Posted on 01/28/2013 1:06:01 PM PST by SkyPilot
“I read today that Defense spending was down 22 percent last quarter, and that went a big way to dragging our economy into the new Depression (which we are in by the way) - despite what the smoke and mirrors crowd says.”
SkyPilot: Read what you posted above and come to your senses!
Government spending, including defense spending does not create prosperity. THAT is the very definition of “smoke and mirrors”. When you withdraw government spending, the illusion of depression is actually a positive thing - the reallocation of effort away from government and towards private sector endeavor IS a step towards actual prosperity.
The “smoke and mirrors” argument is coming from those who say “cut this, not that” and is almost always pomp and ceremony towards doing nothing.
In this case I sincerely doubt under sequestration government spending will actually go down. But they’ll trumpet “10 year savings” as if it were present year savings.
No, the taxpayer cant tell the difference between one spending and the other. It’s all bleeding of the productive class to prop up the non-productive class - which includes an awful lot of defense spending.
So cut it. If military leadership cannot cope with 10% reduction, they are incompetent bureaucrats that are dangerously close to being Anti-American government piglets squealing about “their budgets” not really about their concern for America. THAT is unfortunately what much of our Defense department is.
Now if you want to argue about what ELSE gets cut, fair enough - I’m right there with you. Why not cut the $150Billion they’ve helpfully identified and keep on going.
The taxpayers are real heroes in today’s America. Give ‘em a break.
OK - I will.
Here is what I said:
"“I read today that Defense spending was down 22 percent last quarter....
One Google search later, let's see what we find:
"Meanwhile, government spending, which has been a drag on growth for more than two years, declined for the ninth time in 10 quarters. The biggest cuts came in military spending, which tumbled at a rate of 22.2%, the largest drop since 1972."
More on Q4 GDP: Defense spending falls 22% - the biggest drop in 40 years - leading real federal...
So I was correct in my facts.
Government spending, including defense spending does not create prosperity. THAT is the very definition of “smoke and mirrors”.
All government spending is not "evil." By that logic, government spending during WWII (which reached 39% of GDP) was evil. By your reasoning, Lockheed, Boeing, Raytheon, and Booze-Allen are "bad." By your logic, all military communities are "bad." By that logic, the Space Program was horrible. It didn't create any jobs or innovation.
Do you know what spending is "bad?" Throwing 62% (and increasing every day) or all dollars (taxed and borrowed) at entitlements to every Tom, Dick, and Harriet that wants a check.
THAT is unaffordable, and is breaking our national back.
I don't know what your game is RFEngineer. You what I suspect it is? You want to protect whatever government check you are getting, or someone you live with is getting, so you are prepared to throw the nation's military on the altar of sacrifice so that your direct deposit is safe.
And think of all the money to be made to rebuild, if we get that chance.
“I don’t know what your game is RFEngineer. You what I suspect it is? You want to protect whatever government check you are getting, or someone you live with is getting, so you are prepared to throw the nation’s military on the altar of sacrifice so that your direct deposit is safe. “
Ah, you’ve been reading a previous thread where I claimed to be on government assistance in response to my leg being pulled.....
No, I am a self-employed tax payer. I pay a shitload of taxes. I hate listening to whiners complain about one bit of spending over another - or exclaiming THEIR check can’t be cut until SOMEONE ELSE gets their check cut.
All government spending past a limited threshold IS EVIL. We are well past that point.
I want to cut ALL government spending including defense - because it’s not government’s money.
So what about you SkyPilot? What’s your game? What sort of government check do you get - or from which defense contractor do you get paid?
Ah, you’ve been reading a previous thread where I claimed to be on government assistance in response to my leg being pulled.....
Oh, so you lie here on the board.
Great. Now at least I know what you are.
No, I am a self-employed tax payer. I pay a shitload of taxes
Well, if you are telling the truth (this time), there is:
1. No need to use profanity here
2. I pay more than my "fair share" too - trust me
As for myself, I have stated this before on the board and I am proud of it: I am a retired military officer and pilot. I get a retirement check for that - yes. In 21 years of service, three wars, and things that I refuse to divulge here to someone such as yourself, I believe I earned it, and you would be quite shocked to learn that it ain't that much. But if you or anyone else here think that retired military are "undeserving" - go right ahead.
I sure think I earned that more than 99% of most Americans, and I will say the same for each and every veteran in this nation. You will never convince me otherwise.
On top of that, I am disgusted by how ungrateful and shortsighted this nation has become. You don't get to live in Xanadu of Libertarian Land because you won life's lottery. Other people paid a price for it.
I want to cut ALL government spending including defense - because it’s not government’s money.
And I want a pony.
“Oh, so you lie here on the board.”
You are a complete humorless idiot.
“I get a retirement check for that” so why is it you accuse me of defending a government check - when you are directly conflicted in that regard? You have a bizarre sense of right and wrong.
You aren’t the only one to serve in the military, nor does that make you uniquely qualified to comment on future military funding - Neither does my own military service qualify me. However, as a taxpayer I AM qualified to object to any and all spending of all kinds.
“you would be quite shocked to learn that it ain’t that much. But if you or anyone else here think that retired military are “undeserving” - go right ahead.”
You really are a patronizing doofus.
“I sure think I earned that more than 99% of most Americans, and I will say the same for each and every veteran in this nation. You will never convince me otherwise.”
The problem is oh, wise one, is that we don’t have the money.
So budgets and checks of all kinds are under direct threat of being severely reduced. Check recipients such as yourself always think they deserve “their” check over someone elses check - which is why we have $16T in debt and counting.
“On top of that, I am disgusted by how ungrateful and shortsighted this nation has become.”
Oh ungrateful are we? I served because I felt duty-bound. You apparently did it for an ongoing revenue stream. To each his own.
If you actually understood how dire a situation we are in financially, you would realize that I seek to preserve some sort of check for those recipients that are truly deserving of government benefits. But you feel that is being “ungrateful”. Good grief.
“And I want a pony.”
See you are really warped in the humor department. The “I want a pony” comment should be more appropriately applied to those who RECEIVE government benefits than to those who PAY and PAY and PAY.
So which government contractor do you work for SkyPilot? I have your number, don’t I? He who dips double complains most when defense budgets are cut.
I am an "idiot" and a "doofus."
Please: NO profanity, NO personal attacks, NO racism or violence in posts.
In your last two posts to me, you violated the first two. Why don't you throw in some racism and make it a Trifecta?
“In your last two posts to me, you violated the first two. Why don’t you throw in some racism and make it a Trifecta?”
LOL.....piece of work SkyPilot.
Standards for ME but not for THEE.
The revolving door of defense contracting is an ethical travesty from which the DoD cannot easily recover it’s credibility.
You sheepishly avoid the subject in favor of complaining that I called you a “doofus” and that I used a curse-word to describe my personal tax burden.
So where were we, you poor, poor victim of an “ungrateful nation” that provides you a lifetime pension and medical care along with a cushy defense contractor job (wink-wink)?
Ah yes, we were discussing that there may be room for a 10% cut in the defense budget, and you argued against it.
I engaged in my own "mind reading" of your motives, which I shouldn't have done. My apologies for that.
You can question my motives sir, my patriotism, or whatever else you wish. I have a great and abiding esteem for this nation's military and those who have served it. In my humble opinion, the military get used and abused by our civilian masters, and this latest outrage is par for the course.
My interest in serving was never "financial" as you stated (that was your own "mind reading" of motives). I joined, and stayed, because of patriotism. You can choose to believe that or not. I really don't care.
Military spending is not what is bankrupting this nation. Does all spending need to decrease? Yes. Has the military already paid it's "fair share?" It sure has enough pounds of flesh taken from it lately, with no decrease in mission, and no other entitlement or government programs have coughed up to the same degree. Moreover, sequestration takes 50% of the cuts from 17% of the budget, and hte military is constitutional. Medicare, Medicaid, Food Stamps, TANF, Section 8, Social Security, and SSDI are not. They pay nothing towards this latest cut.
Thank you for returning to rational budget discussion.
All things must be cut. There is just not enough money to pay for it all.
Agreeing that a defense budget should be cut does not say that nothing else should be cut. That is an overused debate tactic for any announced cut for anything. Sure, in this administration, it’s probably the outcome, but I doubt even defense budgets will suffer to the extent that it could even remotely be described as “gutting”.
I don’t take the personal stuff too personal for long, and I can dish out as well as I take. No permanent offense taken or intended. You’re just as much of an asshole as me, and I mean that as a compliment.
Please do me a favor. Please dispatch the the profanity. Please. It isn’t allowed here and we don’t need it. Thanks very much.
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