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For the most part this has been a spirited discussion. That is very much in the protestant tradition. For the most part its been Catholic Bashing. And that is very much in the Protestant Tradition.

Tom there has been a discussion of scripture and its meaning..disagreement is different than "bashing"

If you say A and I say prove it and you present a scripture and I present a different one..that isnt "bashing".

We have honest disagreements..discussing them is honorable..as long as it isnt "personal" name calling it is in the best tradition of debate and free speech

I think you guys are wrong..that is no a "bash" it is my opinion..you think I am wrong ,that is your opinion.

If you dont want to discuss it OK...but dont go running home crying that the means "proddy" (as we have been called a few posts back)...is beating you up!

We're called bigots,losers,Catholic bashers,and doomsayers everytime we dare to challenge the teachings of the self proclaimed authority of scripture.

We have to understand that the Catholic church has been around for 2000 years.They have Apostolic succession. They have Sacred Tradition to back up their claims. It doesn't matter that Marian theology is not mentioned in the bible, Catholic tradition and the early fathers are proof enough. Any honest Catholic will tell you that their tradition is on the same level as scripture. We have to understand that the Word of God is not enough, we need the traditions of man to see the whole picture. If you don't believe this they can show you quotes from people that lived 2000 years ago that agree with them. The early fathers had to be right because, well, because they heard all this before it got lost in translation, so to speak. The fact that they have been around for so long proves that the gates of hell did not prevail.

We see another place in history where these same claims have been made. The Pharisees claimed to have Abraham as their Father. The also claim to be the ones trusted to interpret the law. They also had Sacred tradition. Why shouldn't they? If they were here to uphold the law of Moses surely they had the right to interpret it..

" Mark 7:6-9 6 He replied, "Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written: "'These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. 7 They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.' 8 You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the traditions of men." 9 And he said to them: "You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions! (NIV)

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They killed Jesus and threw Paul in jail for going against their teachings.

We only get called names. Count your blessing

I will never understand the " thinking " of some people. No one other than Jesus the Christ is our peace plan. From Genesis on throughout the OT and NT Jesus is our Saviour and no other, and no other can save but Him. He is the one who gave up his life, died and suffered for my sins and no other.

That was the plan !