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Canada Offers Lessons on Women in Combat
The Wall Street Journal ^ | January 24, 2013 | ALISTAIR MACDONALD

Posted on 01/24/2013 2:32:17 PM PST by MinorityRepublican

In spring 2008, Canadian Infantry Cpl. Katie Moman landed in Kandahar, Afghanistan, trained, equipped and ready to fight for one of the few Western armies that allow women in all front-line combat roles.

But as her six-month tour progressed, Cpl. Moman found her troubles had less to do with Afghan insurgents and more to do with what she says was her commanders' desire to keep her from them. The complaint—echoed by other Canadian women serving in combat—underscores one of several pitfalls America's neighbor to the north has encountered in its decadeslong experience with allowing women to enter front-line jobs.

Canadian officers say women warriors proved as effective as men in front-line combat roles in Ottawa's most recent big military engagement, in Afghanistan from 2002 to 2011. But Canada has struggled to fill combat jobs with women, and those who do join can feel isolated as a result. And like Cpl. Moman, many of the women who volunteered for these jobs got the impression that their senior officers used them only sparingly in combat.

On Thursday, U.S. Defense Secretary Leon Panetta officially opened up combat roles to American women. As the Pentagon weighed its decision, U.S. officials studied Canada's experience, according to U.S. and Canadian defense officials.

Israel, France, Norway, Australia and New Zealand are among countries that allow women to fight in many combat roles. And while U.S. women had been technically barred from combat, they have often ended up on the battlefield in America's two recent military campaigns, in Afghanistan and Iraq.

(Excerpt) Read more at online.wsj.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:

1 posted on 01/24/2013 2:32:21 PM PST by MinorityRepublican
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To: MinorityRepublican
It doesn't seem possible for there to be a shortage of men in Canada.

But maybe the legacy of Pierre Trudeau has finally borne it effeminate fruit.

2 posted on 01/24/2013 2:38:34 PM PST by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: MinorityRepublican
“Canadian officers say women warriors proved as effective as men in front-line combat roles”

All you need to know about that bogus statement is to compare woman fire fighters to men. The truth is that they are no where near close to what the men can do. The woman can barely lift a third of there own weight, but they get paid the same. That's what it is all about. Equal outcomes.

3 posted on 01/24/2013 2:44:59 PM PST by Flavious_Maximus
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To: MinorityRepublican; Clive; exg; Alberta's Child; albertabound; AntiKev; backhoe; ...
To all- please ping me to Canadian topics.

Canada Ping!

4 posted on 01/24/2013 2:47:12 PM PST by Squawk 8888 (True North- Strong Leader, Strong Dollar, Strong and Free!)
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To: MinorityRepublican

Women are only excluded from the draft according to the last federal court rulings, because they were prohibited from the cobat roles the draft was meant to fill.

A right for women to be in combat units means that women will have to register for the draft and will not be excluded.

This is utterly depraved. And i will make sure my daughter is not enslaved into a sodomite lead, moslem loving military. At any cost.

When they draft them, they will simply get pregnant to avoid deployment.


5 posted on 01/24/2013 2:47:55 PM PST by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: MinorityRepublican
Israel, France, Norway, Australia and New Zealand are among countries that allow women to fight in many combat roles.

So what. I'm more concerned about what our potential enemies are doing.

6 posted on 01/24/2013 2:48:00 PM PST by skeeter
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To: Squawk 8888
Guilty!!

Wait - what do you mean court's not in session?

7 posted on 01/24/2013 2:53:49 PM PST by Hardastarboard (The Liberal ruling class hates me. The feeling is mutual.)
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To: MinorityRepublican
I've seen it suggested that only Congress has the authority to allow women into combat.Of course the spineless Republican leadership will probably just bend over and take it.
8 posted on 01/24/2013 2:59:42 PM PST by Gay State Conservative (Red State Secession Is The Only Answer)
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To: BenLurkin

Ol’Pierre had no trouble being fertile. He was in his seventies when he fathered an out of wedlock child. I remember when he died...I was in Canada at the time....and the appearance of his young daughter was a bigger story than Fidel Castro at his funeral.

Guess it makes up for Margaret shtupping Keith Richards


9 posted on 01/24/2013 3:05:54 PM PST by SeminoleCounty (GOP = Greenlighting Obama's Programs)
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To: BenLurkin

Ol’Pierre had no trouble being fertile. He was in his seventies when he fathered an out of wedlock child. I remember when he died...I was in Canada at the time....and the appearance of his young daughter was a bigger story than Fidel Castro at his funeral.

Guess it makes up for Margaret shtupping Keith Richards


10 posted on 01/24/2013 3:06:26 PM PST by SeminoleCounty (GOP = Greenlighting Obama's Programs)
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To: DesertRhino

That is so true.

One other thing that will happen is once women are “passed” through their basic training and then sent to their units, the amount of harassment charges will sky rocket. They will think they are being picked on because of their sex, but the truth of the matter is that combat units pick on the newbies because they are newbies, period. Many newbies today (men) can’t hack the stress of being a newbie in a combat unit and are flushed out, but I bet the Army will bow to political correctness and allow the whinner-women stay and therefore lower the standard and combat effectiveness.

This experiment will destroy the military, especially if we ever have to face a real hardened military like North Korea or China. Those kinds of armies will gang rape the women before they torture or kill them. Like you said, I will not allow my daughter to get drafted into such an outfit, specifically if America continues to be run by socialist/mooselimbs.


11 posted on 01/24/2013 3:13:32 PM PST by ScubieNuc (When there is no justice in the laws, justice is left to the outlaws.)
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To: Flavious_Maximus

I have one question in regards to male fire fighters versus female firefighters. How many female fire fighters died at the World Trade Center on 9/11/01? When I looked at the memorial on the NYFD site I did not see any names that indicated female.


12 posted on 01/24/2013 3:17:05 PM PST by forgotten man (forgotten man)
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To: MinorityRepublican

The big question is who is going to pay for their birth control?


13 posted on 01/24/2013 3:31:41 PM PST by Joe Bfstplk
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To: MinorityRepublican

...many of the women who volunteered for these jobs got the impression that their senior officers used them only sparingly in combat.

***
Oh, my, how dare those evil men insist on protecting women?

Lordy, what have we come to?


14 posted on 01/24/2013 3:31:41 PM PST by Bigg Red (Sorry, Mr. Franklin, I guess we couldn't keep it.)
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To: forgotten man

I have another question -

Why, on my PT test scale, will my just-passing at bare minimums (180 points) give my female counterpart 238 points?


15 posted on 01/24/2013 3:31:55 PM PST by AbnSarge
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To: MinorityRepublican

The problem is that the Canadians do not “dumb down” the selection process for the infantry, armor, or artillery arms. If the woman can pass the same selection process as the men, they can play in the big league. The reason why the women feel isolated is because so FEW women can pass selection process and waivers are not granted.

In the U.S., our PC leaders would not insist on merit selection. They would rig the process with waivers so the girls could qualify. In so doing they risk the lives of both our warriors who make the cut without waivers and those who get the waivers because of their sex.


16 posted on 01/24/2013 4:12:39 PM PST by MasterGunner01
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To: MasterGunner01
The problem is that the Canadians do not “dumb down” the selection process for the infantry, armor, or artillery arms. If the woman can pass the same selection process as the men, they can play in the big league.

Well, maybe I don't understand "dumb down," but the Canadian Army web site gives the following standards in passing their "physical fitness" test:

Under 35 year old male................female.
Shuttle runs ....6.....................4
Push ups ........19....................9
Sit ups .........19 ...................15
Hand grip ......75 kg. ................ 50 kg.

In my opinion, such disparity constitutes difference in standards.

17 posted on 01/24/2013 5:05:23 PM PST by Thommas (The snout of the camel is in the tent..)
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To: MinorityRepublican

I don’t believe many women will see combat. I see this as a largely symbolic move to shut up the feminazis and allow women to get the fuzzy-wuzzy feeling about their gov’t.


18 posted on 01/24/2013 5:06:30 PM PST by cydcharisse (`)
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To: MinorityRepublican

To the following sentence, on both counts, there is a reason:

“But Canada has struggled to fill combat jobs with women, and those who do join can feel isolated as a result. And like Cpl. Moman, many of the women who volunteered for these jobs got the impression that their senior officers used them only sparingly in combat.”

Women do not belong in combat with men. It is stupid to try it.


19 posted on 01/24/2013 5:37:15 PM PST by Sequoyah101
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To: Thommas
According to the article I read, now several years ago, the Canadians used the same selection criteria for males and females assigned to infantry billets. At that time, only three females had qualified for the infantry, but none were on active infantry service at the time.

It may be that the Canadians have become PC and compromised their standards. If they have, it does not bode well for the units with the women assigned.

In the USN, females are assigned to certain ratings jobs, but the guys in their division or detachment are well aware of the tasks their female shipmate can do and the jobs that she cannot. Therefore, males have to pickup the slack for the jobs Suzie Sailor cannot do.

Of course, Suzie Sailor always can exercise the “option” by getting pregnant. Once she's reported as pregnant, she's given light duty and transferred off the ship to a shore station at the first opportunity until the child is born. She's usually retained at the shore base for up to a year so she can care for her child. Meanwhile, back at her old duty station, NO replacement sailor is assigned to the position Suzie's pregnancy opened up. The other sailors are left to shoulder her load in addition to their usual work.

20 posted on 01/24/2013 5:38:38 PM PST by MasterGunner01
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To: DesertRhino

“When they draft them, they will simply get pregnant to avoid deployment”

I would not put is past a US government lead by a Democrat administration to force pregnant soldiers to get abortions.


21 posted on 01/24/2013 5:52:06 PM PST by Blue Collar Christian (Pray for revival. <BCC><)
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To: forgotten man

I know a female Port Authority cop died on 9/11; I think it is just easier to keep them out of the firehouses (where men are basically sleeping overnight during their shifts) by stressing the physical requirements (remember those firemen in the stairwells with 40 pounds of equipment)?


22 posted on 01/24/2013 6:19:15 PM PST by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: Squawk 8888

Pray to God that she’ll never fall into muslim hands, dead or alive.


23 posted on 01/24/2013 6:23:13 PM PST by 353FMG ( I refuse to specify whether I am serious or sarcastic -- I respect FReepers too much.)
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To: MinorityRepublican

“their senior officers used them only sparingly in combat.”

My suspicion is that they’d complain also if their senior officers ordered them to do the same thing that they order the male soldiers to do. It’s really a Catch-22 for the military. If they don’t use them, they get complaints. But if they really treated them like the men, they’d also get complaints.


24 posted on 01/24/2013 7:44:44 PM PST by Brilliant
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