstitutional laws haven't done anything to assuage your fears of stoned drivers.

So yes, you've apparently missed the entire point of a very important policy debate, a policy that has given power only to the drug cartels and big government statists.

I don't care if these laws make you "feel" safer and give you an illusion of safety; they're unconstitutional and ineffective.

[Shadowstrike]

Good grief, what you missed was the sarcasm dripping from my voice.

The war on drugs has not been totally ineffective, as you put it.

But, I’m going to get to the point. What is it with having to be drugged, drunk, or stoned?

Is your life (and yes, I’m asking you since I’m not doing a poll here) that damn sorry? You’ve got too much pain?

Get over yourself Buttercup. Life is pain, anyone who says different is selling something.

I work my ass off, I’ve defended my Country, I’ve buried people and pets who mean the WORLD to me, and I don’t drink, I don’t do drugs, and I’VE SURVIVED!

If you or anyone else want to live your life in a friggin’ fog do it! The more drugs people who demand drugs be made legal do, the less will be around.

But, until smoking DOPE is legal, it’s not legal. That plant you are so fond of is a illegal DRUG! Just like Heroin, AND cocaine are illegal and both come from innocent little plants.

[GunRunner]

It's a common tactic of nanny-staters to accuse anyone who doesn't support prohibition of being a drunk, druggie, or pothead. So normally I wouldn't respond to such a stupid argument, but if you must know, the only drugs I enjoy are Jamaican lager beer and caffeine, preferably administered through iced tea.

My suggestion is for you to get over YOURSELF and stop trying to use the government to micromanage peoples' lives. It's ineffective, unconstitutional, and has been (yes) a total, 100%, complete failure. Narcotics are available to anyone in every town on every street in the United States to someone wants them. It has done nothing to clamp down on access, supply, or rates of addiction.

When I look at the border a few hundred miles south of here, I know that the reason death and destruction has turned the region into a warzone with 40,000 dead in the past few years is because of the "War on Drugs". It has turned the cartels into violent political powers who run entire regions. It has given the federal government an excuse to pry itself further into policing people's lives and finances, ,wasted a trillion dollars in the process, and has in many cases shredded the Fourth Amendment along the way.

Your state can legislate until the Puritans are content.

But the national War on Drugs needs to end, and no one who seriously follows and educates themselves on the issue thinks marijuana should still be illegal. There are zero reasons to criminalize marijuana that cannot also be applied to alcohol.

[microgood]

You do not have a God given right to do harm to yourself and laws may legitimately be put forward and enforced which prevent such acts in accordance with the cultural norms of our civilization.

That is the kind of thinking that has transformed this nation from a constitutitional republic based on individual freedom to a democracy based on mob rule.

[Shadowstrike]

You mistake me, I do not want the Government to micromanage anything.

However, this is about the human brain, not the government, or haven't you kept up with the Journal of Medicine?

It is now proven that pot DOES affect ones abilities, and decision making.

Sorry, you don't win this one on the “government is micromanaging everything” train.

[editor-surveyor]

> “It is now proven that pot DOES affect ones abilities, and decision making.” <<

.
So do artificially sweetened sodas, to an even higher degree. And canabis has been found to completely cure metastatic cancers, but sodas don’t.

On decision making, government is wrong across the board, and sides with immoral monied intrests in every case.

[editor-surveyor]

>> “Or did I miss something.” <<

.
Two things: honesty, and objectivity.
.

[Shadowstrike]

if you are referring to me.

I am totally honest, and objective.

And I “object” to people singing the praises of a plant, that may have some benefits to people, but has mostly no benefits to others.

[GunRunner]

I'm not trying to win anything; I'm pointing out facts. Whether or not you accept them is up to you.

The facts are:

The Drug War is a failure.
The federal government has no Constitutional authority to ban marijuana.
Arguments supporting laws against marijuana use can just as easily be applied to alcohol.

Case closed.

[editor-surveyor]

Your objection is at odds with God’s word.

The leaves of the plants are all for our healing, and are of benefit to all. After the Genesis fall, we are commanded to consume these “herbs of the field.”

[Antoninus]

That is the kind of thinking that has transformed this nation from a constitutitional republic based on individual freedom to a democracy based on mob rule.

Go read some actually literature from the 1780s and get back to me. Recall that even Thomas Jefferson, the so-called "deist" signed a law as governor of Virginia that made the punishment for sodomy castration. The founding fathers were not libertarians.

[The Right wing Infidel]

FOr me Prohobiton is communism, stalin,marx and lenin were hardline prohonisits against drugs and alcohol, it’s a waste of tax payers money to chase down some stupid potheads smoking weed in there mom’s basement.