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Pension chaos hits Chicago, Illinois budgets
Crain's Chicago Business ^ | July 04, 2014 | GregHinz.

Posted on 07/04/2014 10:40:22 PM PDT by george76

yesterday's decision in a key Illinois Supreme Court case has set off a first-class explosion in state and local government, potentially punching tens of billions of dollars in holes in their collective budgets.

Some elements of the court's decision are drawing intense debate. But if the overnight consensus is anywhere near correct, everyone from City Hall and the Capitol to your local village and school board will have little option now but to dig deep, cut services and raise taxes a lot — and labor unions little incentive to compromise.

"The law in Illinois is now crystal clear: Politicians cannot break the promises made to Chicago teachers and other city employees," crowed the Chicago Teachers Union in a statement. "Recently passed laws to cut promised retirement benefits are clearly unconstitutional."

(Excerpt) Read more at chicagobusiness.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: Illinois; US: Michigan
KEYWORDS: chicago; illinois; laborunions; taxes; teacher; teachers; teachersunion; teacherunion; union; unions
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1 posted on 07/04/2014 10:40:22 PM PDT by george76
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To: george76

Declare bankruptcy. Pennies on the dollar.

Seems to be working for Detroit.

Just not sure how well it’ll work out for the U.S. Government...


2 posted on 07/04/2014 10:43:26 PM PDT by TigerClaws
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To: george76
Love it. Let the “king” with half a finger squirm as tries to scale back union influence. Watch as he tries everything except the right thing—make the union thugs pay for their own pensions.
3 posted on 07/04/2014 10:43:27 PM PDT by Fungi
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To: george76
guess they gotta cut the EBT Nation then...
4 posted on 07/04/2014 10:44:34 PM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -vvv- NO Pity for the LAZY - 86-44)
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To: george76

There is another option: “walk away”.

If taxes in you municipality are scheduled to become unbearable, then schedule yourself to move.


5 posted on 07/04/2014 10:46:33 PM PDT by Born to Conserve
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To: Born to Conserve

On it, getting things lined up right now.
So damn done with the pukes in this county.


6 posted on 07/04/2014 10:51:07 PM PDT by AllAmericanGirl44
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To: george76

Last one out of Illinois, please turn off the lights.


7 posted on 07/04/2014 10:52:11 PM PDT by RightGeek (FUBO and the donkey you rode in on)
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To: george76

I don’t blame teachers who worked and were promised brnefits. I blame politicians who have overspent on this and everything else. They are like 3 year olds in a candy store with no concept of how much money they have. Or rather, we have.


8 posted on 07/04/2014 10:54:06 PM PDT by Williams
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To: george76

Argentina, here we come


9 posted on 07/04/2014 10:55:38 PM PDT by PGR88
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To: Chode

This is the beginning of the end.


10 posted on 07/04/2014 10:58:37 PM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Lurker
Beautiful Friend, the End....
11 posted on 07/04/2014 11:00:37 PM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -vvv- NO Pity for the LAZY - 86-44)
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To: All

“cannot write (the Illinois Constitution) to include restrictions and limitations that the drafters did not express and the citizens of Illinois did not approve,”

oh, we’re following the constitution now.


12 posted on 07/04/2014 11:11:30 PM PDT by willywill
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To: george76

They want to pretend they didn’t know this was coming. They did.


13 posted on 07/04/2014 11:12:40 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: Born to Conserve

unless you rent, you’ll be stuck with property taxes.


14 posted on 07/04/2014 11:13:23 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man ( Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: Williams

Government officials gave unions whatever they wanted, it wasn’t their money after all. The whole thing should be considered illegitimate from the get-go


15 posted on 07/04/2014 11:14:16 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: Chode
Watch property values tank. It's called PIT. Principle, interest and taxes. PIT should be below 40% of owner's monthly income. I might think my home is worth $500,000 but the buyers can only pay $400,000; there goes $100,000 of equity to the unions.

I am waiting for the collapse here in California. Already moving my business to Nevada. Screw them all

16 posted on 07/04/2014 11:17:23 PM PDT by Kozy
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To: Secret Agent Man

Huh?


17 posted on 07/04/2014 11:20:30 PM PDT by Born to Conserve
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To: Born to Conserve

if you on property in a massively worsening tax hell, you may not be able to get a buyer and you will be stuck with huge property taxes, whether you move or not.


18 posted on 07/04/2014 11:27:04 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man ( Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: Secret Agent Man
If you have little equity, stop paying the taxes and mortgage. Let it default and repo. The bank can have the bad property.
19 posted on 07/04/2014 11:48:42 PM PDT by Myrddin
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To: george76; All
Did you see this little gem of insane reasoning in the article:

"Some still see hope in a negotiated approach in which labor groups, for instance, agree to pay more for their pensions in exchange for pay hikes. That's the "consideration" approach pushed by Mr. Cullerton.

OK, boys and girls....what's wrong with that??

20 posted on 07/05/2014 12:09:05 AM PDT by ken5050 ("One useless man is a shame, two are a law firm, three or more are a Congress".. John Adams)
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To: ken5050
OK, boys and girls....what's wrong with that??

Ooh! Ooh! Ooh!

"...pay more for their pensions in exchange for pay hikes" ???

21 posted on 07/05/2014 12:19:19 AM PDT by dr_lew
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To: george76
I have to put my reflex Conservatism on hold for this specific issue.

My 87 year old Aunt taught 1st Grade in Chicago for 30 years after her husband was killed, and she had to raise my “baby” cousin entirely with her own money.

All her income and all her health benefits come from that program.

22 posted on 07/05/2014 12:27:29 AM PDT by zeestephen
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To: Myrddin

i’m just saying for most property owners,it’s a lot more complicated than “hey, just move away”.


23 posted on 07/05/2014 12:40:37 AM PDT by Secret Agent Man ( Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: zeestephen

No person who has an ounce of compassion wishes this on anybody, but the unions and politicians have spent the pot and there is nothing left.

People, like your aunt, will suffer for being led by fools. It’s better, while you can, to help her downsize when she can make a choice to do so rather than in haste after it is announced that there is no money.


24 posted on 07/05/2014 12:42:27 AM PDT by Jonty30 (What Islam and secularism have in common is that they are both death cults)
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To: Jonty30

There are going to be heartbreak stories like this, like there were about holders of the old GM and Chrysler stock.

If there is any justice left on earth, the politicians will pay symbolically if not literally. What may happen instead is that there will be a Federal bail out.


25 posted on 07/05/2014 1:00:28 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
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To: Jonty30

Let’s not forget in many instances the locally elected uneducated school board members and their attorneys who failed to negotiate for common sense retirement packages.


26 posted on 07/05/2014 1:05:47 AM PDT by Maudeen ("End Times Warrior - Just a Sinner Saved by Grace")
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To: Williams
I don’t blame teachers who worked and were promised brnefits.

You are being way too kind to them.

A) They are claiming to be smart, so as to teach our kids, yet they didn't see something this obvious coming???

B) Much of the money that should have gone to fund their pensions instead went into their pockets as raises. The rest went for various pet causes and projects done at their behast as members of (along with the non-teacher public employees) the interest group that's been running Illinois for ever. They, collectively, are responsible for this and deserve every consequence resulting from it. So, as good libs, they are trying to duck all responsibility and shove the consequences onto the innocent.

As changing the Illinois constitution to allow sanity short of a federal bankruptcy court (in which maybe their state constitutional pension protections will be thrown the way of other states straight marriage clauses) remains politically impossible they have few choices. Mine would be to employ one of the key principles of liberalism: liberals think they can tax anything they want. E.g. their home state prodigy and his bud, John Roberts, on ObamaCare. So if you can't reduce the size of government pensions and benefits, give them their 'full' pensions/benefits but tax them enough to make the math work. As members of government employee unions ARE the rich for once they'd be honest in their 'tax the rich' statements.

27 posted on 07/05/2014 2:03:57 AM PDT by JohnBovenmyer (Obama been Liberal. Hope Change!)
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To: Williams

There is some guilt on the part of the employees but I agree that they’re the least guilty. The true guilt lies with the politicians and union officials who made deals they knew were unsustainable.

There should be criminal consequences for those who make impossible deals like this.


28 posted on 07/05/2014 3:10:59 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin.)
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To: JohnBovenmyer
A dimo-0-crat tactic from the era of the Great Depression:

Spend, Spend, Spend (Or promise, promise) - Elect, Elect, Elect (say, as in that Thad guy) - Tax, Tax, Tax!

This cycle has been successful for nearly a century and shows no evidence of being stopped.

29 posted on 07/05/2014 3:18:42 AM PDT by jamaksin
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To: Secret Agent Man

unless you rent, you’ll be stuck with property taxes.
*******************************
The property owner(s) have to pay property taxes, so that is rolled into what the renters pay each month.

Only difference is that renters don’t get a deduction from the Fed or State income tax returns.


30 posted on 07/05/2014 3:31:35 AM PDT by octex
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To: george76
"The law in Illinois is now crystal clear: Politicians cannot break the promises made to Chicago teachers and other city employees," crowed the Chicago Teachers Union in a statement. "Recently passed laws to cut promised retirement benefits are clearly unconstitutional."

The Chicago politicians must be pikers - the ones in D.C. have no problem breaking promises - especially to vets....

31 posted on 07/05/2014 3:32:58 AM PDT by trebb (Where in the the hell has my country gone?)
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To: Secret Agent Man

“unless you rent, you’ll be stuck with property taxes.”

That, and the IL government will go to what CA’s did.. play robber baron vs. millionaires and create fees for nearly everything but breathing (and likely they’re working on that one too).


32 posted on 07/05/2014 3:33:38 AM PDT by ScottinVA (If it doesn't include border security, it isn't "reform." It's called "amnesty.")
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To: Williams

Teachers? Sure. But how about Chicago garbage collectors ($50.00/Hour), or Street/Sanitation workers ($60-$70.00/Hour)? Some of them make a lot more than the teachers.


33 posted on 07/05/2014 3:45:59 AM PDT by apoxonu
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To: apoxonu

“.....schedule yourself to move.”......

I hope they stay out of Wisconsin, we already have more of them than we need or want.


34 posted on 07/05/2014 3:55:57 AM PDT by DaveA37
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To: ScottinVA

Reference: ‘The Taxman’ by the Beatles.

Let me tell you how it will be
There’s one for you, nineteen for me


35 posted on 07/05/2014 4:03:57 AM PDT by originalbuckeye (Moderation in temper is always a virtue; moderation in principle is always a vice. Paine)
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To: dr_lew

Channeling Horshack?


36 posted on 07/05/2014 4:04:47 AM PDT by originalbuckeye (Moderation in temper is always a virtue; moderation in principle is always a vice. Paine)
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To: george76

What governments and courts seem to not understand is that the “services” that underpin the pensions cannot be provided along with the pensions.

If taxpayers get no/fewer services for the level of taxes they pay, they tend to stop paying taxes - either deliberately, or as a consequence of productive activity fleeing oppressive taxation - leaving the tax base barren.

At this point, according to the courts, no future government can possibly exist in any of these areas because the overhead financial obligation makes it impossible.


37 posted on 07/05/2014 4:09:26 AM PDT by RFEngineer
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To: GeronL
‘swhy public employee unions are unfair to the general public.
38 posted on 07/05/2014 4:17:19 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (Rip it out by the roots.)
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To: Kozy
As Charles Dickens said about small town France before the revolution:

The village had its one poor street, with its poor brewery, poor tannery, poor tavern, poor stable-yard for relays of post-horses, poor fountain, all usual poor appointments. It had its poor people too. All its people were poor, and many of them were sitting at their doors, shredding spare onions and the like for supper, while many were at the fountain, washing leaves, and grasses, and any such small yieldings of the earth that could be eaten. Expressive sips of what made them poor, were not wanting; the tax for the state, the tax for the church, the tax for the lord, tax local and tax general, were to be paid here and to be paid there, according to solemn inscription in the little village, until the wonder was, that there was any village left unswallowed.

39 posted on 07/05/2014 4:55:22 AM PDT by ALPAPilot
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To: Lurker

I read here some time back that some companies, medical supply houses, were cutting Illinois off because of unpaid bills.

The end has been in process for quite some time. The months near the end of the fiscal year are tough on a treasurer with no cash


40 posted on 07/05/2014 4:59:50 AM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... Obama is public enemy #1)
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To: Secret Agent Man

There were a lot of jews in Germany that felt the same way. I think some of them became lamp shades.


41 posted on 07/05/2014 5:34:17 AM PDT by Gadsden1st
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To: Williams

The teachers make up the union which along with the school boards have extorted the money from the taxpayers. So why not blame the teachers? Did these teachers believe they could just keep getting more and more from the taxpayer piñata?

The less educated teachers have my sympathy in the same way welfare dependent Social Security recipients have it. Many believe they should collect Social Security because it was promised to them by politicians. Now they have discovered politicians lie and they want taxpayers to make it good,


42 posted on 07/05/2014 5:52:31 AM PDT by FreedomNotSafety
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To: cripplecreek
There is some guilt on the part of the employees but I agree that they’re the least guilty.

Nope, the conservative taxpayer is the least guilty. The liberal taxpayers voted for the politicians that put this in. The conservative taxpayer/voter is only guilty of being stupid enough to stick around for the bill.

The teachers voted in the union thugs, supported the union thugs, threatened strikes, and went on strike to get these contracts.

And then, they do a poor job of teaching, willing to try any new tricks that fail, but avoiding things like phonics that work.

43 posted on 07/05/2014 6:42:47 AM PDT by slowhandluke (It's hard to be cynical enough in this age.)
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To: george76

They think they can negotiate with the unions to cut ANY benefit? Hahahahahahahahahahahaha!
Unions won’t just ride a horse into the ground, they’ll chop it up and eat it and then steal your horse.


44 posted on 07/05/2014 6:43:53 AM PDT by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: FreedomNotSafety

Many of you need to grow up. Who would turn down a good job?


45 posted on 07/05/2014 6:54:34 AM PDT by Williams
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To: Secret Agent Man

Unfortunately, the landlord will pass as much of the real estate tax increase on to the tenants in the form of higher rent, like any other expense. And if all the competing landlords get hit with higher taxes, they will perform in unison by raising the market rental rates.


46 posted on 07/05/2014 6:56:03 AM PDT by john drake (Lucius Accius-Roman,170 BC - "oderint dum metuant" translated "Let them hate so long as they fear")
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To: slowhandluke

Well duh, of course the taxpayer us least guilty but I was only talking about people who are guilty and not real interested in nit pick arguments.

Anyone union or non union who tells me that they demand less money for the good of the company or city, is a liar.


47 posted on 07/05/2014 6:56:54 AM PDT by cripplecreek (Remember the River Raisin.)
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To: Kozy
100%
48 posted on 07/05/2014 7:14:59 AM PDT by Chode (Stand UP and Be Counted, or line up and be numbered - *DTOM* -vvv- NO Pity for the LAZY - 86-44)
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To: george76

Welcome to DETROIT II.


49 posted on 07/05/2014 7:37:36 AM PDT by VideoDoctor
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To: Myrddin

Then where are you going to live? Landlords won’t rent to you with a foreclosure on your record and you obviously cannot purchase another home for many years until your credit is built back up.


50 posted on 07/05/2014 7:45:41 AM PDT by Velveeta
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