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Happy White Male Oppressor Day!
PoliticalUSA.com ^ | 10/08/01 | Donny Ferguson

Posted on 10/08/2001 2:07:40 PM PDT by brentb

In case you slept through fourth grade history, or own a really outdated calendar, today is Columbus Day, the 509th anniversary of Christopher Columbus’ discovery of North America. (I don’t care what some wispy, goateed professor told you between bites of hummus while leafing through this month’s Mother Jones. Christopher Columbus discovered America.) Now, as with anything honoring America, there are some who have a problem celebrating Oct. 12 as a holiday. They are the usual suspects, the same sniveling malcontents who always manage to find a problem with anything relating to capitalism, Christianity or America. They howl that Columbus violated a land of tranquility. They screech that Western civilization corrupted a Native American utopia. They squeal that the Native Americans lived in serenity and accord, until their overthrow at the hands of greedy capitalist crusaders hell-bent on eradicating all vestiges of the native populous in their quest for gold, silver and souls. And as usual, they are wrong. These "Columbu-phobes" wail and scream about how Columbus and his European followers supposedly ransacked and pillaged entire civilizations, wiping away cultures preaching harmony with nature and one other. History’s revisionists would have one believe Columbus invaded and overthrew a race of peaceful, harmonious people of the earth, a people far superior to the white Christian treasure-seekers who obliterated their society. Eyewitness accounts and the archaeological evidence, however, tell a far different story. The supposedly peaceful Guadelope inhabitants Columbus first encountered, the Arawaks, in fact raided weaker Siboney villages, brutally massacring the men and savagely raping the women. Boys were castrated, fattened, boiled in pots and eaten. The Arawaks kept girls captive as "breeders," providing carnal pleasure and a constant supply of babies, regarded as a delicacy. The plight of women, viewed as second-class and chattel, wasn’t much better. But what evil culture of doom did these pale-skinned conquerors leave behind? What legacy of decadence and nature-rape were the Native Americans shackled with? Only a Christian way of life that lifted them out of poverty, increased their life span and taught peace and equality. Constant starvation, cannibalism and child sacrifice were replaced by healthy diets, industriousness and democracy. People who once lived in disease-ridden huts and practiced shamanism were later introduced to immunization and life-saving surgery. Common sense, not arrogance, illustrates the fact Western civilization and the Judeo-Christian ethic is far superior to any other culture or faith to come along the pike. It is the Judeo-Christian ethic, not the animal worship of the South and North American natives, which gave us the model for a representative government by the people. It is Western civilization that gave us our written language, as opposed to the illiterate Caribs who had no written language to speak of. The anti-American apologists for the Native Americans of the 15th century would have a hard time proving the American Indian is better off today than he was 509 years ago. Thanks to Christopher Columbus and a half-millennia of European influence, the modern person of Native American has a longer lifespan, a means of communicating and teaching his heritage and the right to live his life and worship as he pleases. He even has the right to whine about the intrepid Italian who made it possible. Good luck trying that under King Montezuma. But leftists, as a lot, have never been one to let simple nuisances of fact deter them from whining and complaining. Despite the factually crushing tide of evidence against them, Columbus’ detractors persist in their own crusade to eliminate any celebration of, or even reference to, the famed explorer. The war against Columbus is merely a battle in a larger fight against Western civilization, Judeo-Christian ethic and 200 years of American progress. He was white, European, Christian and responsible for the birth of the nation that discredited socialism, therefore he must be discredited. Sadly for the anti-Columbus Left, while the events of Oct. 12, 1492, forever altered history and marked the end of a hunting-gathering society of cannibals, it did so for the better. Christopher Columbus’ sacrifice and bravery opened the door to a new land where a superior modern constitutional republic, based upon individual liberty and inalienable rights granted by God, took root. So to those young "Columbu-phobes" picketing their schools’ Indian mascot (schools and educational pursuit having never existed in pre-Columbus America), to those publishing books and articles on the evils of the white man and the virtues of the ancient Native American (the printing press and freedom of speech being the product of white European males) and to those griping about Columbus at the age of 70 over a healthy dinner of something other than human flesh (there being scant food, widespread disease and rampant cannibalism in pre-Columbus America) I say to you, Happy White Male Oppressor Day!


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1 posted on 10/08/2001 2:07:40 PM PDT by brentb
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To: brentb
In case you slept through fourth grade history, or own a really outdated calendar, today is Columbus Day, the 509th anniversary of Christopher Columbus’ discovery of North America. (I don’t care what some wispy, goateed professor told you between bites of hummus while leafing through this month’s Mother Jones. Christopher Columbus discovered America.)

Now, as with anything honoring America, there are some who have a problem celebrating Oct. 12 as a holiday. They are the usual suspects, the same sniveling malcontents who always manage to find a problem with anything relating to capitalism, Christianity or America. They howl that Columbus violated a land of tranquility. They screech that Western civilization corrupted a Native American utopia. They squeal that the Native Americans lived in serenity and accord, until their overthrow at the hands of greedy capitalist crusaders hell-bent on eradicating all vestiges of the native populous in their quest for gold, silver and souls.

And as usual, they are wrong.

These "Columbu-phobes" wail and scream about how Columbus and his European followers supposedly ransacked and pillaged entire civilizations, wiping away cultures preaching harmony with nature and one other. History’s revisionists would have one believe Columbus invaded and overthrew a race of peaceful, harmonious people of the earth, a people far superior to the white Christian treasure-seekers who obliterated their society. Eyewitness accounts and the archaeological evidence, however, tell a far different story.

The supposedly peaceful Guadelope inhabitants Columbus first encountered, the Arawaks, in fact raided weaker Siboney villages, brutally massacring the men and savagely raping the women. Boys were castrated, fattened, boiled in pots and eaten. The Arawaks kept girls captive as "breeders," providing carnal pleasure and a constant supply of babies, regarded as a delicacy. The plight of women, viewed as second-class and chattel, wasn’t much better.

But what evil culture of doom did these pale-skinned conquerors leave behind? What legacy of decadence and nature-rape were the Native Americans shackled with? Only a Christian way of life that lifted them out of poverty, increased their life span and taught peace and equality. Constant starvation, cannibalism and child sacrifice were replaced by healthy diets, industriousness and democracy. People who once lived in disease-ridden huts and practiced shamanism were later introduced to immunization and life-saving surgery.

Common sense, not arrogance, illustrates the fact Western civilization and the Judeo-Christian ethic is far superior to any other culture or faith to come along the pike. It is the Judeo-Christian ethic, not the animal worship of the South and North American natives, which gave us the model for a representative government by the people. It is Western civilization that gave us our written language, as opposed to the illiterate Caribs who had no written language to speak of. The anti-American apologists for the Native Americans of the 15th century would have a hard time proving the American Indian is better off today than he was 509 years ago. Thanks to Christopher Columbus and a half-millennia of European influence, the modern person of Native American has a longer lifespan, a means of communicating and teaching his heritage and the right to live his life and worship as he pleases. He even has the right to whine about the intrepid Italian who made it possible. Good luck trying that under King Montezuma.

But leftists, as a lot, have never been one to let simple nuisances of fact deter them from whining and complaining. Despite the factually crushing tide of evidence against them, Columbus’ detractors persist in their own crusade to eliminate any celebration of, or even reference to, the famed explorer. The war against Columbus is merely a battle in a larger fight against Western civilization, Judeo-Christian ethic and 200 years of American progress. He was white, European, Christian and responsible for the birth of the nation that discredited socialism, therefore he must be discredited.

Sadly for the anti-Columbus Left, while the events of Oct. 12, 1492, forever altered history and marked the end of a hunting-gathering society of cannibals, it did so for the better. Christopher Columbus’ sacrifice and bravery opened the door to a new land where a superior modern constitutional republic, based upon individual liberty and inalienable rights granted by God, took root.

So to those young "Columbu-phobes" picketing their schools’ Indian mascot (schools and educational pursuit having never existed in pre-Columbus America), to those publishing books and articles on the evils of the white man and the virtues of the ancient Native American (the printing press and freedom of speech being the product of white European males) and to those griping about Columbus at the age of 70 over a healthy dinner of something other than human flesh (there being scant food, widespread disease and rampant cannibalism in pre-Columbus America) I say to you, Happy White Male Oppressor Day!

2 posted on 10/08/2001 2:14:27 PM PDT by SunStar
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To: brentb
They are anti-Italian bigots and racists. I love to see their expressions when it's framed this way.
3 posted on 10/08/2001 2:14:53 PM PDT by Benrand
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To: brentb
Happy White Male Oppressor Day!

By Donny Ferguson dfurguson@politicalusa.com

10/8/2001

In case you slept through fourth grade history, or own a really outdated calendar, today is Columbus Day, the 509th anniversary of Christopher Columbus’ discovery of North America. (I don’t care what some wispy, goateed professor told you between bites of hummus while leafing through this month’s Mother Jones. Christopher Columbus discovered America.)

Now, as with anything honoring America, there are some who have a problem celebrating Oct. 12 as a holiday. They are the usual suspects, the same sniveling malcontents who always manage to find a problem with anything relating to capitalism, Christianity or America. They howl that Columbus violated a land of tranquility. They screech that Western civilization corrupted a Native American utopia. They squeal that the Native Americans lived in serenity and accord, until their overthrow at the hands of greedy capitalist crusaders hell-bent on eradicating all vestiges of the native populous in their quest for gold, silver and souls.

And as usual, they are wrong.

These "Columbu-phobes" wail and scream about how Columbus and his European followers supposedly ransacked and pillaged entire civilizations, wiping away cultures preaching harmony with nature and one other. History’s revisionists would have one believe Columbus invaded and overthrew a race of peaceful, harmonious people of the earth, a people far superior to the white Christian treasure-seekers who obliterated their society. Eyewitness accounts and the archaeological evidence, however, tell a far different story.

The supposedly peaceful Guadelope inhabitants Columbus first encountered, the Arawaks, in fact raided weaker Siboney villages, brutally massacring the men and savagely raping the women. Boys were castrated, fattened, boiled in pots and eaten. The Arawaks kept girls captive as "breeders," providing carnal pleasure and a constant supply of babies, regarded as a delicacy. The plight of women, viewed as second-class and chattel, wasn’t much better.

But what evil culture of doom did these pale-skinned conquerors leave behind? What legacy of decadence and nature-rape were the Native Americans shackled with? Only a Christian way of life that lifted them out of poverty, increased their life span and taught peace and equality. Constant starvation, cannibalism and child sacrifice were replaced by healthy diets, industriousness and democracy. People who once lived in disease-ridden huts and practiced shamanism were later introduced to immunization and life-saving surgery.

Common sense, not arrogance, illustrates the fact Western civilization and the Judeo-Christian ethic is far superior to any other culture or faith to come along the pike. It is the Judeo-Christian ethic, not the animal worship of the South and North American natives, which gave us the model for a representative government by the people. It is Western civilization that gave us our written language, as opposed to the illiterate Caribs who had no written language to speak of. The anti-American apologists for the Native Americans of the 15th century would have a hard time proving the American Indian is better off today than he was 509 years ago. Thanks to Christopher Columbus and a half-millennia of European influence, the modern person of Native American has a longer lifespan, a means of communicating and teaching his heritage and the right to live his life and worship as he pleases. He even has the right to whine about the intrepid Italian who made it possible. Good luck trying that under King Montezuma.

But leftists, as a lot, have never been one to let simple nuisances of fact deter them from whining and complaining. Despite the factually crushing tide of evidence against them, Columbus’ detractors persist in their own crusade to eliminate any celebration of, or even reference to, the famed explorer. The war against Columbus is merely a battle in a larger fight against Western civilization, Judeo-Christian ethic and 200 years of American progress. He was white, European, Christian and responsible for the birth of the nation that discredited socialism, therefore he must be discredited.

Sadly for the anti-Columbus Left, while the events of Oct. 12, 1492, forever altered history and marked the end of a hunting-gathering society of cannibals, it did so for the better. Christopher Columbus’ sacrifice and bravery opened the door to a new land where a superior modern constitutional republic, based upon individual liberty and inalienable rights granted by God, took root.

So to those young "Columbu-phobes" picketing their schools’ Indian mascot (schools and educational pursuit having never existed in pre-Columbus America), to those publishing books and articles on the evils of the white man and the virtues of the ancient Native American (the printing press and freedom of speech being the product of white European males) and to those griping about Columbus at the age of 70 over a healthy dinner of something other than human flesh (there being scant food, widespread disease and rampant cannibalism in pre-Columbus America) I say to you, Happy White Male Oppressor Day!

4 posted on 10/08/2001 2:15:27 PM PDT by Stentor
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To: brentb
i've got an answer for the"columbuphobes",it ain't gonna work,nobody is listening and boy am i glad to be a white male oppressor!!
5 posted on 10/08/2001 2:16:56 PM PDT by INSENSITIVE GUY
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To: brentb
at the hands of greedy capitalist crusaders hell-bent on eradicating all vestiges of the native populous in their quest for gold, silver and souls

Columbus was not a nice guy, he WAS a greedy, petty, cruel jerk whose actions led to the genocide of the people on that island.

This is not to say the Indians were any better or worse, I really don't know if everything said about them in this article is true, it's very difficult to know how they used to live when all of the evidence has been destroyed.

The West was not always as civilized as it is today, Columbus was a man of his time.

I celebrate the discovery of America, and the promise it's held for the world, but I don't celebrate Christopher Columbus.

6 posted on 10/08/2001 2:17:37 PM PDT by xm177e2
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To: brentb
Hey… What have you got against Italians and the Spanish anyway?


7 posted on 10/08/2001 2:19:48 PM PDT by bluetoad
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To: Benrand
"They are anti-Italian bigots and racists. I love to see their expressions when it's framed this way. "

They are anti-hispanic bigots and racists. After all, it was Spain that organized the discovery of America.

8 posted on 10/08/2001 2:19:57 PM PDT by Marduk
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To: brentb
Must not like women either, because the Queen of Spain sent them...


9 posted on 10/08/2001 2:22:06 PM PDT by bluetoad
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To: xm177e2
"This is not to say the Indians were any better or worse, I really don't know if everything said about them in this article is true, it's very difficult to know how they used to live when all of the evidence has been destroyed."

The Aztecs sacrificed (read murdered) 40,000 Indians of subjugated tribes every year.

How could Cortes, with less than 500 men have conquered the Aztec Empire, whose capital, Tenochtitlan, had a population of 1 million? He was able to pull it off because the Indians that were subjugated by the Aztecs joined the forces of Cortes.

10 posted on 10/08/2001 2:23:37 PM PDT by Marduk
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To: SunStar
" The war against Columbus is merely a battle in a larger fight against Western civilization, Judeo-Christian ethic and 200 years of American progress."

I think the Queen of Spain would find the idea that Columbus represented a "Judeo-Christian" ethic a little odd. After all, in 1492, in addition to sending Columbus' voyage, she kicked the Jews out of Spain.

11 posted on 10/08/2001 2:26:07 PM PDT by Marduk
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To: brentb
Common sense, not arrogance, illustrates the fact Western civilization and the Judeo-Christian ethic is far superior to any other culture or faith to come along the pike

So more superior cultures have the right to genocide the less superior? funny. I'm sure when one comes along to replace "western civilization/capitalism/christianity/democracy" (the author seems to treat them as intercheagle terms) the author won't be complaining.

But this makes an interesting argument. I wonder if the author is familiar with the increases in standard of living, life expectancy, and literacy in the stalinist soviet union, which effectively industrialized in half a century -- and if he applies the same standards to excuse stalinist terror. Or with similar increases following the cuban revolution. Seems that applying his logic would justify them.

12 posted on 10/08/2001 2:26:21 PM PDT by gfactor
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: gfactor
"Or with similar increases following the cuban revolution."

I am familiar with the increases in Stalin's regime but do you have any links showing the increase after the Cuban revolution? in 1959 Cuba was the wealthiest country in the Caribbean. In 2001 it is the second poorest, after Haiti. In fact, I think now it is the second poorest in the entire Western Hemisphere.

14 posted on 10/08/2001 2:31:34 PM PDT by Marduk
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To: Marduk
After all, in 1492, in addition to sending Columbus' voyage, she kicked the Jews out of Spain.

And the Moors. Big year for Spain.

15 posted on 10/08/2001 2:35:12 PM PDT by RightWhale
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To: brentb
Don't you know by now that anyone involved in our history was a "bad guy"? Only today's liberals wear white hats.
16 posted on 10/08/2001 2:35:39 PM PDT by ReaganWasRight
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To: SunStar
The supposedly peaceful Guadelope inhabitants Columbus first encountered, the Arawaks, in fact raided weaker Siboney villages, brutally massacring the men and savagely raping the women. Boys were castrated, fattened, boiled in pots and eaten. The Arawaks kept girls captive as "breeders," providing carnal pleasure and a constant supply of babies, regarded as a delicacy. The plight of women, viewed as second-class and chattel, wasn’t much better.

Yes, but they did some bad things too.

17 posted on 10/08/2001 2:36:08 PM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: one_particular_harbour
"That being said, it is wrong for people of European heritage to pat themselves on the back for what happened to the indigenous populations of the Americas. "

History has a point of view. The conquest of America was good for Europeans. It was bad for the Indians. The Revolutionary war was good for Americans, it was bad for the English. The Civil War was good for northerners and blacks. It was bad for white southerners.

The problem is that people are always trying to impose their point of view of history on others without recognizing that what is "good" and "bad" in history depends on the point of view. It's stupid to expect Indians to think the conquest of America was good. It's stupid to expect Europeans and their descendants to think that it was bad.

18 posted on 10/08/2001 2:37:16 PM PDT by Marduk
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To: Benrand
I'm celebrating!

I took the day off, I'm Italian, and it's my B'DAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

19 posted on 10/08/2001 2:38:08 PM PDT by RIGHT IN SEATTLE
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To: one_particular_harbour
I like your take. What's not to like about it?
20 posted on 10/08/2001 2:38:23 PM PDT by JenB
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To: one_particular_harbour

LUZIA has been here (Brazil) for 11,500 years. Can't we blame her for everything. This is the oldest 'dated' skeleton ever found in the Americas.

21 posted on 10/08/2001 2:39:00 PM PDT by blam
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To: brentb
test (dont ask)
22 posted on 10/08/2001 2:39:29 PM PDT by Texaggie79
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To: Billthedrill
What a bunch of maroons! Geez! It was Leif Erickson that discovered America!
23 posted on 10/08/2001 2:40:10 PM PDT by JDoutrider
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To: Marduk
We know the Aztecs were evil butchers, I'm not disputing that!

I'm referring very specifically to the island people wiped out by Columbus. All we know about them comes from Columbus' and his crews' writings, which may not be accurate.

Remember, Columbus did not discover what is now the USA, I think he didn't even discover Mexico (at least on the first voyage, I don't know about the rest), he just landed on Hispaniola and maybe a few other islands.

24 posted on 10/08/2001 2:40:34 PM PDT by xm177e2
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To: Marduk
And with the first known case of bio-terrorism , smallpox. Though not intentional, yet welcomed, smallpox conquered the Aztecs and Cortes and his band mopped up.
25 posted on 10/08/2001 2:41:47 PM PDT by L`enn
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To: Marduk
They are anti-hispanic bigots and racists. After all, it was Spain that organized the discovery of America.

Happy Hispanic-Organized White Oppressor Day! ;^]

26 posted on 10/08/2001 2:45:08 PM PDT by bubbafree
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To: brentb
I am of the Viking persuasian. But I love Italian women!
27 posted on 10/08/2001 2:45:43 PM PDT by larryjohnson
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To: blam

....and, this is "Spirit Cave Man," found in Fallon, Nevada. He has been here for 9,400 years.

28 posted on 10/08/2001 2:47:27 PM PDT by blam
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To: L`enn
"And with the first known case of bio-terrorism , smallpox. Though not intentional, yet welcomed, smallpox conquered the Aztecs and Cortes and his band mopped up. "

It's unjustified to call it "bioterrorism" if it wasn't intentional. The first documented cases of biological weapons actually predate 1492. I don't remember when they were first used but it was well before 1492. It involved putting blankets used by sick people and throwing them at the enemy with catapults. Other methods involved throwing decaying corpses with catapults.

I don't think the smallpox helped Cortes. His conquest was so quick it couldn't have had an effect. Do you have any evidence it had an effect? I haven't read anywhere that it helped Cortes.

29 posted on 10/08/2001 2:48:34 PM PDT by Marduk
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To: xm177e2
"We know the Aztecs were evil butchers, I'm not disputing that!"

I thougth we were discussing the overall European conquest, not just Columbus.

I believe Columbus discovered the South American and Central American mainlands by his fourth voyage. He certainly didn't just discover islands.

Most of the island Indians were pretty peaceful. But the Caribs were cannibalistic savages. The Caribs lived on islands in the Caribbean. When the Spanish arrived in the Caribbean, the Caribs were in the process of exterminating the Arawak Indians.

30 posted on 10/08/2001 2:51:59 PM PDT by Marduk
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Comment #31 Removed by Moderator

To: brentb
Happy White Male Oppressor Day!

Thanks for the reminder! I forgot.

Being a White Male Oppressor myself, I might as well clue you in.

Either you roll with us(the white Male Oppressors), or we roll right over you....

Everyone likes to push us around, but trust me we push back.

32 posted on 10/08/2001 2:52:14 PM PDT by Fedupwithit
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To: bubbafree
"Happy Hispanic-Organized White Oppressor Day! ;^] "

I don't understand how so-called "hispanics" can protest Columbus. It was hispanics that discovered and conquered America for Europe. Those so-called "hispanics" are not hispanic at all in my opinion.

33 posted on 10/08/2001 2:59:48 PM PDT by Marduk
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To: All
Columbus was 100% Portuguese!

34 posted on 10/08/2001 3:05:45 PM PDT by Benoit Baldwin
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To: RIGHT IN SEATTLE
Happy Boitday!
35 posted on 10/08/2001 3:13:37 PM PDT by Benrand
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To: JDoutrider
Bump , For the son of Eric the Red .
36 posted on 10/08/2001 3:14:29 PM PDT by Ben Bolt
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To: blam
WHO were the FIRST Americans?

The accumulating skeletal and genetic evidence suggests that the earliest populations to move into the Americas were not Asians whose primary genetic background was that of residents of northeastern Asia and eastern Mongolia (the old view). At the end of 1999 scientists meet in California and New Mexico to mull over the implications of recently discovered or restudied ancient American skeletons, most of which date between 8,600 and 11,000 years ago. And what they discovered has shaken the foundations of the anthropological communities. Instead of resembling the historically known American Indians, the wide range of skull shapes which have come to light so far display affinities with populations as diverse as the Ainu of Japan, peoples of central Asia, Australasia, India, southwest Asia, even the Neandertals of Europe (see Ancestors of the New World Had Multiple Origins for more information about the possible Neandertal connection). Genetic evidence also supports the idea of multiple migrations of people coming from distinctly different genetic poplations: perhaps as many as four or five different genetic populations.

(The 'Native Americans' or 'American Indians' as we know them today, arrived in the Americas no later than 6,000 years ago. The Monte Verde site is likely to be dated in the 30,000 year range )

37 posted on 10/08/2001 3:21:38 PM PDT by blam
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To: Benoit Baldwin
I wouldn't give that site much credibility. It makes a big deal of his name being written as "Colon" and says that's proof he was Portuguese. But "Colon" is a Spanish name and that is how Columbus is known in Spanish.

The site is in error when it says that in Spanish his name is written "Cristoval Colon". It's actually written "Cristobal Colon".

It seems everyone wants to claim Columbus. I've heard arguments that he was Norweigian and Jewish.

38 posted on 10/08/2001 3:21:40 PM PDT by Marduk
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To: xm177e2
You write as though you knew Columbus personally. If what you say is true, please cite your sources.
39 posted on 10/08/2001 3:33:58 PM PDT by GROUCHOTWO
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To: Marduk
Try to have a nice day, anyway.
40 posted on 10/08/2001 3:37:48 PM PDT by bubbafree
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To: GROUCHOTWO
please cite your sources.

Does his diary count as a source?

41 posted on 10/08/2001 3:39:33 PM PDT by xm177e2
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To: xm177e2
***Columbus was a man of his time***

This small statement puts a lot of things into perspective.
The times, they may be a changin' but human nature remains the same.

42 posted on 10/08/2001 4:04:24 PM PDT by martian_22
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To: GROUCHOTWO;A+Bert
"You write as though you knew Columbus personally."

Check with A+Bert, he probably did.

43 posted on 10/08/2001 4:11:09 PM PDT by blam
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To: xm177e2
So , What are your thoughts on the needless incineration of Dresden ? Do you have the passion for that part of history that you have for this topic ? Have you considered what the positive effect the simple act of bringing corn did ? I know it is not such a glamerous topic . The landing of Mr. Columbus changed the world . And it was for the good , In spite of the short comings and faults .
44 posted on 10/08/2001 4:13:04 PM PDT by Ben Bolt
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To: dorben
Dorben: "The landing of Mr. Columbus changed the world . And it was for the good , In spite of the short comings and faults ."

xm177e2: "I celebrate the discovery of America, and the promise it's held for the world, but I don't celebrate Christopher Columbus."

And we're arguing, why?

45 posted on 10/08/2001 4:17:50 PM PDT by xm177e2
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To: xm177e2
I did not consider it an argument , but you do come across this time as someone who is resentful . However , I am aware this is only text and I may be a tad assuming sometimes . I celebrate Him , the journey , and the success of the mission . These points I do not negotiate . period .
46 posted on 10/08/2001 4:44:01 PM PDT by Ben Bolt
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To: JDoutrider
Actually, Bjarni Herjolfsson was the first European to discover America, in 986. He was trying to reach Greenland but missed it because of bad weather, finally saw some forested land which must have been Labrador. He never came ashore before finally reaching Greenland, but Leif knew there was land to the west when he retraced Bjarni's route.

There was a movie made some years back called How Tasty was My Little Frenchman about a Frenchman who is shipwrecked on the coast of Brazil in the 16th century, treated nicely for a year by the Indians who find him, and then cooked and eaten.

47 posted on 10/08/2001 4:46:45 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: RIGHT IN SEATTLE
I'm also of Italian descent and my late father used to start ranting around October 5th, how we'd be innundated by tales of Columbian brutality, regaled by 'new' discoveries that the Vikings discovered America and even that "Viking ships would sail into our harbors!"

And he was right every year.

48 posted on 10/08/2001 4:55:02 PM PDT by LisaFab
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To: Verginius Rufus
Technically , you are correct . I do understand that he did not document anything about his sighting , and was therefore not acknowledged . I also read in several places , that Leif had some help from the populace on greenland . either way , it is all very interesting ! I am open to learn , if you care to weigh in on this . thank you , for your contribution Rufus .
49 posted on 10/08/2001 5:42:58 PM PDT by Ben Bolt
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To: brentb
Hooray for dead white European male oppressors like Columbus!
50 posted on 10/08/2001 5:44:45 PM PDT by FReethesheeples
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