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To: allmendream

“Could you be more wrong? One can infer bit [sic] not observe natural selection.”

Could you? Berkeley:

“In some cases, we can directly observe natural selection.” http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/article/evo_26

“The central idea of biological evolution is that all life on Earth shares a common ancestor, just as you and your cousins share a common grandmother.”

http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/article/0_0_0/evo_02

Does an observable phenomena contain a “central idea”? Is the central idea of a common ancestor an observable fact?

If you won’t here it from me, will you here it from a highly credible source that actually teaches evolutionary theory?

I don’t agree with their confidence in common descent, but at least the pages I cite here agree as to the terminology of the debate.


74 posted on 11/28/2012 11:55:31 AM PST by unlearner (You will never come to know that which you do not know until you first know that you do not know it.)
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To: unlearner
And the example they give of observing natural selection?

Bird beaks.

Did we SEE natural selection leading to the death of every bird that didn't have the optimum shaped beak? No.

They are talking about observing the RESULTS of natural selection - i.e. evolutionary change in beak morphology.

Common ancestry IS a central idea of biological evolution - but it itself is not biological evolution.

Not all biological evolution leads to speciation - and thus two different species that share a common ancestor.

Now you do accept the common ancestry of SOME species with each other, do you not? And on a time-frame much swifter from anything proposed by evolutionary biology? Otherwise how did all extant species fit on a boat within the time-frame of human existence?

If so then you accept “adaptation” and “speciation” and SOME “common descent” - and with a speed far beyond anything observed in nature. Now what theory are you going to use to describe HOW that adaptation, speciation and the resulting common descent of some species came about?

Darwin's theory of evolution (the observation) through the action of natural selection of genetic variation (the theoretical mechanism)?

75 posted on 11/28/2012 12:49:01 PM PST by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: unlearner

The terminology of the debate in an INTRODUCTORY treatment also says this, which you apparently overlooked.

http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/article/0_0_0/evo_02

“Biological evolution, simply put, is descent with modification.”

Descent with modification is an inescapable FACT, due to the inability of DNA to be replicated with 100% fidelity or to remain free from changes.

Once again for those of you in Rio Linda - evolution is descent with modification and that is a fact. The theory of natural selection helps to explain and predict this fact.


76 posted on 11/28/2012 12:54:56 PM PST by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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