Ronald Reagan made secret plans to loan U.S. warship to Britain... (Falklands War)

Daily Mail (UK) ^ | 28th June 2012 | Graham Smith

[naturalman1975]

Ronald Reagan made secret plans to loan Britain a U.S. warship if she lost an aircraft carrier during the Falklands War, it has emerged.

The then-president was prepared to support Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher despite the U.S. being officially neutral during the 1982 conflict.

The stunning revelation was made by John Lehman, the former U.S. Secretary of the Navy, to the U.S. Naval Institute on Tuesday.

Mr Reagan would have loaned Britain the use of the amphibious warship USS Iwo Jima should harm have come to either HMS Invincible or HMS Hermes, which the Royal Navy had deployed to defend the islands from Argentinian forces.

Mr Lehman said that he formulated the plans to stand behind Mrs Thatcher with Secretary of Defence Caspar Weinberger following a British request.

Mr Reagan is said to have approved their proposal without hesitation, telling Mr Lehman: 'Give Maggie everything she needs to get on with it.'

The plans were put together in complete secrecy.

[naturalman1975]

I heard about this years ago. I don't think it was all that secret even at the time.

From what I heard, the message sent to Mrs Thatcher was along the lines of "Of course, the United States will support the United Kingdom over Argentina if it really comes down to it, but the other side of that is, that it would really be best for America if Britain didn't have to ask."

A true alliance between two very close friends - please understand America really wants to maintain good relations with Argentina if we can but in the final analysis, the special relationship will trump all else. America did not want to throw away its cordial relationship with Argentina unless it had to - but if it had to, it would have.

[naturalman1975]

Also worth mentioning from an historical point of view that during the Second World War when America was left with only one operational fleet carrier (USS Saratoga) in the Pacific after USS Hornet was sunk and USS Enterprise were heavily damaged, Britain lent the US HMS Victorious (which operated under the code name USS Robin) for nearly a year. I’m sure they reminded the US of that in 1982.

[moonshot925]

WOW. I just posted this about an hour ago and it got removed.

[max americana]

Thanks for that info. Every month I learn something about Reagan that makes Odumbo look like an imbecile.

[naturalman1975]

Let’s see if this one survives. I wonder what the problem was.

[Trueblackman]

This was one of the worst kept secrets back in 1982 here in Washington D.C. and the rumor was that 1 of the following 3 of the following carriers out of Norfolk were considered, The Coral Sea, Saratoga and Independence as all could easily handle the U.K.’s Fleet of F-4s(that last flew off the Ark Royal in 1979) which were moved to the midway point and only needed a carrier.

Shocker here since this is what allies are suppose to do!

[Trueblackman]

There were two major problems at the time, Reagan had public stated that the U.S. would not take sides in the disagreement, but did support the U.K. privately in the matter and second the feeling among the U.K. public was that the U.K. itself needed to handle the problem since the Falklands belong to them.

[Drango]

without hesitation...

Bless you President Ronald Reagan.

[moonshot925]

The Argentine Navy in 1982 mostly consisted of ex US Navy ships.

• USS Phoenix (CL-46) - Transferred to Argentina in 1951
• USS Catfish (SS-339) - Transferred to Argentina in 1971
• USS Chivo (SS-341) - Transferred to Argentina in 1971
• USS Borie (DD-704) Transferred to Argentina in 1972
• USS Hank (DD-702) - Transferred to Argentina in 1972
• USS Perkins (DD-877) - Transferred to Argentina in 1973
• USS Collett (DD-730) - Transferred to Argentina in 1974

[naturalman1975]

It was certainly considered preferable for British national pride, that they handled it ‘alone’ if at all possible - for that reason, the UK also declined offers of support from Australia, Canada, and New Zealand, all of which were ready to deploy ships and troops (I would guess a lot of smaller Commonwealth countries would have been willing as well). I remember a brief flurry to see if we could get our carrier HMAS Melbourne, ready to go as another carrier (answer - probably not due to a dockyard accident that hadn’t yet been dealt with - even without that, we’d have been surging a ship at the end of her life - she might have done the job but it would have been a serious stretch). But Britain decided to go it - mostly - alone.

[A.A. Cunningham]

It was removed because you made the mistake, yet again, of posting images that are not allowed due to copyright complaints.

[GreyFriar]

Reagan ping

[gandalftb]

Yup, not much of a secret at the time.

That was the only carrier available that had (Brit made) Harriers on board and could support the Brits directly. We would have operated the Iwo and made it available for their Harriers.

Where does anyone think the Brits got nearly all their intel from?

Whom does anyone think the fuel for the Brit aircraft and ships came from?

Our subs were all over that theater.

They are a fellow NATO member. They were attacked. We were required by treaty to support them.

[A.A. Cunningham]

That was the only carrier available that had (Brit made) Harriers on board

Incorrect. The Iwo Jima was not the only amphibious assault ship that had embarked, on a regular basis, AV-8As. In addition VMA-231, equipped with 14 AV-8As, made a Med cruise aboard the USS FDR, CV-42, from October 1976 to April of 1977. There were plenty of boats that could have accomodated the Brits.

The U.S. Marine Corps Hawker Siddley AV-8A Harriers from Marine Attack Squadron VMA-231 Ace of Spades approach the U.S. Navy aircraft carrier USS Franklin D. Roosevelt (CV-42). VMA-231 was assigned to Carrier Air Wing 19 (CVW-19) for a deployment to the Mediterranean Sea from 4 October 1976 to 21 April 1977, FDR´s last deployment before her decommissioning on 30 September 1977. his cruise marked the first operations of the Vertical Short Take Off and Landing (VSTOL) aircraft from a carrier.

A U.S. Marine Corps Hawker Siddley AV-8A Harrier of Marine attack squadron VMA-231 Ace of Spades intercepting a Soviet Tupolev Tu-95 (Nato code "Bear") in 1976/77. VMA-231 was assigned to Carrier Air Wing 19 (CVW-19) aboard the aircraft carrier USS Franklin D. Roosevelt (CV-42) for a deployment to the Mediterranean Sea from 4 October 1976 to 21 April 1977.

[A.A. Cunningham]

A Hawker Siddley AV-8A Harrier of Marine attack squadron VMA-231 Ace of Spades landing on the aircraft carrier USS Franklin D. Roosevelt (CV-42) in 1976/77. VMA-231 was assigned to Carrier Air Wing 19 (CVW-19) aboard the FDR for a deployment to the Mediterranean Sea from 4 October 1976 to 21 April 1977.

[tanknetter]

I heard about this years ago. I don't think it was all that secret even at the time.

Nope, it wasn't. I wrote about it in a paper I did on the Falklands War in high school - would've been 1988 or 89.

[tanknetter]

The Coral Sea, Saratoga and Independence as all could easily handle the U.K.’s Fleet of F-4s(that last flew off the Ark Royal in 1979) which were moved to the midway point and only needed a carrier.

I'm not sure about that. The RAF FGR.2s that were reworked RN FG-1s would have had two major issues in operating off US carriers. Both related to their Spey (vice the J-79s of USAF, USN and USMC Phantoms) powerplants and tailoring to operations off the old Ark Royal.

First, the exhaust for the Speys produced different blast patterns. Both because the exhausts were significantly larger than the J-79 and because they were positioned somewhat more downward in order to provide additional lift during the short cat-runs off the Ark. During cross-decking exercises in the 1970s, the RN FG.1s inflicted a fair amount of heat-related damage onto the USN carriers (Indy and Sara, iirc) jet blast deflectors and flight decks.

Second, for operations off of Ark the FG.1s were equipped with a second nose-gear oleo, again as a way of compensating for the shorter catapults this time by pointing the nose up higher and thus conveying a steeper angle of attack on launch. The nose-gear reverted to a single oleo configuration when the aircraft were converted to FGR.2 standard for RAF use. Since the Speys made the Brit Phantoms quite a bit heavier than their J-79 equipped counterparts with an only slightly better maximum thrust (and thrust that was optimized for different operational conditions than the J-79), IIRC while the US catapults could get the FGR.2 into the air, there would be significant carriage constraints in doing so.

Now, the RAF did move a good number of FGR.2s to Ascension during the war, but only to provide CAP. However, had the Brits been serious about using a US big-deck, they would have forward-deployed the RAF Buccaneer force as well (since the Buccs were former RN carrier planes) ... AND would have made moves to get their pilots carrier qualified (which would have taken a LOT of time). Operating a conventional jet off of a carrier takes a heck of a lot of practice ... significantly more than operating a VSTOL platform like the Harrier.

[the scotsman]

The American fuel from Ascension Island was actually a small amount. Gratefully received, but the Task Force didnt rely on it. There seems to be a myth that the TF relied on fuel from the island.

You are correct to state that the UK also got some of its intel from America.

[arthurus]

RR didn't plan to "loan" anything to anyone. "Lend" is the verb. He might have lent a carrier. Loan is a noun, not a verb in English English and in American English.

[gandalftb]

Read my post, I said “available”.

The USS FDR, CV-42 that you mentioned was decommissioned in 1977 and was sent to the scrapyard. The Falklands War was five years later.

Of course, the Harriers could land on any aircraft carrier, but getting serviced with spare parts is another story.

The Iwo Jima was a platform for Marine Expeditionary Units, MEU’s that carried Harriers only to support Marine Corps units on board.

MEU’s are either deployed out of Norfolk or San Diego. At the time, the Iwo Jima was the only MEU platform operating in the Atlantic Ocean that could directly and fully support Brit Harriers that were almost identical to the Marine Harriers onboard.