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What happened to Sterling was morally wrong
CNN ^ | 04/30/2014 | Marc J. Randazza

Posted on 04/30/2014 3:10:10 PM PDT by Responsibility2nd

(CNN) -- This past week, my inbox blew up with e-mails asking whether Donald Sterling's First Amendment rights were violated in the uproar over the Los Angeles Clippers owner's racist remarks about black people. After all, he was simply expressing his views, however unpopular.

While he did have some rights violated, his First Amendment rights remain intact.

The First Amendment protects you from the government punishing you because of your speech. The NBA is a private club, and it can discipline Sterling all it wants.

What about the chorus of criticism? Are we all violating his First Amendment rights by criticizing him? We are punishing him for his speech.

Nope. The First Amendment does not insulate you from criticism. In fact, that's the First Amendment in action. That is how the marketplace of ideas works. We float our ideas in the marketplace, and we see which idea sells.

Most everyone would agree that Sterling's ideas fail in the marketplace of ideas. Nevertheless, I reluctantly stand on Sterling's side today. What happened to him may have been illegal and was morally wrong.

(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; News/Current Events; US: California
KEYWORDS: california; clippers; donaldsterling; donsterling; losangeles; losangelesclippers; moralabsolutes; naacp; nba; rochellesterling; vanessastiviano
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What happened to him may have been illegal and was morally wrong.

Morally wrong. Yet clearly Sterling is - to coin a cute phrase - a sterling example someone who is morally wrong. So. Do two moral wrongs make a right?

1 posted on 04/30/2014 3:10:11 PM PDT by Responsibility2nd
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To: Responsibility2nd; 185JHP; 230FMJ; Albion Wilde; Aleighanne; Alexander Rubin; ...

Moral Absolutes Ping!

Freepmail Responsibility2nd or little jeremiah to subscribe or unsubscribe from the moral absolutes ping list. FreeRepublic moral absolutes keyword search [ Add keyword moral absolutes to flag FR articles to this ping list ]


2 posted on 04/30/2014 3:11:04 PM PDT by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
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To: Responsibility2nd

No, but three thefts do. :{)


3 posted on 04/30/2014 3:11:56 PM PDT by gorush (History repeats itself because human nature is static)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Depends.... if he was recorded in California then the state law will dictate secret recording and realize of same.

This isn’t a logic problem nor a math equation.....both sides can be wrong.


4 posted on 04/30/2014 3:13:45 PM PDT by Nifster
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To: Responsibility2nd
The NBA is a private club, and it can discipline Sterling all it wants. ...

What happened to him may have been illegal ...

Heh.
5 posted on 04/30/2014 3:15:54 PM PDT by Cboldt
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To: Responsibility2nd

Well the queers got a scalp from the Mozilla guy, so now the blacks get a scalp. Equilibrium in the world of PC victinhood has been restored!


6 posted on 04/30/2014 3:16:17 PM PDT by clintonh8r (Don't give up! The liberals are buggering and aborting themselves into extinction.)
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To: Responsibility2nd

This whole drama is bizarre.
He’s supposedly racist but has a black/Hispanic mistress? He says he loves black people but doesn’t want his mistress seen with them although she can private do whatever with minorities.
This is, to me, a sad demented elderly human being that should have known better but didn’t.
If this is the set up to force him to sell an improving team at fire sale prices, as a FRiend recently put it, “Well played.”


7 posted on 04/30/2014 3:16:48 PM PDT by griswold3 (I was born here in America. I will die here in a third world country. Obama succeeded.)
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To: Responsibility2nd

To quote Deteriorata:

“Consider that two wrongs never make a right, but that three do.”


8 posted on 04/30/2014 3:16:54 PM PDT by cld51860 (Oderint dum metuant)
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To: Responsibility2nd

It’s all worth it if it opens up a team for minority ownership. /SARC


9 posted on 04/30/2014 3:17:56 PM PDT by Old Yeller (Why is Jon Corzine a free man?)
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To: Responsibility2nd
Morally wrong. Yet clearly Sterling is - to coin a cute phrase - a sterling example someone who is morally wrong. So. Do two moral wrongs make a right?

Is it right to treat someone immorally if he is immoral? It certainly is far easier to rationalize why Sterling should be punished for his private opinions surreptitiously obtained. Aside from his words, what did he do wrong? Shouldn't actions be the metric and not an opinion expressed in private?

10 posted on 04/30/2014 3:18:00 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar

Well said.


11 posted on 04/30/2014 3:19:36 PM PDT by Fungi
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To: Responsibility2nd

“The NBA is a private club”

How much must something be subsidized before its considered ‘not a private club’.


12 posted on 04/30/2014 3:20:07 PM PDT by Viennacon
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To: Responsibility2nd

Yeah, especially with all those non-bigoted, moral choirboys playing in the NBA


13 posted on 04/30/2014 3:20:19 PM PDT by A_Former_Democrat (Hey 2008, we told you so)
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To: Responsibility2nd

A boy in school recorded some other boys bullying him. When he too the recording to the Principle he got kicked out of school. The liberals are ruled by hate not law.


14 posted on 04/30/2014 3:21:35 PM PDT by mountainlion (Live well for those that did not make it back.)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Praise for a whining sniveling Commissioner that saw his 60 mins of fame! The convo was a personal one and did not involve any player or member of the Clipper Team or Staff! A leak from a Gold Digger involved with an adversary of a man who owns a major business and was not intended to be publicized!
One paragraph of private convo is to take a man down and virtually ruin his livelihood! Silver is wrong and I hope Sterling sues the hell out of the NBA and Wins! Obama to Russians “After the Election I will have more Flexibility!”
Look at the Ukraine could that be misconstrued as do as you wish to a nation and it’s population!


15 posted on 04/30/2014 3:22:02 PM PDT by DocJhn
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To: Responsibility2nd

Sterling’s ideas fail in the marketplace of ideas

Maybe. But, the ‘Market Place of Ideas” is infinite in its depth and breadth. The ‘Vast Majority’, usually WRONG, determines which idea becomes the ‘accepted norm’.

Does this mean that ALL other ideas, and those beholden to them, should be crucified, fined, impoverished ?

Tolerance used to be an American Ideal.

The Republic is (fill in the blank)...


16 posted on 04/30/2014 3:23:15 PM PDT by Paisan
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To: Cboldt
The NBA is a private club, and it can discipline Sterling all it wants. ...
What happened to him may have been illegal ...
Heh.

No inconsistency in those two statements. The NBA had the legal right to do what it did. Whoever taped Sterling and/or released the tapes may have violated California eavesdropping statutes.

17 posted on 04/30/2014 3:23:29 PM PDT by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: Cboldt

Just remember “You can’t yell FIRE in a crowded theater” and you shouldn’t dis your whore in your kitchen.


18 posted on 04/30/2014 3:24:31 PM PDT by Ed Condon (subliminal messages here in invisible ink)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Vox Populi


19 posted on 04/30/2014 3:25:03 PM PDT by bunkerhill7 ("The Second Amendment has no limits on firepower"-NY State Senator Kathleen A. Marchione.")
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To: Responsibility2nd

We’ve entered an era where people are now being punished for “wrong thinking”. I don’t care if someone’s thoughts are wrong, I care about his actions. And he did nothing that was wrong, morally or otherwise.


20 posted on 04/30/2014 3:25:41 PM PDT by Telepathic Intruder (The only thing the Left has learned from the failures of socialism is not to call it that)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Randazza is full of crap when he attacks Cliven Bundy.

I fully agree with those who think racism is wrong, but expressing it in a private conversation should NOT lead to punishment.

The investigators likely did not look very far to see if he was goaded or led into making these statements, and it appears to me that the NBA was quick to pacify the angry mob of Al Sharpton followers and the players, who were RIGHTFULLY upset over the bigotry.

Yet being UPSET should not give you the power to demand someone’s head on a platter.

Ridiculous.

I won’t even bother going through the bigoted and racist statements made by LIBERALS that have been forgiven-—and not a single penalty was heaped upon them. Now, suddenly, this man loses a BUSINESS he LAWFULLY OWNS?

INsane.


21 posted on 04/30/2014 3:26:39 PM PDT by SoFloFreeper
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To: Responsibility2nd
CNN's got it right.

As far as Sterling's morality, as far as this conversation goes, as if it was anyone else's business, if you read the transcript of the conversation, he says a whole lot of things, even "I love blacks."

This whole thing is stupid. The girl should be reprimanded for publicizing a private conversation. We all know that private conversations, especially between people intimate with each other, have nuances and meaning others may know nothing of. Too many, too quickly jumping on the anger-and-guilt-ridden, self-righteousness MSM kangaroo court band wagon.

22 posted on 04/30/2014 3:27:38 PM PDT by PapaNew
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To: Lurking Libertarian

True, but there is another “immoral” piece of the puzzle. The recording laws are in place to protect the corrupt. Politicians and other scoundrels have those laws to protect themselves.


23 posted on 04/30/2014 3:27:54 PM PDT by FreeAtlanta (Liberty or Big Government - you can't have both.)
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To: kabar

The criteria are whatever the liberals decide the criteria are, at any given time.

As we saw in this rush to judgement, what was said privately vs. his public actions were of no consequence to the liberals.


24 posted on 04/30/2014 3:27:56 PM PDT by Dilbert San Diego (Im W)
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To: Cboldt

Those two statements are not in conflict with each other.

I wonder if Sterling can sue Silver and the NBA for using the girfriend’s illegal actions as a basis for discipline.


25 posted on 04/30/2014 3:29:35 PM PDT by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
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To: Responsibility2nd

It was wrong since the vast majority of the players are racist too.


26 posted on 04/30/2014 3:31:10 PM PDT by CodeToad (Arm Up! They Are!)
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To: Lurking Libertarian
-- No inconsistency in those two statements. The NBA had the legal right to do what it did. Whoever taped Sterling and/or released the tapes may have violated California eavesdropping statutes. --

No inconsistency? So the NBA can strip owners of their property rights by relying on illegally obtained evidence.

I'd like to see the agreement that Sterling accepted, that gave the NBA the right to exclude him from his own property. I understand the 2.5 million dollar fine, but that is supposedly the maximum agreed to by all parties.

OTOH, I am rather enjoying the difficulties this new standard creates for all the sports team owners and players. Like all the "laws" in this country, the NBA outrage is selectively applied.

27 posted on 04/30/2014 3:32:39 PM PDT by Cboldt
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To: Responsibility2nd
He was lynched by the race baiters.
28 posted on 04/30/2014 3:32:39 PM PDT by AmusedBystander (The philosophy of the school room in one generation will be the philosophy of government in the next)
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To: SoFloFreeper

Like Paula Dean, he is a life long Democrat, but expendable. Dean embarrassed the Moochelle, this man had a franchise that Obama’s “friend” magic Johnson (the other magic .... ) wants.

he was toast as soon as he opened his creepy old mouth.


29 posted on 04/30/2014 3:33:11 PM PDT by FreeAtlanta (Liberty or Big Government - you can't have both.)
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To: Telepathic Intruder
I don’t care if someone’s thoughts are wrong, I care about his actions. And he did nothing that was wrong, morally or otherwise.
 

Ahh, but wrong thoughts lead to wrong actions. The very fact he had a mistress, was a legendary bigot and was a willing tool used by the shakedown reverends to support liberal agendas indicate just a few of his immoral actions.

30 posted on 04/30/2014 3:37:02 PM PDT by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
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To: Cboldt
No inconsistency? So the NBA can strip owners of their property rights by relying on illegally obtained evidence.

Sure they can.

In a criminal case, the prosecution cannot use evidence which was illegally seized by government agents, but it can use evidence illegally seized by private parties. In anything other than a criminal case (civil lawsuit, private arbitration, even a governmental proceeding like a license-revocation hearing), all illegally-obtained evidence is admissible.

31 posted on 04/30/2014 3:40:08 PM PDT by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: FreeAtlanta
Like Paula Dean, he is a life long Democrat, but expendable.

Actually, he is a registered Republican, according to the L.A. County Registrar of Voters. He made some contributions to Democrats years ago.

32 posted on 04/30/2014 3:42:44 PM PDT by Lurking Libertarian (Non sub homine, sed sub Deo et lege)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Thoughts lead to words, words lead to actions, and so forth, that’s true. Even so, I fear we are becoming a society of thought police, in which case political correctness can just as well replace traditional morality with all its consequences.


33 posted on 04/30/2014 3:45:50 PM PDT by Telepathic Intruder (The only thing the Left has learned from the failures of socialism is not to call it that)
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To: Responsibility2nd

The preening blather and self congragulation over Sterlings downfall is more disgusting than what he said

The calls to root out and bring down all real or imagined racists....and they mean white only

Is alarming

It is Hunter Diaries come real

William Pierce....pick up courtesy phone


34 posted on 04/30/2014 3:49:00 PM PDT by wardaddy (we will not take back our way of life through peaceful means.....i have 5 kids....i fear for them)
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To: Responsibility2nd
I don't think so...I think they make two moral wrongs, but I could be "wrong"! I actually agree with this writer (from CNN, of all places!)...even in this most sterling example of sleaziness, there are certainly moral and legal principles that should be upheld, regardless of how disgusting the "actors" are.

Sterling won't be convicted of anything (not that Holder's not trying)...but he will certainly be shunned and excoriated by all, far and wide. Couldn't happen to a nicer guy! /sarc

It will be somewhat interesting to see how the rest of it plays out...I doubt he can be forced by the NBA to sell the Clippers? There will be lawsuits and foot-dragging at the very least over that!!

And I would like to see that equally repulsive "mistress" of his ("V." - only needs one name, I guess) taken to court over the illegal "wire-tapping" and publication without consent...at the very least!

35 posted on 04/30/2014 3:49:51 PM PDT by 88keys (broken glass GOP; it matters, replace the Dems. 2014!!)
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To: Viennacon

My businesses are private too but let me try whites only or no queers

Privacy and association rights only extend to do gooders


36 posted on 04/30/2014 3:51:00 PM PDT by wardaddy (we will not take back our way of life through peaceful means.....i have 5 kids....i fear for them)
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To: Responsibility2nd; All

In the time we have been discussing this non-story (opinion given in private; nobody was hurt), how many inner city blacks have been killed by other blacks?

But let’s not talk about that. That would be racist.


37 posted on 04/30/2014 3:51:14 PM PDT by Red in Blue PA (When Injustice becomes Law, Resistance Becomes Duty.-Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Ed Condon

She is the whore? What does that make him?


38 posted on 04/30/2014 3:52:04 PM PDT by DallasSun
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To: griswold3

Lots to be made public or resolved if this goes beyond the he said/she said arena.
Rochelle Sterling apparently was already going after V. Stiviano based
upon the following:

snip
Some key facts about V. Stiviano, the woman at the center of the Donald Sterling scandal

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/04/29/some-key-facts-about-v-stiviano-woman-at-center-donald-sterling-scandal/

LEGAL TROUBLES

In March, Sterling’s wife, Rochelle, sued Stiviano, claiming she had received
more than $2.5 million in lavish gifts from the Clippers owner and they needed to be
returned. A big piece of the suit involves a duplex Stiviano purchased in December
for nearly $1.8 million with money that Rochelle Sterling claims Stiviano received
from her husband........

...... Stiviano has received a Ferrari, two Bentleys and a Range Rover from the Clippers’
owner, the lawsuit alleges. The vehicles are worth more than $500,000 according to the suit.

end snips


39 posted on 04/30/2014 3:54:33 PM PDT by deport
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To: Lurking Libertarian
That's the generic common law rule. But see CA penal code section 632
(d) Except as proof in an action or prosecution for violation of this section, no evidence obtained as a result of eavesdropping upon or recording a confidential communication in violation of this section shall be admissible in any judicial, administrative, legislative, or other proceeding.
I agree, that doesn't preclude the NBA from using illegally obtained evidence, plus, the witness's testimony is available even if the recording isn't. So, what about imposing a penalty in excess of the $2.5 million fine? I don't have a clue about the fine print of the owners/NBA contract, but I doubt owners would sign on to a contract giving the NBA the right to exclude them from their own property for life.
40 posted on 04/30/2014 3:56:27 PM PDT by Cboldt
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To: 88keys

And I would like to see that equally repulsive “mistress” of his (”V.” - only needs one name, I guess) taken to court over the illegal “wire-tapping” and publication without consent...at the very least!

____________________________________________

I doubt she ever had one dime to her name that Sterling didn’t give her.

But for Silver and the NBA to use her illegal and immoral recording as they did?

Thats worse than what Sterling said. He neeeds to sue the bejeebers out of the NBA.


41 posted on 04/30/2014 3:56:31 PM PDT by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
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To: mountainlion

What good is the 1st amendment when a mob can demand your destruction for your thoughts? If you cannot express your thoughts without persecution there is no freedom. Surely this was not the intention of the founders.


42 posted on 04/30/2014 3:58:01 PM PDT by Brooklyn Attitude (Things are only going to get worse.)
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To: kabar

Well, yeah....you would think so...


43 posted on 04/30/2014 4:06:18 PM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously-you won't live through it anyway-Enjoy Yourself ala Louis Prima)
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To: Brooklyn Attitude

What good is the 1st amendment when a mob can demand your destruction for your thoughts?

I’m with ya man.

I hope you’re a Yankees fan too...


44 posted on 04/30/2014 4:11:26 PM PDT by Paisan
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To: Responsibility2nd

Sterling was rude, crude and vulgar, as we can all sometimes be in the privacy of our own home. However, the punishment he received is far out of proportion to the seriousness of his private wrong. Someone wants his franchise at a bargain basement price. I hope he sues the NBA.


45 posted on 04/30/2014 4:11:38 PM PDT by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: cld51860
“Consider that two wrongs never make a right, but that three do.”

Actually, the correct phrase is, 'Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.'

46 posted on 04/30/2014 4:12:36 PM PDT by Ol' Dan Tucker (People should not be afraid of the government. Government should be afraid of the people)
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To: Responsibility2nd
I don't like basketball.
I don't like Sterling from what I've seen of him.

BUT that doesn't give folks the right to steal his money (in the form of a fine)cough cough and his team for next to nothing,
because he has an opinion people are only now hearing about.
...(or suddenly deciding to act on)

Be offended and use that to get away with anything...
47 posted on 04/30/2014 4:18:52 PM PDT by novemberslady
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To: Responsibility2nd

See tag line


48 posted on 04/30/2014 4:20:09 PM PDT by tophat9000 (An Eye for an Eye, a Word for a Word...nothing more.)
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To: Paisan

“I hope you’re a Yankees fan too...”

Of course. No one with any self respect would be a Mets fan.


49 posted on 04/30/2014 4:20:58 PM PDT by Brooklyn Attitude (Things are only going to get worse.)
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To: Brooklyn Attitude

“Of course. No one with any self respect would be a Mets fan.”

My son in NY is a Mets fan——of course he was born and raised in Boston and that says it all.

.


50 posted on 04/30/2014 4:23:47 PM PDT by Mears
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