Posted on 04/05/2012 3:36:57 AM PDT by Cincinatus' Wife
-—And, so you know, Thomas Jefferson himself advocated for free education.-—
The more I learn about Jefferson, the less impressive he becomes. His abridged Bible is ridiculous, and I’m hoping that his “ten commandments” were meant as a joke.
“I read “Ravelstein”, but never read “Closing of the American Mind”.
You reminded me that I need to get this book. Thanks.”
Yes. Do read it. Bloom writes well, stretches our minds like a good muscle stretch, and rewards us with cogent conclusions.
Relativism... ie, the rejection of Truth, the rejection of even the concept of truth...
as old as the devil himself.
-—Relativism... ie, the rejection of Truth, the rejection of even the concept of truth... as old as the devil himself.-—
At this time of year, I’m reminded of someone who once asked, “What is truth?”
There’s a reason why classical liberal education had to go — it would expose the internal logical fallacies of socialism. The current purpose of a college education is to indoctrinate students into socialism and statism.
BFL. Can’t believe it’s been 25 years.
While Truth itself was standing there right in front of him.
-—Reading the excerpts from Closing, I thought Bloom was on his way to converting to Catholicism.——
I remember that the book starts strongly, with Bloom boldly stating that the only belief that all freshman hold in common, is the belief that truth is relative. Thereafter, the book’s energy dissipates.
That is Peter Kreeft’s assessment of the book as well. IOW, not worth the time. I recommend John Gatto’s “Underground History of American Education” instead. Gatto’s style is meandering, and his thesis lacks focus, but the book is jam-packed with astounding facts and insightful analysis.
-—While Truth itself was standing there right in front of him.-—
It gives me chills, especially considering how old I was before I finally “got it.”
I know that I was, heh,heh. There are certainly universal human goods that are knowable by man as man. Who would think that 25 years later we we would be grateful for the writings of a secular, academic, homosexual Jew! We must always be grateful for learning the truth about things, no matter who tells it.
Thanks for the recommendation.
I heard a woman on WJR. Her son and a few other boys protested at Fredrick Douglass High School because they were getting NO education there. (this was the only place I heard about the protest) One of the boys stated that he traveled down to Bowling Green. When he got the entrance exam, he couldn’t answer a single question.
This mother said that she wanted a change.
However, homeschooling was not an option because “socialization” is so important at this age.
AND she could understand the absenteeism of teachers because of they couldn’t take their sick days, they wouldn’t be paid for them.
Along with that, the solution to her was to have DPS pay for a tutor of her own choosing.
HUH?!?
I was nearly screaming at the radio. I couldn’t believe the stupidity of that mom.
Totally agree. Utopians, "progressives," dictators and other assorted power-mad tyrants are always with us and they are fervently destroying the church and using the educational system to destroy us. See Did Communism Fake Its Own Death in 1991?
>>But most of the time, I feel like I’m talking to tree stumps, because, invariably, they will present anecdotal evidence that some school or some teacher is doing good.<<
I know which FReepers you are speaking of.
The Dictatorship of Relativism: A conversation with Professor Peter Kreeft
http://www.johnmallon.net/Site/Peter_Kreeft.html/
> And, so you know, Thomas Jefferson himself advocated for
> free education
Yes, that’s nice, but it’s not a constitutional mandate. The right to be secure in my person, my home, and my effects *IS*.
Payment for the government school collective is compulsory, and is accompanied with “compulsory attendance” laws.
THAT’s COMMUNIST.
Parents should be allowed to direct the education of their own children. Are there parents that will neglect this responsibility? Sure. But how is FORCING them at gunpoint to put their children in the school, dropping standards to lowest common denominator, and forcing EVERYBODY ELSE to pay for it any better?
Liberty MUST BE the FIRST principle!
Jefferson also said. “To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.”
I have taken the option to educate my own nine children still at home.
Why should I be compelled by threat of force to pay for the propagation of Communism, anti-Americanism, Islam, the Planned Parenthood agenda, the Gay agenda, Evolutionism, Global Warming, Values Clarification, and a vast array of other ideologies and agendas I disbelieve and abhor?
The United States is not, and probably never was, a homogeneous society. It is impossible to have a truly “public school” where ideologies, morals and standards accepted by virtually everyone can be taught.
Payment for the government school collective is compulsory, and is accompanied with “compulsory attendance” laws.
False. While payment for government schools - limited to property owners in such a district - IS compulsory, attendance is not. The compulsory is that kids are being educated... either at home, at charter, magnet, or private school. So a kid who is being homeschooled for example has no compulsory attendance at school.
Why should I be compelled by threat of force to pay for the propagation of Communism, anti-Americanism, Islam, the Planned Parenthood agenda, the Gay agenda, Evolutionism, Global Warming, Values Clarification, and a vast array of other ideologies and agendas I disbelieve and abhor?
You shouldn't.
Again, my point is that the public schools would be fine without the crap kids. It's that crap kids, more than any other thing, that brings them down. Private and magnet schools can choose their kids... and they're better in spite of the fact that teachers and administrators are similar - and sometimes the same people.
It may be helpful for you to see what the actual problem is w/ schools instead of some bogey-man communism meme. Just sayin'.
I would include "The Vision of the Anointed" by Thomas Sowel in that list. I read it at the same time as "Closing" and found them to be quite complimentary.
> I never said it was a constitutional mandate. I only
> reminded you that free education was sufficiently important
> to at least one of our founders to have him strenuously
> support it.
Would he have been willing to pay taxes by threat of force for a school that taught abolition of slavery?
> payment for government schools - limited to property owners
False. Landlords include the cost of property taxes in the rents they charge.
>> Why should I be compelled by threat of force to pay
>You shouldn’t.
But I am!
> Again, my point is that the public schools would be fine
> without the crap kids.
No, the very idea of compulsory attendance and compulsory payment for government schools is collectivist-statist (communist).
> It may be helpful for you to see what the actual problem
> is w/ schools instead of some bogey-man communism meme.
>
I will repeat myself, because you don’t seem to get it.
The very idea of a compulsory attendance law and a compulsory payment for government school collectives is collectivist-statist (communist).
The government schools are staffed mostly by union hacks who are mostly communist ideologues.
The United States is not now, and perhaps never was, a homogeneous society where everybody shares the same moral, religious, and political compass.
Forcing people to pay for government school collectives that violate their principles in these matters is communistic.
> I never said it was a constitutional mandate. I only
> reminded you that free education was sufficiently important
> to at least one of our founders to have him strenuously
> support it.
Would he have been willing to pay taxes by threat of force for a school that taught abolition of slavery?
> payment for government schools - limited to property owners
False. Landlords include the cost of property taxes in the rents they charge.
>> Why should I be compelled by threat of force to pay
>You shouldn’t.
But I am!
> Again, my point is that the public schools would be fine
> without the crap kids.
No, the very idea of compulsory attendance and compulsory payment for government schools is collectivist-statist (communist).
> It may be helpful for you to see what the actual problem
> is w/ schools instead of some bogey-man communism meme.
>
I will repeat myself, because you don’t seem to get it.
The very idea of a compulsory attendance law and a compulsory payment for government school collectives is collectivist-statist (communist).
The government schools are staffed mostly by union hacks who are mostly communist ideologues.
The United States is not now, and perhaps never was, a homogeneous society where everybody shares the same moral, religious, and political compass.
Forcing people to pay for government school collectives that violate their principles in these matters is communistic.
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