Pentagon Will Increase Artillery Production Sixfold for Ukraine

New York Times ^ | Jan. 24, 2023 | John Ismay and Eric Lipton

[Lumper20]

Ukraine was the Biden family bank with no limit. Now Biden puts us on line. What a POS.

[Zhang Fei]

Ukraine ping

Arcadian Empire: [America’s military capabilities should be reserved for America’s interests.]

---

We are advancing the national interest at a huge discount. We spent about the same amount in Afghanistan plinking terrorists. Keeping Russia ambitions at bay (and, secondarily, the Germans down) is the very reason NATO exists. In Afghanistan, we spent, per year, about the same amount we’re spending on Ukraine. In 20 years, we spent about $1T to kill perhaps tens of thousands of Taliban.

https://www.cbo.gov/system/files?file=2018-10/54219-oco_spending.pdf#page=20

In a single year of fighting in Ukraine, around 100,000 Russian soldiers lie dead. While Ukraine has also paid a high price, it is essentially fighting the war of independence that was postponed when the Soviet Union broke up. Freedom isn’t free. The Revolutionary War killed 50,000 Americans out of 3m, or 1.6% of the population. To match our casualties, Ukraine would have to lose 700K dead. So far, their casualties are unbearable to the families affected but tolerable for the nation as a whole. They also understand that those casualties would be far greater if they are conquered and inevitably drafted into Putin’s future military campaigns. So they fight both for their freedom and for the right not to be part of Putin’s imperial wars.

Neutrality has been fool’s gold for any number of countries throughout history. The problem is that it’s not really a long term solution. Countries that stayed aloof as conquerors gathered men and territory via armed invasion have generally fallen to those conquerors*. The trick to staying out of the maws of empire-builders has always been to deal with small fires before they become infernos. That’s what we’re doing by supplying Ukraine against Russia. It’s a mirror image of what the Russians did by supplying North Korea and North Vietnam with artillery, fighter jets, tanks and SAMs against us, killing 100,000 GI’s. We’re just returning the favor.

I have no issues with Russia per se. If Putin had stayed within his borders, the world would be a happier place. He poisons one Ukrainian leader Yushchenko, with dioxin, buys another, Yanukovich, and the world shrugs. The moment a Russian invasion force crosses the border - that’s when we sit up and pay attention.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Yushchenko#TCDD_poisoning
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Yanukovych#Exile

* Switzerland tried to be neutral as Napoleon trudged through Europe. Napoleon overran it. Belgium and Holland declared their neutrality, refusing French troops access to their defensive positions. Hitler romped through both countries anyway.

[SaveFerris]

yep

[Lumper20]

For those of us who have fought for it-freedom has a special flavor the protected will never know.

[Lumper20]

For those of us who have fought for it freedom has a special flavor the protected will never know.

[familyop]

The following is related to my former MOS and is being internationally investigated and documented in Ukraine. That's why the information appears in Ukrainian media first.

Russia is Killing Civilians with Toys, Food and Appliances, the Threat of Mining is Significant
https://en.defence-ua.com/weapon_and_tech/russia_is_killing_civilians_with_toys_food_and_appliances_the_threat_of_mining_is_significant-5520.html

[JonPreston]

Our elections are as fake as your claimed battle with Satin. Please grow up and start acting like an American man.

[JonPreston]

It’s time to get yourself to the front line. zelensky need help

[Gnome1949]

What a monumental fraud and lie is being presented here. Ukraine is not one UNITED people. Those in the East are ethnically Russian. Those in the West are historically Polish, Romanian and Hungarian.

Those in Eastern Ukraine were not “invaded” and “conquered.”

They consider themselves LIBERATED by Russia. To call Russia an invader when those liberated are grateful to be part of Russia is part of this great deceit to try and call good evil and evil good.

Thousands of civilians died over the past eight years in Donbas as the hostile Kiev government ordered continuous artillery shelling of the pro-Russian civilians there.

They are ethnically Russian. It is their culture and language. They never accepted the American-instigated 2014 coup in Kiev that saw the elected government there OVERTHROWN. It was replaced by a government MURDEROUSLY HOSTILE to the ethnic Russians in Eastern Ukraine.

Shame on those who argue to escalate a murderous war for “freedom” for Ukrainians when it is Russia following the desires and wishes of those in Donbas to be “free” of the tyrants in Kiev who want those liberated there to all be dead.

There was no “freedom” from tyranny and death in the Donbas until Russia liberated the people there. They were not allowed to live in peace until the Russians arrived.

Why are Americans arguing against people getting the government they have a right to seek, choose and receive? This was the basis for the founding of the USA. Does that not apply elsewhere?

[familyop]

In regards to some of the Russian propaganda that we've seen,...

Address by the President of Ukraine on the occasion of the International Holocaust Remembrance Day [Transcript in English.]
https://freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/4126419/posts

[Lumper20]

Facts: 1. Biden gives Ukraine all it asks for/demands.
2. Biden robs Americans of our oil reserves for his
foreign handouts.
3.Biden sends Patriot’s to Ukraine.
4.Biden is sending Abram’s tanks to Ukraine.

What is the darn EU doing?

[Cronos]

Far from it.

Putin wants to recreate the Tsarist empire

[Cronos]

Wwe has not begun. Right now it is only Russia invading Ukraine. No one else at war.

And ww3 was what we call the great war from 1914 to 1918.

The first world war was the 7 years war of the 18th century

The second was the Napoleonic war

[Cronos]

Ukraine already won in March to not become a vassal state of the Kremlin, like Belarus.

It is trying to push back Putin to Feb 22 borders

[BeauBo]

“That’s why we’re supplying the Ukrainians - to prevent the Russians from getting stronger and moving on to additional conquests down the road.

That is certainly in our interest, and the Ukrainian Military is a great force multiplier in achieving that, while spending just a small fraction of our routine defense budget (somewhat over 2% in 2022).

Additionally, beyond deterring just future Russian aggression, we are also defending a great defensive coordinating mechanism, in the rules-based International order, and the established laws of war. that deter, and help defeat, aggressors generally (looking at you China).

And let’s not forget that we specifically committed to defend Ukraine from just such an invasion in the Budapest agreement in 1994, in exchange for the Ukraine handing over the world’s third biggest stockpile of nuclear weapons. It was not a legally binding ratified treaty, but it is a matter of honor and credibility.

[buwaya]

Taiwan is a vastly different case.

There are limited viable landing beaches and Taiwan has >2000 artillery pieces and 1500+ tanks with which to meet the enemy landing craft on these beaches. It will be Omaha beachx50.

If China gets a beachhead, that lasts over a week, that it can reinforce, then China will land such vast numbers that the jig is up for Taiwan.

That battle is going to be decided quickly, probably in hours.

The Chinese landings will succeed, or they will fail. If they fail the attempt will be incredibly bloody and destructive, to a degree that it will take a long time before China can try again.

Whatever the outcome, the two sides will not get to a situation where they will be bombarding each other WWI style for months.

[familyop]

“What is the darn EU doing?”

That’s a good question for someone who has the time to make a list of many thousands of items from the EU and other countries.

Here are a few links taken from a news aggregator for a few minutes—not even close to a day’s worth. Germany and the Netherlands are also sending Patriot systems.

Canada and France follow United States and Germany in pledging tank supplies for Ukraine
https://www.euronews.com/2023/01/27/canada-and-france-follow-united-states-and-germany-in-pledging-tank-supplies-for-ukraine

British Defence Ministry explains how tanks will help Ukraine and shows their capabilities
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/01/27/7386734/

Reznikov thanks Canada for Leopard 2 tanks
https://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/887312.html

Ukrainian soldiers deepen knowledge of international humanitarian law as part of training in UK
https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-defense/3660241-ukrainian-soldiers-deepen-knowledge-of-international-humanitarian-law-as-part-of-training-in-uk.html

Tanks for Ukraine: Emerging Europe this week
https://emerging-europe.com/news/tanks-for-ukraine-emerging-europe-this-week/

Zelenskiy Hails ‘Tank Coalition’ As Fighting Rages In Eastern Ukraine
https://www.rferl.org/a/fighting-eastern-ukraine-zelenskiy-tank-coalition/32241947.html

Ukrainian military arrive in Germany for training on Marder infantry fighting vehicles
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/01/27/7386761/

France, Italy close to supplying ‘Mamba’ air defence system to Ukraine
https://www.euractiv.com/section/global-europe/news/france-italy-close-to-supplying-mamba-air-defence-system-to-ukraine/

Britain offers to build arms factory for Ukraine in Poland
https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2023/01/27/7386731/

Ukrainian servicemen arrive in Germany to master Marder IFV
https://mil.in.ua/en/news/ukrainian-servicemen-arrive-in-germany-to-master-marder-ifv/

Not only Leopards: Poland ready to send 60 modernized Soviet-era tanks to Ukraine, Polish PM says
https://euromaidanpress.com/2023/01/27/not-only-leopards-poland-ready-to-send-60-modernized-soviet-era-tanks-to-ukraine-polish-pm-says/

Estonia wants to transfer cluster ammunition to Ukraine, German permission is needed
https://mil.in.ua/en/news/estonia-wants-to-transfer-cluster-ammunition-to-ukraine-german-permission-is-needed/

Ukraine to receive additional tranche of UAVs
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/air-platforms/latest/ukraine-to-receive-additional-tranche-of-uavs

Energy hub for aid to Ukraine opened in Poland
https://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/887320.html

Cambodia trains Ukrainian deminers
https://www.asianmilitaryreview.com/2023/01/cambodia-trains-ukrainian-deminers/

[BeauBo]

In addition to increasing artillery shell production, rocket (HIMARS) and assorted missile production is ramping up significantly as well.

Putin’s legacy - a rearmed West, and a weak and isolated Russia.

[familyop]

Ukraine is determined to take back everything from before 2014—especially Crimea. Also,...

Diplomacy Watch: White House signals that retaking Crimea is in the cards
Experts warn that it’s an escalation, but officials say it has been US policy all along.
Responsible Statecraft
Blaise Malley
JANUARY 20, 2023
https://responsiblestatecraft.org/2023/01/20/diplomacy-watch-white-house-signals-that-retaking-crimea-is-in-the-cards/

U.S. Warms to Helping Ukraine Target Crimea - The New York Times
Today
Jan. 18, 2023 Updated 5:43 p.m. ET.
WASHINGTON — For years, the United States has insisted that Crimea is still part of Ukraine.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/18/us/politics/ukraine-crimea-military.html

Crimea Is Ukraine
PRESS STATEMENT
ANTONY J. BLINKEN, SECRETARY OF STATE
FEBRUARY 25, 2021
https://www.state.gov/crimea-is-ukraine/

Treasury Sanctions Russian Persons in the Crimea Region of Ukraine
U.S. Department of the Treasury
April 15, 2021
https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy0125

[buwaya]

“What is the darn EU doing?”

Sending most of the actual equipment and ammo and civilian aid that Ukraine has been receiving. Ex. Poland and the other Eastern Euro countries have already sent @400 T-72 type tanks.