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To: Nita Nupress
If some of the stuff described is so easy to do, how come it hasn't been done before?

It is being done now, it was done in the subways of Tokyo several years ago by Aum Shinryuko(sp?) and Saddam/Usama almost certainly have programs running. The most difficult part, and that nobody apparently has a solution for yet, is getting the agent into an aerosol solution so it can be easily sprayed. Just creating large amounts of the agent is simple, and a load of botulinum toxin, for instance, could be used to poison pretty much anything, from rivers to individuals.

How would terrorists go about creating and using these biological weapons?

1) In a hospital in Iraq, elite soldiers from Saddam's special weapons divisions would collect samples of diseased tissue suspected to contain the "right" diseases.

or 1) In a hospital in America, one of Usama's "sleepers," a doctor, would collect samples of diseased tissue, and would then smuggle it out of the country.

2) They would move these to secret labratories where they would separate out a colony of diseased cells, and then grow them en masse in vats full of agar or other growth media.

3) They would then remove everything but the harmful agent (bacteria or poison created by the bacteria)

4) Smuggle these into the US the same way drugs and illegals are smuggled in. With only one small capsule, packed with the agent, it would have a very good chance of making it into the country.

5) Once inside America, the agent would be expanded, possibly put in multiple containers, and set in aerosol or some other delivery mechanism

6) Set in crop duster with a banner trailing behind it, and fly over a packed football stadium. Or fly over the stadium before anyone arrives, and then let them sit in it. Who would notice a plane making a single pass near an empty stadium, high in the air and letting the wind carry the agent onto the seats?

Or: 6) release agent in a major airport, in the hopes the disease would be spread widely across America

Or: 6) release the agent in the Capitol building (or any of the congressional office buildings), killing hundreds of legislators and paralyzing the American government

These things can be carried out by pretty much any college graduate with a degree in biology, although a team, including a Ph.D. or two would not be impossible to obtain and would be much more likely to succeed. The methods of growing large amounts of biologial matter are no secret, they are exceedingly simple. The materials are for the most part easy to acquire, some could be had from culinary suppliers, all they would have to do is pretend to be interested in cooking and order them from catalogues straight to their homes. I don't know how hard agar is to make, but it's just made of seaweed (I think), it would not be hard to produce. The rest can be bought straight from dozens of scientific supply companies (of course, that would arouse suspicion, so they would not be able to buy them directly).

But what if a well-liked "sleeper" unit began teaching a high school biotech class? (there are such things) She wouldn't even "look like a terrorist," to the people out there who think hijabs and turbans are signs of support for Usama, because she would be like the terrorists who hijacked the planes. They attempted to fit in to our culture as much as possible to avoid scrutiny, as would she--she would wear NY Yankees baseball caps and pretend to be a "real New Yorker," and most people would buy it. Over the summer "oops" all of the materials disappear, smuggled over our southern border in a truck that won't be inspected. By the time school officials realize the material is missing, the teacher is long gone (she took a vacation at the start of summer, and didn't bother coming back), and the material is safely in the terrorists' labs.

Even curbing access to such equipment wouldn't be enough, because any engineer currently working for a biotech firm could pack his bags, move to Iraq, and start building similar machines for Saddam, although they wouldn't be as good as those built by scientific supply companies (and wouldn't come with warranties).

If they can successfully make biological weapons, they will use them, the idea of a doomsday weapon appeals too much to the fatalistic, apocalyptic terrorists. We have to stop them from making these weapons, we can't allow terrorists or terrorist states the privacy and security to develop these horrendous weapons. The UN weapons inspectors we had in Iraq were not enough, even when we had them. We need to keep these people on the run. If they have any permanent facilities, they could grow the agents. If they have any networks, they can attempt to smuggle the samples out and full containers into the US.


How much would you like to bet that somewhere in England, a Muslim terrorist (or any other kind of terrorist) has a vial of cow drool that might contain foot and mouth disease? Or has the sample already been smuggled out? (this particular disease wouldn't kill people, but could cause great harm to our livestock--we might have to all become vegetarians, a fate worse than death)

32 posted on 09/22/2001 6:31:22 PM PDT by xm177e2
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To: xm177e2
 I don't know how hard agar is to make, but it's just made of seaweed (I think), it would not be hard to produce. I bought about 25 petri dishes full of agar a couple of years ago from a school supply store for my kid's school experiment. No problem.

 Nice comments. Thanks.

37 posted on 09/22/2001 7:47:33 PM PDT by Nita Nupress
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To: xm177e2
Great post!

What really worries me, is if we do get attacked by biological weapons, it could be very hard to identify the attacker. They would be long gone before symptons even occur. How would we retaliate if we don't even know for sure who attacked us? Of course we would have some general ideas on who it was, but there are quite a few terrorist groups and it could be any one of them.

I guess we would just have to attack them all. HARD!

38 posted on 09/22/2001 7:53:19 PM PDT by rocker68
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To: xm177e2
It is being done now, it was done in the subways of Tokyo several years ago by Aum Shinryuko(sp?) and Saddam/Usama almost certainly have programs running.

I'm almost sure programs are running. But since nobody has ever hit the US with an anthrax or smallpox attack, I'm still believing it isn't as easy as some people are making it sound out to be. The press (and some people here) make it sound like anyone can make it in their basement and kill a hundred thousand people with it. And the Tokoyo guys spent millions researching and making sarin, but only managed to kill 12 people with it. It seems like successfully deploying chemical or biological weapons to kill a lot of people still requires a significant amount of technical expertise.

The most difficult part, and that nobody apparently has a solution for yet, is getting the agent into an aerosol solution so it can be easily sprayed. Just creating large amounts of the agent is simple, and a load of botulinum toxin, for instance, could be used to poison pretty much anything, from rivers to individuals.

So it seems like the flaw in your plan below is equipping the crop dusters with sprayers that can handle anthrax (although I've heard other problems are converting the anthrax into a powder form, and judging wind conditions so it goes over a lot of people). As for the botulinum toxin problem, if it is that easy to poison rivers with it effectively, why hasn't any nut (not even Arab, but a pissed off biology student mad at life) done it yet?

45 posted on 09/22/2001 8:59:11 PM PDT by Nate505
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