Posted on 09/27/2001 5:41:55 PM PDT by Pakrman
Alright. What's your solution? You complain but offer no solution.
One of the reasons why I love this country as much as I do; warts and all. No doubt we got'em, but I see more decency and things to admire here than elsewhere. Definitely worth sacrificing for, and I would. Would'nt trade it for anything. Where else can you, OWK, Kevin Curry, & I get into a "1st amendment furball" and then still look for agreement and revel in it when we find it? No sir, here we have something special. I aim to keep it that way...
Thanks for your sincere comments. It's difficult for me to take issue with anything you wrote.
I wish more people on this forum were more interested in justice than in blind revenge, which will merely create more terrorists. Our interventionist foreign policy during the past 50 years has turned many countries and many peoples against us.
If we want to combat terrorism, we should stop bullying other countries and poking our nose into everyone else's business. That means getting our military out of Korea, Bosnia, Kosovo and 50 or so foreign bases. It also means putting an end to all foreign aid and military assistance, especially to countries involved in religious and ethnic civil wars. (We are hated by Arabs in the Middle East because our government supports and provides billions of dollars in military aid to Israel. We have taken sides in a religious war that has been going on for hundreds of years. It's time to declare our neutrality.)
We need to turn away from the hubris, arrogance and empire building that have perverted this great Republic, fueled hatred for America, and placed our citizens in harm's way. We should heed the warnings of George Washington and Thomas Jefferson: Be wary of entangling alliances.
If we insist on remaking the world in our own image, terrorism will be tugging at our elbow for years to come. We cannot win the war against terrorism by creating more terrorists. We should root out and kill the perpetrators of the recent terrorist attack on American soil. But, ultimately, more bombs and missiles aimed at innocent Muslim civilians will merely encourage, not deter, further acts of terrorism.
In a society, each member has a just claim on property of their compatriots - it is a codified and well recognized feature of a society. Governments formalize and enforce these claims all the time. We are interdependent. A baby has a just claim on its parents, and on other members of society should its biological parents falter. An injured or distressed person has a just claim on the good efforts of his able bodied neighbors. A passerby claims your polite dealings. You make a claim on society for protection, justice, and right to seek happiness. That's what makes a society: claim and counterclaim, justly honored by its decent members.
No, they do not, unless you believe man is a sacrifical animal.
- it is a codified and well recognized feature of a society.
Perhaps in a society of cannibals.
Governments formalize and enforce these claims all the time.
In violation of individual rights.
A baby has a just claim on its parents, and on other members of society should its biological parents falter.
No, a baby has a just claim on his parents. If you will not take care of your child, I am not obligated to, current socialist laws notwithstanding.
Do not confuse what is law with what is moral.
An injured or distressed person has a just claim on the good efforts of his able bodied neighbors.
No, he does not.
You make a claim on society for protection, justice, and right to seek happiness.
No, my just claim to life, liberty, property and the pursuit of happiness are my rights and they are pre-cedent to the govt. Govt exists to protect these rights. My only obligation is not to violate these same rights of others.
That's what makes a society: claim and counterclaim, justly honored by its decent members.
Individuals make society, and individual rights are not additive. Two people do not have more rights than one.
That is the philosophy of cannibals.
Well...actually....we can say to heck with them. We (and, in fact, just about every society I'm aware of) does precisely this. Oh, the rich may be called the nomenklatura in the USSR, or the nobility in some other society, but fundamentally the poor are out of sight and out of mind.
As to your second point, no - neither we nor anyone else says find another country. (Though Mexico comes close to doing this as they export poor people!). What we can do (and have done) is to supply psycological opiates. Television comes to mind. The lottery, with its many promises of rapid, unearned riches, is another.
And the thing is, that there are people who exit the lower strata and become successful to some degree. As long as they perceive some chance of doing so, they'll submit to the system.
On your last point - the need to deal with the issue - I'm not so sure. People want equality when they're below the mean, and they detest it when they're above it. And as long as the "dream" of moving from poor to rich survives, people will perceive themselves as being able to advance. Hence, they won't oppose the existing order of things very strongly. All IMHO, of course....
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