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FOX CABLE NEWS IS REPORTING 24 3RD GRADERS HAVE PERISHED IN OKLAHOMA.
FOX NEWS ^ | 5/20/2013 | Fox News

Posted on 05/20/2013 4:54:37 PM PDT by stockpirate

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To: Venturer

Sorry if this was already answered by I just saw the major on CNN and he said the reason was it is too expensive to add the storm shelters in older schools. The newer schools have them, though.


421 posted on 05/21/2013 5:43:07 AM PDT by snarkytart
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To: God luvs America
not being in a tornado area i’ve got to ask- don’t they have tornado shelters at schools??

Apparent not, my wife asked the same thing last night! What are they thinking, it must be about money. Sacrifice children at the expense of saving a few $$ here and there!
422 posted on 05/21/2013 6:03:08 AM PDT by ForAmerica (Texas Conservative Christian Black Man!)
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To: jwalsh07
How long does it take you to drive perpendicular to a tornado 2 miles wide at 60mph when you are driving at approximately right angles to the tornado?

To answer that, download the Radar Navigation and Maneuvering Board Manual. Go to page 258 (Chapter 6), Course at specified speed to pass another ship at maximum and minimum distances, which is also applicable to tropical storms.

You can see there that the course you want to take is dependent on the vectors and magnitude of your car and the tornado, and that it's not a right angle. In the example provided there, where the other ship has a course of 300 degrees, neither your own maximum distance by taking a course of 000 (=360) degrees nor your minimum distance by taking 240 degrees approximate a right angle (30 and 210) from a storm.

Remember that if you take a right angle (a) from a storm's path, it's closest point to you, when it passes, will lie at the intersection of your path and its own (A; plot your line in the other direction). But if you're driving at an angle (b) that keeps you ahead of the storm's path while heading away from it, when that storm reaches point A, you're still ahead of the storm and can still drive further before it reaches closest point of approach B.

I don't know if that direction is normally 60 degrees from the storm's course or if it just happened that way in the example they gave on the maneuvering board. I haven't practiced any of these in real life and just know about the maneuvering board because I was looking things up for a roleplaying game.

423 posted on 05/21/2013 6:05:02 AM PDT by Styria
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To: Styria

I am a sports photographer.

You learn pretty quick that you do not run from an on coming play. You run at a 45 degree angle in the direction of the play, but off to the side of it. This allows you to put distance between you, but also keep you eye on them. The play would have to make a significant course change to hit you.

Otherwise you might get run down.


424 posted on 05/21/2013 6:15:14 AM PDT by Vermont Lt (Does anybody really know what time it is? Does anybody really care?)
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To: ForAmerica
Apparently basements in Oklahoma are nearly impossible to construct from what I read yesterday.

In general, hallways can be reinforced to with stand EF3s. Beyond that, I am not certain that the capability exists.

I live in Missouri, and one of our local businesses was exploring how to do this since they weren't able to get a basement. The construction companies were willing to bid up to EF3. Not sure why - Maybe the technology is iffy for such a large area, or maybe a liability issue for the company/architect.

425 posted on 05/21/2013 6:20:51 AM PDT by greeneyes (Moderation in defense of your country is NO virtue. Let Freedom Ring.)
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To: ForAmerica
What are they thinking, it must be about money. Sacrifice children at the expense of saving a few $$ here and there!

Oh, I'm sure they spent plenty of money....(salaries and benefits...salaries and benefits)

This accurately displays that it IS NOT..."for the children"

426 posted on 05/21/2013 6:24:57 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Hey RATs! Control your murdering freaks.)
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To: eastforker

Holy crap bro. Good to see you back. Come to a Texas Shoot. I wont be at this next one but will at the one after that.


427 posted on 05/21/2013 6:29:22 AM PDT by Lazamataz ("AP" clearly stands for American Pravda. Our news media has become completely and proudly Soviet.)
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To: gop4lyf
I understand the difficulty of dealing with soils that expand and contract, rocks, etc. But given the loss of human life that occurs when a strong tornado strikes a building without any underground shelter, or a suitably strong surface shelter, it makes sense to develop technology suitable for construction of underground shelters in places where tornadoes are frequent - like Oklahoma.

For example, the effects of hydrophilic soils could be mitigated by digging an extra large foundation hole and backfilling around the actual concrete basement with materials that can absorb the expansion and contraction of the soil.

I'd rather have an underground shelter with cracked walls and a sump pump than have to deal with an F5 tornado above ground level.

428 posted on 05/21/2013 6:29:31 AM PDT by freeandfreezing
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To: Styria
Remember that if you take a right angle (a) from a storm's path, it's closest point to you, when it passes, will lie at the intersection of your path and its own (A; plot your line in the other direction). But if you're driving at an angle (b) that keeps you ahead of the storm's path while heading away from it, when that storm reaches point A, you're still ahead of the storm and can still drive further before it reaches closest point of approach B.

Of course in real life, you'd have to be real lucky and find a road that veers off at the correct angle for any of that to apply.

Out there, in some of those state, they have a county dirt road matrix that surrounds the sections (square miles) so you could zig zag.

429 posted on 05/21/2013 6:32:49 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Hey RATs! Control your murdering freaks.)
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To: greeneyes
Apparently basements in Oklahoma are nearly impossible to construct from what I read yesterday.

Maybe they are, but a tornado shelter isn't that big, and if your family's life were to depend on it, expense is probably a secondary consideration.

If they are only talking about sandstone, which you can break through with a crowbar, I've seen them drill and blast granite out here in various construction projects. Granite is as hard, or harder than commercial concrete.

You can rent an electric jack hammer. One of those, some beer and a few guys with shovels could probably make an 8x8 or appropriately sized hole in half a day.

The rest is traditional concrete/rebar construction. Put in an air vent and a sump pump. The whole thing wouldn't have to be below grade, you could berm up dirt over it. Might want to check it periodically for rattlesnakes.

During the reporting, I saw a couple of doors into the ground where people had survived this twister, so it is possible.

Judging by the fact that pieces of heavy debris had been moved long distances, they are now considering upgrading the storm's rating to an E5.

430 posted on 05/21/2013 6:50:07 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Hey RATs! Control your murdering freaks.)
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To: diogenes ghost

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/weather/tornado/wtwur318.htm


431 posted on 05/21/2013 7:09:33 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (Funny thing happened on the way to the Constitution burning, Lefties rights were violated...)
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To: Jeff Head

Thanks for the mention Jeff. That kind of ground formation is very strange to me. Sounds like you were kept pretty busy with those trees and posts.


432 posted on 05/21/2013 7:12:01 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (Funny thing happened on the way to the Constitution burning, Lefties rights were violated...)
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To: stockpirate

Truly heart-breaking as I watched it yesterday. Now these children? Don’t have the words...


433 posted on 05/21/2013 7:19:06 AM PDT by A Navy Vet (An Oath is Forever)
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To: yellowdoghunter

“..God bless my fellow Okies....”

God bless our fellow Americans... and those families who lost loved ones...


434 posted on 05/21/2013 8:47:33 AM PDT by NFHale (The Second Amendment - By Any Means Necessary.)
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To: A Navy Vet

they are saying now only 9 children died...


435 posted on 05/21/2013 9:01:37 AM PDT by stockpirate (F. Douglass, "A man's rights rest in three boxes: ballot box, jury box, and ammo box)
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To: matt04
Did they say if it was from the rain or something like a sprinkler water line break?

Actually that's the same thing I was asking others today. Some said that it could have been either or, or a combination of both.

436 posted on 05/21/2013 9:12:41 AM PDT by tsowellfan (www.cafenetamerica.com)
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To: stockpirate; stephenjohnbanker; sickoflibs; Impy; Gilbo_3; GOPsterinMA; DoughtyOne; hiredhand; ...

Here’s two miracles that happened:

http://weaselzippers.us/2013/05/21/amazing-story-of-survival-in-oklahoma/

An elderly woman survives her house collapsing on top of her...and finds her dog under the rubble as well, still alive.


437 posted on 05/21/2013 9:13:47 AM PDT by NFHale (The Second Amendment - By Any Means Necessary.)
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To: driftdiver
Sorry, I live on the East Coast and I'll take a hurricane over a tornado ANYDAY.
438 posted on 05/21/2013 9:13:59 AM PDT by tsowellfan (www.cafenetamerica.com)
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To: tsowellfan

“...I’ll take a hurricane over a tornado ANYDAY....”

I’ll pass on BOTH if at all possible... They both suck.

Hurricane Sandy almost brought a tree down on my kitchen; my son and I threw ourselves onto the trunk and PUSHED it away from the house as it started uprooting. No exaggeration.

Not a fun time... not at all.


439 posted on 05/21/2013 9:21:22 AM PDT by NFHale (The Second Amendment - By Any Means Necessary.)
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To: All

To me, although it would involve some costs...new schools or old schools could be retrofitted with reinforced concrete walls and ceilings. Doors into the classrooms are what would be the issue - not sure how to secure those, or make them not look like prison doors....but at least they wouldn’t have ceilings, debris, or building collapses around the hall ways like we saw yesterday. Architecturaly, it probably wouldn’t look nice....but it seems like it would be an easy retrofit...


440 posted on 05/21/2013 9:22:36 AM PDT by Maringa
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