OUR LADY AND ISLAM: HEAVEN’S PEACE PLAN

http://www.ewtn.com/library/MARY/OLISLAM.HTM ^ | September - October 2001 | Fr Ladis J. Cizik, Blue Army National Executive Director

[Scythian]

This will be the false religion that that Satan uses, this worship of Mary will be the tie that "binds"

[CCWoody]

Why don't you try reading the whole chapter, instead of constructing a false theology on one verse ripped out of context?

I have and I will again. However, you have not addressed the other scriptures which support my correct Biblical position. So, I am not denying prayer of intercession on behalf of the Elect, but my question and my position still stands. God, chooses His own, not man. What can any person do to effect, that is cause the salvation of another?

That having been said, it is true that Jesus is our only mediator with the Father. The task of Christians is to mediate or intercede for others with Jesus. That is precisely what Christians do for one another when they pray for each other, and it is precisely what the saints in heaven, including Mary, do for the saints on earth.

Should they seek the dead on behalf of the Living. I'd rather have Jesus, my Lord, pray for me:

I pray for them; I pray not for the world, but for them whom Thou hast given Me, for they are Thine. And all Mine are Thine, and Thine are Mine, and I am glorified in them.

[biblewonk]

In the Koran, the holy name of the Blessed Virgin Mary is mentioned no less than thirty times. No other woman's name is even mentioned, not even that of Mohammed's daughter, Fatima. Among men, only Abraham, Moses, and Noah are mentioned more times than Our Lady. In the Koran, Our Blessed Mother is described as "Virgin, ever Virgin." The Islamic belief in the virginity of Mary puts to shame the heretical beliefs of those who call themselves Christian, while denying the perpetual virginity of Mary. Make no mistake about it, there is a very special relationship between the Blessed Virgin Mary and the Moslems!

Considering that a Marian Catholic believes in a whole basket of doctrines that are not even hinted at in the Bible, it doesn't surprise me that they would be pleased to hear what the Koran says about Mary. The bible has so little place in the formation of Marian doctrine there is no surprise that a Marian would mention the Koran and the Bible in the same context as if they are equal. If anyone says anything nice about the "Queen of Heaven" he is elevated in the hearts of a Marian no matter what other doctrines he holds.

[CCWoody]

Mary is revered as Jesus's mother, she is honored, but she is not worshiped.

You could have fooled me...

And it came to pass, as He spoke these things, a certain woman of the company lifted up her voice and said unto Him, "Blessed is the womb that bore Thee and the breasts which Thou hast sucked." But He said, "Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the Word of God and keep it."

[CT]

Yes, exactly my point!

[RnMomof7]

The Islamic belief in the virginity of Mary puts to shame the heretical beliefs of those who call themselves Christian, while denying the perpetual virginity of Mary. Make no mistake about it, there is a very special relationship between the Blessed Virgin Mary and the Moslems!"

Pathetic huh? How can they not see that the fact that a false religion shares a major tenet of faith with them is nothing to celebrate?

[RaceBannon]

bump

[The Bard]

Good grief! So Catholics are all excited about the imaginary ramblings of Mohammed's daughter - Fatima? Geesh. Seem like Catholics have more in common with Muslims that Christians. Especially when you compare how intolerant Catholics were to Christians during the Crusades and the Inquisition.

Possibly correct. The Catechism of the Catholic Church states the following:

841 The Churches relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; those profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day,"

One of the definitions in Webster's dictionary for Profess is: "to declare in words or appearances only : PRETEND, CLAIM"

I am neither Catholic nor Protestant, but I have done much Bible study, and I am a Christian. We need to pray for the Muslims, yes. We need to witness to them, but I cannot understand how they rate "in the first place".

[RnMomof7]

#3, indeed the Bible does say alot about the queen of heaven and none of it is good.

Jer.7;18
[18] The children gather wood, and the fathers kindle the fire, and the women knead their dough, to make cakes to the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto other gods, that they may provoke me to anger. Jer.44:17-25

[17] But we will certainly do whatsoever thing goeth forth out of our own mouth, to burn incense unto the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto her, as we have done, we, and our fathers, our kings, and our princes, in the cities of Judah, and in the streets of Jerusalem: for then had we plenty of victuals, and were well, and saw no evil.
[18] But since we left off to burn incense to the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto her, we have wanted all things, and have been consumed by the sword and by the famine.
[19] And when we burned incense to the queen of heaven, and poured out drink offerings unto her, did we make her cakes to worship her, and pour out drink offerings unto her, without our men?
[25] Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel, saying; Ye and your wives have both spoken with your mouths, and fulfilled with your hand, saying, We will surely perform our vows that we have vowed, to burn incense to the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto her: ye will surely accomplish your vows, and surely perform your vows.
Read on for the full extent of the Judeo-Christian God and His anger at this idoltry. Marianoloy, worshipping Mary, praying to ber ... all for naught. God views it as a distraction and another idol. It pisses Him off. Yet, Catholics will continue to disobey Him. What the Bible says doesn't matter to them. It is that of another Gospel that they follow and certainly NOT Christian.
49 posted on 10/14/01 8:59 PM Pacific by nmh [ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies | Report Abuse ] *************************************************************

Robby you wrote:

What gives you the right to say what is Chistian, ypur whose teachingsr are contrary to the opinion of the great majority of Christians throughout the centuries. Claims that you and you alone rightly read the Scriptures is merely that, a claim. To put it simply: Fellow, that's YOUR opinion! I see it differently.

Robby this is America and you are free to see it however you choose..but my concern is always not how I see things..but how God sees them.He is God,it is His standard we must meet..He does not have to meet ours

Go back and re read the scripture that nmh has posted..That is the word of God Robby. You may substitute anything you want,but that doeant mean it is God's will just because it is yours.

Jer.7;18
[18] The children gather wood, and the fathers kindle the fire, and the women knead their dough, to make cakes to the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto other gods, that they may provoke me to anger.

..

[CT]

Let's see. Doesn't Jesus speak of humility somewhere in the Bible too?

[RnMomof7]

Goodness! Your anti-Catholic bigotry and your hostile tone are perplexing. What makes you so angry? By the way, all of your biblical references to the "queen of heaven" are from the Old Testament; Mary wasn't even born yet.

Malachi 3:6For I [am] the LORD, I change not;

CT ,God is the same yesterday today and tomorrow.He doesnt change. Dont you still believe the Old Testament Ten Commandments are valid? "I am the Lord thy God,I will have no other gods before me" God is a jealous God..He demands what is rightly His,all our honor,all our praise,our very lives.He does not want to share that.

If you choose to have faith in mary..that is between you and God.but you can not say that He has changed to allow what He once said He hated.

[RobbyS]

Sorry, but what "nmh" has posted is not merely Scripture but his opinion also.

[TrueBeliever9]

And everything that Y'shua said in the New Testament is also in the Old Testament! Keep up the good work RnMomof7! TRUTH! (even though in these last days men are not lovers of TRUTH)

[RnMomof7]

Roman Catholic doctrine 841 The Churches relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; those profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day,"

I found this quote posted above of interest,as I had a discussion on another thread with a Catholic that implied that Islam and Hindi were just "other paths" to God..Jesus was just "one way"

I didnt know that was "offical Church doctrine "now.

Geeeee at one time if you were a Luthern you were damned..now it seems even heathan religions are acceptible "paths"

This is indeed the beginning of the one world religion spoken of in Revelation and the 7 hills...amazing!

[CT]

I've never doubted that my faith is between me and God. That fact seems to be lost to some here.

[Moby Grape]

Matthew 22:29-30...."...Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. For in the resurrection thay neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are AS THE ANGELS OF GOD IN HEAVEN.".....There is NO mention in the Bible, from cover to cover, of VIRGINS in heaven as a reward for men....As for your contention that you may accuse me of putting words in God's mouth, I am AMAZED that people will make life and death (eternal )decisions without reading, without KNOWING what Christ said.

[CCWoody]

841 The Churches relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; those profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day,"

Christ's Church has no relationship with those who deny that He is God. Since I can assume from this statement that the Creator is also the Judge, and since the Bible affirms that Jesus Christ is Creator and Judge, I can conclude that this is just more twisting of scriptures.

He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature. For by Him were all things created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones or dominions or principalities or powers: all things were created by Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and by Him all things consist.

For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son, that all men should honor the Son, even as they honor the Father. He that honoreth not the Son honoreth not the Father who hath sent Him.

[Jerry_M]

But, Matthew 22:29,30 does not state that angels and glorified humans are identical, something that I think you referred to previously. Angels will never know what it is to be redeemed, since no plan of salvation was ever provided for those who fell away.

Angels and humans are different, always have been, and always will be. What Jesus was talking about in Matthew 22 is the fact that redeemed, glorified humans will not have a sexual identity (neither male nor female), not that they become the same as angels.

[RnMomof7]

I've never doubted that my faith is between me and God. That fact seems to be lost to some here.

CT,everyones "faith" is between him and his god.That does not make it correct or saving faith.

I have "faith" that when I switch in the wall switch my room will be bathed in light..but that "faith" will not save me..

There has to be an object to our faith..

The Muslims have a faith,as does my Hindi doctor, that has his Elephant god on his book case.The faith he has between him and his god will not save him.

The question we need to ask ourselves is what do we have faith in?

[RobbyS]

I didnt know that was "offical Church doctrine "now.

It's not, as Ratzinger has recently pointed out. Be careful of "liberal" Catholics.