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To: Hebrews 11:6

There is case law and USSC decisions to the contrary. LEO are not allowed to generalize probable cause from the specific to the general. It has to be articulated and specific.

It may suck, but they aren’t allowed to assume everyone “may” be an accomplice because they are adjacent to them or ensnared in a road block.

They most particularly aren’t allowed to detain them with cuffs. That is arrest w/o probable cause and it wasn’t done for any reason other than officer safety at the expense of public safety.

Not acceptable.

Romans 13 does not apply. LEO are NOT our rulers, nor are they in authority over civilians. You have the cart before the horse.


54 posted on 06/08/2012 5:18:19 PM PDT by Valpal1
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To: Valpal1
Thanks for your reasoned reply.

LEO are not allowed to generalize probable cause from the specific to the general. It has to be articulated and specific.

While you don't cite (nor do I expect it) specific cases, I anticipate that LEO have some latitude. For example, if a cop has reason to believe that a perp is among three people, wouldn't it be reasonable to detain all three while investigating? If so, where is the line--six, nine, nineteen?

I only threw the accomplice idea in as one possible motive for detaining all of them. What I said was that you assume too much. I suspect none of us yet has the details on how specific the supposed electronic tracker was, so that it could have implicated any of the nineteen, your assumption notwithstanding.

They most particularly aren’t allowed to detain them with cuffs. That is arrest w/o probable cause and it wasn’t done for any reason other than officer safety at the expense of public safety.

My understanding is that brief or temporary detention is not arrest, and that officer safety is a legally permitted reason for such detention.

Romans 13 does not apply. LEO are NOT our rulers, nor are they in authority over civilians. You have the cart before the horse.

Romans 13 very much applies, but I'll not trouble here to argue its merits. But note it does not say that "LEOs" per se are our rulers. God is my ruler, and He can and does exercise that sovereignty in many ways, one of which is by establishing civil government. He expects me to submit to it, therefore, unless and until it violates His will as clearly expressed elsewhere--primarily, that is, in Scripture.

55 posted on 06/08/2012 5:58:01 PM PDT by Hebrews 11:6 (Do you REALLY believe that (1) God IS, and (2) God IS GOOD?)
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