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To: Aquinasfan
"Now, this church must be readily identifiable. How could Jesus recommend that two people appeal their case to an invisible church? "

The church was identifiable. It is made up of believers. The point I made was that the Church is anywhere that a group of believers gather or exist. Paul wrote to the churches of Galatia, Phillipi, Ephesus, Thessalonanca, etc. Jesus wrote to the seven churches in Revelation. All of these churches had Elders in position as described in Timothy to solve the problems that came up.

These4 churches were all visible yet separate except for the fact that Jesus as the head. They did not have a figurehead in Rome as the head of the church.

"There are other signs of Church hierarchy and visibility in Scripture. In the Acts of the Apostles, Peter determines that Judas' apostolic office should be filled: "

Peter was told to wait until the Power of the Spirit came upon him. Peter stepped out in the flesh and appointed someone to replace Judas. The head of the Church, Jesus, corrected Peters mistake and gave us Paul. Peters first official act, as you see it, was a total failure. I wouldn't use this as a measure of Peters infallibility of interpretation.

"(Note also that Peter is exercising his infallible interpretation of scripture here. No one objects to Peter's unilateral exercise of authority.) "

If this is a proof of Peters "unilateral authority" please explain these verses.

" Acts 15:13-14 13 When they finished, James spoke up: "Brothers, listen to me. 14 Simon has described to us how God at first showed his concern by taking from the Gentiles a people for himself. (NIV)

Acts 15:19 19 "It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. (NIV) "

Why is it James who gives the final judgement if Peter is the head? Peter talked, James made the decision. This is the meaning of the word "Judgement" used in that verse.

" 2919 krino-

1) to separate, to put asunder, to pick out, to select, to choose

2) to approve, to esteem, to prefer

3) to be of an opinion, to deem, to think

4) to determine, to resolve, to decree

5) to judge

a) to pronounce an opinion concerning right and wrong to be judged, that is, summoned to trial that one's case may be examined and judgment passed upon it

b) to pronounce judgment, to subject to censure, used of those who act the part of judges or arbiters in matters of common life, or pass judgment on the deeds and words of others

6) to rule, to govern

to preside over with the power of giving judicial decisions, because it was the prerogative of kings and rulers to pass judgment

"

We see by this verse that it was James who had the authority. I will not argue that he was the head of the church. I will only argue that it wasn't Peter who was in this position as the Catholic Church claims. Scripture does not support it.

317 posted on 10/17/2001 5:31:54 PM PDT by Joshua
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To: Joshua
The Greek translation for Peter is not the "rock" that Jesus is but rather a pebble. Jesus is the "rock" of the Old and New Testaments. "On the solid rock I stand, all other ground is sifting sand; all other ground is sifting sand..."

miss print

318 posted on 10/17/2001 5:55:09 PM PDT by miss print
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