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Use of deadly force by police rising
WSB radio ^ | 5/5/2014 | Pete Combs

Posted on 05/05/2014 4:46:46 AM PDT by from occupied ga

The GBI and several of the metro area’s largest police agencies have seen the use of deadly force rise dramatically since 2009.

It’s a trend that isn’t just happening in metro Atlanta, but across the state.

“Why would there be an increase in shooting deaths by police when crime has gone down?” asks Atlanta attorney Brian Spears.

Spears is on the board of the National Police Accountability Project at the National Lawyers Guild. A WSB/AJC investigation of police shootings in the metro area show they’ve spiked in the past four years, from 37 in 2009 to 56 in 2013.

“This is indicative of the level of violence that is directed against law enforcement officers,” says GBI Director Vernon Keenan.

Keenan says part of the problem is an increase in the number of people in psychological crisis who use weapons to confront officers.

“We are losing the craft of being a good police officer,” says Marietta Police Chief Dan Flynn.

Flynn says officers are no longer as adept at using their psychological edge in dealing with suspects. He also says many are disgusted with a prison system that cuts sentences in half almost automatically.

“You know, it maybe makes them a little quicker on the trigger,” says Flynn.

But the biggest problem, he says is that suspects are more violent and less willing to heed the consequences of attacking a cop.

Spears also blames the courts, but for a different reason.

“The courts fail to hold officers accountable,” said Spears.

Spears says police need more training in how to deal with people in psychological crisis. But Keenan says officers are already trained better and as a result they’re doing a better job of protecting themselves.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government
KEYWORDS: deadlyforce; police; shooting
Cops are shooting more people today than every before, and the reason:

THE POPULACE IS BEING MORE VIOLENT TOWARD THE POLICE or so says GBI Director Vernon Keenan (What he's not objective you say?)

I personally agree that “The courts fail to hold officers accountable,” said Spears. Is the root cause. If they can get away with murder, then they will.

1 posted on 05/05/2014 4:46:46 AM PDT by from occupied ga
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To: from occupied ga

And as the GBI knows there are more people carrying Wii Nintendo remote controllers — black and white.


2 posted on 05/05/2014 4:49:20 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: Uncle Chip
Well everyone knows that the most important thing is (trumpet fanfare):
"That the officers go home safely to their families at night."
3 posted on 05/05/2014 4:52:01 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga
officers are already trained better and as a result they’re doing a better job of protecting themselves.

Says it all, right?

4 posted on 05/05/2014 4:53:20 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy
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To: from occupied ga

According to this website, the number of police getting killed is generally trending down.

I should point out that I have no idea where the site gets these numbers.

They purport to show LEO deaths since the Founding. Color me skeptical for accuracy in the 18th and 19th centuries.


5 posted on 05/05/2014 4:56:30 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: from occupied ga

Just my personal observation when I was last in the US, police
in the last 10-20 years have been morphing into jack-booted thugs. I do not know why, unless it is the influence of TV and movie cop shows where they are always in swat gear and yelling “get on the ground. Get on the ground NOW”.
The good old boy on the beat has been replaced by whatever you want to call them.


6 posted on 05/05/2014 4:58:04 AM PDT by AlexW
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To: Sherman Logan

Sorry, here’s the site.

http://www.nleomf.org/facts/officer-fatalities-data/year.html

According to this site, LEO is #10 for dangerous jobs in USA.

http://jobs.aol.com/articles/2013/11/12/the-15-most-dangerous-jobs-in-america/

Being a fisherman is more than 5x as likely to get you killed on the job.


7 posted on 05/05/2014 5:03:13 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: from occupied ga

As we creep toward turd world status the cops are increasingly becoming death squads for dogs and human beings.


8 posted on 05/05/2014 5:03:32 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (Pubbies = national collectivists; Dems = international collectivists; We need a second party!)
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To: from occupied ga

The Ruling Elite are losing patience with the uppity serfs.


9 posted on 05/05/2014 5:06:34 AM PDT by Navy Patriot (Join the Democrats, it's not Fascism when WE do it, and the Constitution and law mean what WE say.)
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To: from occupied ga

The Albuquerque PD recently was investigated by the DOJ. They were found to be a bit zealous when it came to use of deadly force.

Since that finding, there has probably been close to one police shooting per day in ABQ and surrounding areas.


10 posted on 05/05/2014 5:09:49 AM PDT by ican'tbelieveit
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To: from occupied ga

And that doesn’t include all the terriers and poodles that get whacked..


11 posted on 05/05/2014 5:11:16 AM PDT by wonkowasright (Wonko from outside the asylum)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
Yep. A big group of them descended like buzzards on Bundy’s ranch. Grinning, and high fiving each other in anticipation of getting to shoot down some helpless men, women, and children. Only to turn tail and run like the cowards they are when they learned that the men, women, and children were not as helpless as they were led to believe.
12 posted on 05/05/2014 5:12:30 AM PDT by sport
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To: wonkowasright
Since that finding, there has probably been close to one police shooting per day in ABQ and surrounding areas.

And that is down from how many previously? But, have no fear, in a week it will be up where it was.

13 posted on 05/05/2014 5:15:58 AM PDT by sport
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To: from occupied ga

The cops are learning that they are pretty much immune from prosecution regardless of the circumstances. So why not off the occasional great unwashed? Won’t cost ya nothin’.


14 posted on 05/05/2014 5:21:40 AM PDT by Wolfie
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To: AlexW

there are no cops on the Beat, they hide in the cars with the A/C on till the shift ends. When was the last time you saw a cop walking a Beat and interacting with people?


15 posted on 05/05/2014 5:36:13 AM PDT by ABN 505
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To: Wolfie
The cops are learning that they are pretty much immune from prosecution regardless of the circumstances.

And that is the crux of the problem. Rather than being held to a higher standard when they kill or injure some member of the public, they're almost always held to no standard at all

"He made a threatening gesture." OK good enough - free pass.

Anyone know what happened to the cops who shot the 9 bystanders in NYC when they shot the guy who killed a co-worker at the empire state building? I'm guessing nothing.

16 posted on 05/05/2014 5:38:53 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga

Cops are in a no win situation. People are getting worse—behaving worse, and while “stats” say the crime-rate is going down—I personally don’t believe it.

The justice system is a joke nationally, and it’s very common for rapists and murderers to be back on the streets after serving a mild sentence only to be shuffled back into the system after a few weeks.

That said, when cops can kill dogs and people with impunity on a regular basis, what does that say about them?

How many of them brag about it?


17 posted on 05/05/2014 5:53:56 AM PDT by Roman_War_Criminal (Bible Summary in a few verses: John 14:6, John 6:29, Romans 10:9-10)
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To: from occupied ga

what a crock. more violent towards cops. please.


18 posted on 05/05/2014 5:57:48 AM PDT by CriticalJ (Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress.. But then I repeat myself. MT)
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To: from occupied ga

Militarized police will yield military style results.


19 posted on 05/05/2014 5:58:32 AM PDT by LucianOfSamasota (Tanstaafl - its not just for breakfast anymore...)
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To: from occupied ga

If you take a job that is inherently dangerous and above all else you place your safety above anything else to the point you are nervous about confrontation and you view everybody as a enemy and threat. YOU ARE IN THE WRONG JOB.


20 posted on 05/05/2014 5:59:53 AM PDT by DeWalt (Times are more like they used to be than they are today.)
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To: from occupied ga; AnAmericanMother; Apple Pan Dowdy; bfh333; Broker; clee1; ctdonath2; dansangel; ..

GA FReeper ping.


21 posted on 05/05/2014 6:01:53 AM PDT by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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To: from occupied ga
“This is indicative of the level of violence that is directed against law enforcement officers,”

Incorrect. It is indicative of the RESPONSE of LEOs to various scenaria. Violence to LEOs may be on the rise, but that is a case of the chicken or the egg (which came 1st). This is simply a symptom of our new society. Instead of resolving situations via dialogue or negotiation, the 1st resort is now violent and final. No intent on allowing difference of opinion, merely murderous suppression of opposition.

22 posted on 05/05/2014 6:04:50 AM PDT by rjsimmon (The Tree of Liberty Thirsts)
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To: ABN 505

“When was the last time you saw a cop walking a Beat and interacting with people?”
_________________________________________________________
You are right. It was simply a figure of speech.
I do know that many are jack-booted thugs, even in small towns.
I say “now” reluctantly, as I have not been in the US since Jan 2005. They are probably much worse now, judging by the movies that I see on my cable TV. Every scene shows guys in flack jackets, ready to storm whatever.


23 posted on 05/05/2014 6:10:26 AM PDT by AlexW
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To: rjsimmon

That is correct. I have 15 Auxiliary Deputies under me. Many are older guys, 40- 55, that have more experience than most young patrol Deputies. We are not paid and do everything the paid guys do. One difference we notice is how keyed up and instantly confrontational many of the young patrol guys are. The public has expressed many times, by letters and commentaries in the paper how much more they like the contact with the volunteers. Why is this? I can theorize, but not here. Maybe we should make policing volunteer like the Army or Firefighter.


24 posted on 05/05/2014 6:23:02 AM PDT by DeWalt (Times are more like they used to be than they are today.)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal

How many look for a reason to use their gun?

Its the training, the lack of consequences, militarization, and viewpoint that all civilians are criminals.


25 posted on 05/05/2014 6:27:54 AM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: from occupied ga
“Why would there be an increase in shooting deaths by police when crime has gone down?” asks Atlanta attorney Brian Spears.

Ummm... could it be that the latter is a result of the former?

26 posted on 05/05/2014 6:29:46 AM PDT by grobdriver (Where is Wilson Blair when you need him?)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal
Cops are in a no win situation

I'm not sure I agree with that. when the cop walks away and the person (innocent or guilty) is dead on the ground there is a definite winner and a definite loser, and the winner is not the one dead on the ground.

27 posted on 05/05/2014 6:31:52 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga

I don’t know what fantasy world of GA Pete Combs lives in but crime is terrible in Gwinnett county where we are.

When my Mom’s house got broken into a couple of years ago the cops that came out to take the report said crime was rampant. They said it is so bad that they have trouble responding to all the break in calls.

The other thing is they are all so young that they look like teenagers. I’m not so sure a 22 year old kid is mature enough to be patrolling the mean streets.


28 posted on 05/05/2014 6:33:19 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose o f a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: from occupied ga

I’m not in any way sticking up for the jack-boots. All I’m saying is that given the justice system, the way our “society” free-floats criminals and coddles them, cops will be on edge and short-tempered.

Somebody mentioned training above. I don’t know if that’s the answer—I don’t even know if there is an answer. We’ll never go back to Mayberry and unless citizens begin to hold them accountable for their many screw-ups (with serious jail-time) it’s only going to get worse.


29 posted on 05/05/2014 6:40:20 AM PDT by Roman_War_Criminal (Bible Summary in a few verses: John 14:6, John 6:29, Romans 10:9-10)
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To: driftdiver

“How many look for a reason to use their gun?”

Way too many

“Its the training, the lack of consequences, militarization, and viewpoint that all civilians are criminals.”

Yes I’d agree with all of the above. The “investigations” are a joke and the “us vs. them” mentality is a cancer that has been around for decades.


30 posted on 05/05/2014 6:42:55 AM PDT by Roman_War_Criminal (Bible Summary in a few verses: John 14:6, John 6:29, Romans 10:9-10)
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To: Sherman Logan

I had to look it up on that link because my grandfather was one of the 122 killed on duty for 1942. He’s on the Laurens Co, GA memorial and the national memorial in D.C.

I don’t have a problem with LEOs shooting the feral criminals of today, if necessary. It’s the deadly force they use when they aren’t sure, or when they fake a crime to excuse their actions or when they just attack innocents.


31 posted on 05/05/2014 7:02:17 AM PDT by Shimmer1 (They don't think think they are above the law. They think they are the law.)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal
We’ll never go back to Mayberry and unless citizens begin to hold them accountable for their many screw-ups (with serious jail-time) it’s only going to get worse.

Although I'm the last one to give cops a free pass I agree that there are situations where they have to shoot. For example, there was a rise in the numbers of people shot by police after Katrina and the storm flushed out the sewers of NO and the residue came to Atlanta. From what I could tell most if not all of these were justified. However, when there are no consequences to the individual officer for the unjustified ones, that is what leads to the rise in shootings.

For example, recently one of the dickless Tracys shoot and killed a teenager who had the poor judgment to answer her knock at the door with a Wii contoller in his hand. She was serving a warrant on his father, but didn't identify herself as a cop. Just killed the kid when he opened the door. This happened in Feb, and to the best of my knowledge the cop hasn't faced any charges yet. At first the police lied (big surprise eh?) and said the kid pointed a gun at her, but since no gun was found (guess she wasn't organized enough to carry a throw away for such occasions) and none of her fellow officers got there in time to plant a gun, plus there were whitnesses who said he had a Wii controller not a gun, that lie didn't fly. The shooting is currently being "investigated" by the GBI. Look for whitewash in large quantities.

32 posted on 05/05/2014 7:03:08 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga
“Why would there be an increase in shooting deaths by police when crime has gone down?” asks Atlanta attorney Brian Spears.

Perhaps a significant number of those shot were responsible for a significant percentage of crime?

33 posted on 05/05/2014 7:14:11 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
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To: Georgia Girl 2
crime is terrible in Gwinnett county where we are.

There is some where I am, but the last time anything was stolen, it was some kids from across the street who went into my garage and stole about 10 rounds of .50 cal. Their parents came over to return the ammo and demand an explananion as wo why I had it. I thanked them for returning it, and I demended an explanation as to why kids think that they could take things from other peoples' garages.

34 posted on 05/05/2014 7:15:23 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: PapaBear3625
Perhaps a significant number of those shot were responsible for a significant percentage of crime?

A reasonable theory. I read someplace that a small fraction of career criminals commit a disproportionate number of crimes.

35 posted on 05/05/2014 7:16:46 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga

While this may be partly true, I also see it as a rising determination by citizens who are stopped by or near police asserting their rights more aggressively. And, the resulting response by police is not often one of accommodation or accession of basic rights, but of outright oppression.

Frankly, too many of these buzz head, steroid Rambos need to be somewhere else than on a police force, IMO.


36 posted on 05/05/2014 7:35:58 AM PDT by Gaffer (Comprehensive Immigration Reform is just another name for Comprehensive Capitulation)
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To: Shimmer1

It seems the murder rate is down, dramatically; the total crime rate is down, less significantly; and the number of LEOs killed each seems to be declining.

Under these circumstance for the number of people being shot by LEOs to be going up each year doesn’t seem to be justified.

Of course, arguably the reason fewer LEOs are being killed is because they are killing the other guys first. :)

I think it is indisputably a bad idea for LEOs to investigate LEO shootings.


37 posted on 05/05/2014 7:47:39 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: from occupied ga

Their parents should have come over and begged you not to press charges. Unbelievable!


38 posted on 05/05/2014 7:50:09 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose o f a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: Georgia Girl 2
Their parents should have come over and begged you not to press charges. Unbelievable!

No good would have come of it if I had. I'd rather save the big response for something more substantive. I'm a pretty much leave me alone and I'll leave you alone person.

39 posted on 05/05/2014 7:55:49 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: from occupied ga

Well when the SHTF you know where they stand. In your way. :-)


40 posted on 05/05/2014 7:59:36 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose o f a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: from occupied ga

“Spears is on the Board of the National Police Accountibility Project of the National Lawyers Guild...”

Consider the source.


41 posted on 05/05/2014 8:13:40 AM PDT by VietVet (I am old enough to know who I am and what I believe, and I 'm not inclined to apologize for any of)
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To: from occupied ga

You live in West Mogadishu (Atlanta)?

I have to commute to this sewer almost every day.
I agree with pretty much everything you wrote.

You remember the Erik Scott case in Nevada? The POS that pulled the trigger is now a two-time offender. Which is exactly what you’re talking about.


42 posted on 05/05/2014 9:42:25 AM PDT by Roman_War_Criminal (Bible Summary in a few verses: John 14:6, John 6:29, Romans 10:9-10)
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To: FreedomPoster

YIKES! Just got my CCL renewed, well they don’t renew
them you have to apply all over again, electro print
and all and now the price is $79.25. (Course now you get
your picture on it too.) How nice.
Last time it was 35.00. of course that was 5 years ago.
And they say there is no inflation...
Have carried now for 15 years and never had to draw it
but the license is worth the price.

Just got my DL renewed and now you have to have documentation of citizenship and several forms of ID.
A good thing I guess but at least here in Ga. you have
to have it to vote.


43 posted on 05/05/2014 9:55:36 AM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
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To: Roman_War_Criminal
You remember the Erik Scott case in Nevada

Gunned down at costco. Naturally it was considered a "good shoot." Aren't all of them.

44 posted on 05/05/2014 9:59:06 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: Sherman Logan

Boy do I ever agree with you! Why not have the fox guard the henhouse, right???!!!!


45 posted on 05/05/2014 10:14:24 AM PDT by Shimmer1 (They don't think think they are above the law. They think they are the law.)
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To: DeWalt

I have even noticed this just watching COPS vs. Alaska State Troopers. On COPS the officers are ready to go Rambo if you ask a question or look the wrong way. On AST the troopers actually take time to talk and listen to the people they come in contact with, at least they have from every episode I have watched.

I had an older officer tell me that in many cases when his department is contacted the callers will ask for certain officers to respond if possible because they know they will listen to the parties involved rather than go into roger ram jet mode.


46 posted on 05/05/2014 11:24:02 AM PDT by sarge83
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To: from occupied ga
...as Abraham Maslow said in 1966, "I suppose it is tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail."

The "War on" - (problems du jour) mentality invites so called Peace Officers to respond in the most unpeaceful way available.

47 posted on 05/06/2014 4:05:28 PM PDT by higgmeister ( In the Shadow of The Big Chicken!)
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