Posted on 07/29/2013 5:33:38 AM PDT by SoFloFreeper
Pope Francis reached out to gays on Monday, saying he wouldn't judge priests for their sexual orientation in a remarkably open and wide-ranging news conference as he returned from his first foreign trip...
"If someone is gay and he searches for the Lord and has good will, who am I to judge?" Francis asked.
His predecessor, Pope Benedict XVI, signed a document in 2005 that said men with deep-rooted homosexual tendencies should not be priests. Francis was much more conciliatory, saying gay clergymen should be forgiven and their sins forgotten.
Francis' remarks came Monday during a plane journey back to the Vatican from his first foreign trip in Brazil.
He was funny and candid during a news conference that lasted almost an hour and a half. He didn't dodge a single question, even thanking the journalist who raised allegations reported by an Italian newsmagazine that one of his trusted monsignors was involved in a scandalous gay tryst.
(Excerpt) Read more at mobile.philly.com ...
You are wrong wrong wrong...and the numbers are growing as the Catholic Church is being forced in jurisdiction after jurisdiction to hand over their secret documents.
What did the Archbishop say in one jurisdiction that was recently forced to hand over their files
” ‘Prepare to be shocked,’ Milwaukee archbishop warns of priest sex files
If a person believes that their homosexual acts are not a sin, there is a strong likelihood that such a person is not searching for the Lord and lacks good will.
A person’s urge to engage in such behavior is on the same level as my urges to fornicate, masturbate or watch pornography.
These thoughts are impure, they must be interrupted with prayer... and I sure hope my thoughts are forgivable.
Exactly. Let's pray for and help each other to overcome our besetting sins.
Yes it does, but considers all who have been baptized in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit as members of the Church, although not in full communion with the her. From the Catechism:
1271 Baptism constitutes the foundation of communion among all Christians, including those who are not yet in full communion with the Catholic Church: “For men who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are put in some, though imperfect, communion with the Catholic Church. Justified by faith in Baptism, [they] are incorporated into Christ; they therefore have a right to be called Christians, and with good reason are accepted as brothers by the children of the Catholic Church.”81 “Baptism therefore constitutes the sacramental bond of unity existing among all who through it are reborn.”
We believe, with Holy Mother Church, that there is no salvation outside of (the Body of) Christ.
Just one little Diocese...who is bankrupt...admits to 42 PRIESTS who abused ..
Prepared to be SHOCKED said the Archbishop...
42 files in just one Dioceses.
There are not small numbers....
NO CATHOLIC in the face of GOD should downplay the sexual abuse committed by the members of the Church.
One can lament the verbal foot fault of using the word “gay.” I understand that. But, it’s just silly to make THAT the focus when the huge matter is the clear attempt at provocation and disinformation that the OP creates.
Let’s stay clear on the speck / beam in the eye - and the gnat / camel swallowing.
Remember what Jesus said to the folks who wanted to throw stones at a woman taken in adultery, “he who is without sin, be the first one to cast a stone.”
ALL of us, like it or not, are SINNERS, even those of us who are believers in Jesus and who know of the need to repent and be converted each day.
I am done with this thread.
Certainly.
On the other hand, there’s good reasons for Popes to be very careful in their use of terminology, even in off the cuff remarks and interviews.
You can say you believe whatever it is you want to believe but the Church simply does not say that the only way to salvation is through it
You can search thos entry you cited all day long but not anywhere in it nor anywhere in the bible mor catechism does it say that the only way to salvation is through the Church not even through baptism as you in changing the topic, as all illogical arguments will, cited here
So you might as well forget it
The Catholic Herald whitewashed article makes no mention of the reason for Cardinal O'brien's resignation.
The Guardian article in post#1 on that thread shows it's likely going to be business as usual for the RCC.
Addressing the issue of women priests, the pope said, “The Church has spoken and says ‘no’ … that door is closed.” It was the first time he had spoken in public on the subject.
Absolutely no girls will be allowed into the priesthood...
Girly-men on the other hand, well, nobody's sporting a 'queer-here' tatoo on their forehead so eh, there must not be any...Now where were we...Oh yea, women in the priesthood...Yuck!!!
From the search you kindly provided, here’s what Ratzinger had to say in 1986. It’s pretty long, but anyone who is truly interested in the Church’s actual teaching would be well served to take the time to read it..
(Of course, that will eliminate a great number of the usual suspects....)
SIGH...DO A SEARCH>>THERE ARE MANY REFERENCES IN MANY NEWS AREAS..
Good God, it is pretty well accepted that this Cardinal had an issue..
Fine. Stew in your denial.
Just cite your source and quit the personal odiotic attacks which prove nothing
Some freepers will defend this guy for as long as he continues to utter social liberalism and platitudes
He’s not comparable to the previous two
Maybe not even to....what was it....Paul....prior to John Paul
Even as a non Catholic I realize the importance of popes....and it helps all of us when they are obedient to their instructions
But this one is way funky.....he says something over ecumenical or non traditional reach out weekly.....what is his order.....Mary Knoll?
At least he’s 76...not 55
I'll bet there's some Catholics that feel that way as well...
One thing no one has ever seen is a pope getting up and saying, 'queers are no longer allowed in the priesthood'...
846 “Outside the Church there is no salvation” How are we to understand this affirmation, often repeated by the Church Fathers?335
Re-formulated positively, it means that all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body: (161, 1257) Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and Baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through Baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.336
However, for those to whom the Gospel has not been preached:
847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church: Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience—those too may achieve eternal salvation.337
CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH:
SOME CONSIDERATIONS CONCERNING THE RESPONSE TO LEGISLATIVE PROPOSALS ON THE NON-DISCRIMINATION OF HOMOSEXUAL PERSONS
Excerpt:
APPLICATIONS
10. “Sexual orientation” does not constitute a quality comparable to race, ethnic background, etc. in respect to non-discrimination. Unlike these, homosexual orientation is an objective disorder (cf. Letter, no. 3) and evokes moral concern.
11. There are areas in which it is not unjust discrimination to take sexual orientation into account, for example, in the placement of children for adoption or foster care, in employment of teachers or athletic coaches, and in military recruitment.
12. Homosexual persons, as human persons, have the same rights as all persons including the right of not being treated in a manner which offends their personal dignity (cf. no. 10). Among other rights, all persons have the right to work, to housing, etc. Nevertheless, these rights are not absolute. They can be legitimately limited for objectively disordered external conduct. This is sometimes not only licit but obligatory. This would obtain moreover not only in the case of culpable behavior but even in the case of actions of the physically or mentally ill. Thus it is accepted that the state may restrict the exercise of rights, for example, in the case of contagious or mentally ill persons, in order to protect the common good.
13. Including “homosexual orientation” among the considerations on the basis of which it is illegal to discriminate can easily lead to regarding homosexuality as a positive source of human rights, for example, in respect to so-called affirmative action or preferential treatment in hiring practices. This is all the more deleterious since there is no right to homo- sexuality (cf. no. 10) which therefore should not form the basis for judicial claims. The passage from the recognition of homosexuality as a factor on which basis it is illegal to discriminate can easily lead, if not automatically, to the legislative protection and promotion of homosexuality. A person's homosexuality would be invoked in opposition to alleged discrimination, and thus the exercise of rights would be defended precisely via the affirmation of the homosexual condition instead of in terms of a violation of basic human rights.
14. The “sexual orientation” of a person is not comparable to race, sex, age, etc. also for another reason than that given above which warrants attention. An individual's sexual orientation is generally not known to others unless he publicly identifies himself as having this orientation or unless some overt behavior manifests it. As a rule, the majority of homosexually oriented persons who seek to lead chaste lives do not publicize their sexual orientation. Hence the problem of discrimination in terms of employment, housing, etc., does not usually arise.
Homosexual persons who assert their homosexuality tend to be precisely those who judge homosexual behavior or lifestyle to be “either completely harmless, if not an entirely good thing” (cf. no. 3), and hence worthy of public approval. It is from this quarter that one is more likely to find those who seek to “manipulate the Church by gaining the often well-intentioned support of her pastors with a view to changing civil statutes and laws” (cf. no. 5), those who use the tactic of protesting that “any and all criticism of or reservations about homosexual people... are simply diverse forms of unjust discrimination” (cf. no. 9).
In addition, there is a danger that legislation which would make homosexuality a basis for entitlements could actually encourage a person with a homosexual orientation to declare his homosexuality or even to seek a partner in order to exploit the provisions of the law.
15. Since in the assessment of proposed legislation uppermost concern should be given to the responsibility to defend and promote family life (cf. no. 17), strict attention should be paid to the single provisions of proposed measures. How would they affect adoption or foster care? Would they protect homosexual acts, public or private? Do they confer equivalent family status on homosexual unions, for example, in respect to public housing or by entitling the homosexual partner to the privileges of employment which could include such things as “family” participation in the health benefits given to employees (cf. no. 9)?
16. Finally, where a matter of the common good is concerned, it is inappropriate for Church authorities to endorse or remain neutral toward adverse legislation even if it grants exceptions to Church organizations and institutions. The Church has the responsibility to promote family life and the public morality of the entire civil society on the basis of fundamental moral values, not simply to protect herself from the application of harmful laws (cf. no. 17).
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