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Islam's God: The Origin of Allah the Moon God
souldevice.org ^ | unknown | anonymous for safety

Posted on 10/23/2001 8:39:39 AM PDT by spycatcher

Pre-Islamic Arabia's religion was one of superstition. Belief in jinns (genies), curse casting, magic stones, totems was the norm - and it was against this background that Allah arose. Although the Quran is claimed to be a heavenly writing with no earthly source, evidence of these very sorts of cultural influence is found in such places as Suras 55, 72, 113 and 114.

Animism, the belief that spirits inhabit rocks, trees and other elements was also very commonplace. Some of these stones were venerated and used as a focal point for the worship of a particular tribal god. No surprise, Muhammad's family had just such a stone for their own tribe - a black stone, in fact, that they kept at the Kabah (where the tribal idols were set up). The pagan rites of bowing toward Mecca, making a pilgrimage to the Kabah, running around it seven times, kissing it, then running to the river to throw stones at the devil all found there way into Islamic practice.

The final piece of the puzzle was in found in the religion of the Sabeans, an astral religion that worshipped the moon god and planned their religious rites around the lunar calendar. One such rite was fasting from crescent moon to crescent moon, a practice which would also be adopted by Muhammad.

If these things were not present before Muhammad received them from Allah (who himself is the moon god of Muhammad's tribe), why did Muhammad not have to explain what those words meant in the Quran? How would people have known who Allah was? ( or: what a jinn was? what the Kabah was? what the word Islam meant? etc.). Even the word "Islam" which many believe to mean "submission" was not an original word. In Arabic it was a secular term that denoted the strength and bravery of a desert warrior (a definition that accurately reflects the war-like tribes that founded Islam with bloodshed).

The Moon God

"Allah" is from the compound Arabic word "al-ilah" or in english "the god". Allah was known before Muhammad's time without a doubt. His name has been found in pre-islamic writings and other archeological finds. At the Kabah in Mecca over 350 gods were worshipped, but it was built especially for the chief deity - the moon god. Allah was the personal title of the moon god. Allah was married to the sun goddess. They produced three daughters, whose worship Muhammad would later make the mistake of condoning. The crescent moon symbol of Arabia came from this god.

Muhammad's family revered this particular god, and it is this idol that Muhammad declared to be the only true god. So, Allah - far from being the revealed God of the Bible as Muhammad would have us believe - is nothing more than an amplified pagan idol. Muhammad did not re-make the pagan god, he simply removed the lower deities from the rites of worship. That is why he never had to explain who Allah was. By definition, an idol converted in the 7th century into a new god cannot be the sama God revealed thousands of years earlier to Biblical prophets!


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Extended News
KEYWORDS: allah; heresy; islam; moongod; muslim; ramadan; ramadon
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1 posted on 10/23/2001 8:39:40 AM PDT by spycatcher
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To: spycatcher
So when Muslims worship the God of Abraham, they're worshipping some kind of "Moon-God"... But when western Christians worship the God of Abraham, they're worshiping the real one?

Is that it?

2 posted on 10/23/2001 8:49:34 AM PDT by OWK
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To: spycatcher
If you read about Muhammad's life, you'd know he spent a LOT of time in what is now modern-day Syria & Israel, and a lot of time being around Christians & Jews (if you actually read the Koran, it reads a lot like someone wrote it attempting to be in the style of Jewish & Christian writings. While I have no doubt that origin of the word Allah may have come from the moon-god, I also am pretty sure that Muhammad was directing his monotheism toward the God of Abraham. By the way, what is the origin of our English word, "god"? I'm not defending Islam, but this is kind of silly.
3 posted on 10/23/2001 8:55:37 AM PDT by egarvue
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To: OWK
I know you meant that as a sillogism, but that's kinda right: you could call it a case of mistaken identity.

Islam thinks and acts as if Allah is the God of Abraham, but the Koran's description of Allah's character, demeanor, etc. is inconsistent with the Biblical account of YAHWEH, the God of Abraham presented there. Were YAHWEH and Allah the same, there would be no difference.
Of course, Islam claims that Judaism got it all wrong.

[No I'm not going to outline those disntinctions from the two books; the proof will be left to the student.]

4 posted on 10/23/2001 9:09:24 AM PDT by alancarp
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To: alancarp
Of course, Islam claims that Judaism got it all wrong.

Islam, Judaism, and Christianity have each been claiming that the others have "got it all wrong" for centuries.

And so it goes.

5 posted on 10/23/2001 9:11:55 AM PDT by OWK
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To: egarvue
"While I have no doubt that origin of the word Allah may have come from the moon-god, I also am pretty sure that Muhammad was directing his monotheism toward the God of Abraham."
Historically, that should have been the case since the Arab race descended from Abraham. Clearly, his ties to YAHWEH and Biblical teachings demand this. However, as the writer of post 1 cites, culture seems to have gotten in the way.

From Merriam-Webster's site: Main Entry: 1 god
Pronunciation: 'gäd also 'god
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English; akin to
Old High German got god
Date: before 12th century

6 posted on 10/23/2001 9:18:09 AM PDT by alancarp
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To: OWK
Yeah, just like Christmas was a pagan holiday that we Christians just turned into the birthday of Christ.

If we also transferred some pagan deity over and said that was now our "Jesus" we wouldn't be honoring Jesus, but some other pagan idol (which would probably be a demonic entity)

The Biblical God Allah
is knowable cannot be known
is personal is far off
is revealed in three persons is not the Father, Son nor Holy Spirit
is love has no regard for man
is active in man's life and history does not interact with man
is a spirit, has personality, loves, thinks, is omnipotent... etc. is not definable, we are only told what Allah is not
is a God of grace grace is not found in Allah, only judgment

7 posted on 10/23/2001 9:18:33 AM PDT by spycatcher
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To: alancarp
Good attempt at dialogue, but that's not what OWK does. He just finds it comforting to try to cast a little dark on any discussion of truth he happens across. Beware flying cliches.

Dan
Biblical Christianity web site

8 posted on 10/23/2001 9:18:46 AM PDT by BibChr
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To: spycatcher
Neat table; thanks! It'd be interesting to see supporting citations in the Koran, but I don't know whether it displays unity of teaching as the Bible does.

Dan

9 posted on 10/23/2001 9:21:10 AM PDT by BibChr
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To: OWK
I believe they are worshiping a sun god, possibly the one worshiped by the Sumerians. Can't remember my Wsetern Civ I class right now, but it's something like that.
10 posted on 10/23/2001 9:22:49 AM PDT by motexva
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To: spycatcher
And had you been born in a squat mud-brick hut in the hills of Afghanistan, you would now be attempting to convince me that the Christians all worship a false God, and that Allah is the way.

You were born here, so you believe what you believe. They were born there, so they believe what they believe. But had your places of birth been reversed, you'd be every bit as vehement a defender of Allah.

And so it goes.

11 posted on 10/23/2001 9:23:38 AM PDT by OWK
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To: spycatcher
Actually, Allat (Al-Ilat) was the Moon Goddess. She is mentioned in the "Satanic Verses" of Sura 53 of the Quran. Allah was the god of heaven and earth, a linguistic transformation originally from the Sumerian god En-lil, also meaning "the god." En-lil was the most powerful of the Sumerian dieties even though he was the son of Anu, the father of the gods.
12 posted on 10/23/2001 9:24:27 AM PDT by Excuse_Me
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: spycatcher
Don't be stupid.

Christians who speak Arabic pray to "Allah". "Allah" means "God" in Arabic. Muslims are monotheists who are praying to the Creator of the Universe, whom they identify with the God of Abraham.

Now, they are mistaken about many of the attributes of God, but that doesn't mean they are praying to a non-entity. Are you saying that God doesn't hear their prayers?

If this is your logic, then, since either Jews or Christians are also seriously mistaken about the attributes of God, do you believe that God doesn't hear the prayers of whichever of those two groups doesn't understand Him correctly?

14 posted on 10/23/2001 9:30:38 AM PDT by VeritatisSplendor
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To: egarvue
Mohammed was trying to unite the tribes of the period who were engaging in increasing warfare with each other and who did each have their own tribal god. You are correct that he got the idea of a unified from the Jews and Christians. He traveled with caravans with his uncle, later marrying his boss, a wealthy widow. On these travels, he did meet Christians and Jews and apparently discussed religion. So he chose the god of his tribe to be everyone's god. It has also been suspected by some that he had epileptic seizures and that he had his visions in the midst of seizures.
15 posted on 10/23/2001 9:31:52 AM PDT by twigs
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To: spycatcher
Well, the Muslim story on this is that ancient Arabian paganism was a perversion of primordal religion. Allah was the one and only God (so the story goes), but men perverted perverted that, set up daughters of Allah, as well as many other deities. Then Muhammad came and "restored" the original state of religion and returned Allah back to his original place.

Technically speaking, Muslims do not worship a moon-god. Their proper name for God may have originally came from the name of their moon god, but Muslims are quite clear that God is transcendant and very far away from material existance. In fact, it could be argued that the God of Islam is TOO transendant- he has supposedly never even spoken to men directly. Men are not even created in God's image, because God is unlike anything in material existence, as well as completely different from all creation. This is the main reason that the God of Islam is not the God of Judaism and Christianity- it is a far better argument than the "Islam's God was taken from an ancient Arabic pagan moon God" argument.

Instead, I would argue that the reason why Islam's God is different is, as I mentioned above, he is too transendant. The God of Judaism interacts directly with the people- the God of Islam only sends angels. The God of Judaism created men in his image- the God of Islam only created men as servant to be his viceregents on earth (you can ask any Muslim, and they will tell you- men have nothing in common with their God). The God of Islam is different from the God of Christianity for the same reasons, and more. The God of Christianity became man, fully sharing in human nature (one man, two complete natures, two wills- the human fully in conformity to the divine). The God of Christianity is three persons who share in one essence and hence are one God, while the God of Islam, while being just one God, is also only one person. This list is by no means complete, but I just wanted to point out that the arguments that Islam's God is not the same as the Judeo-Christian God should be taken in the opposite direction from the way I see it going- they are different in their very natures.

16 posted on 10/23/2001 9:34:41 AM PDT by MWS
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To: VeritatisSplendor
Christians who speak Arabic pray to "Allah".

I've been wondering about this. The Eastern Christians I know speak either Greek or Ukrainian. I've seen wild claims on FR about Islam being a dressed up moon-god cult, but so far all I've seen for documentation is a Jack Chick tract and a web site which displays similar (ie: zero) credibility. Still looking...

AB

17 posted on 10/23/2001 9:35:44 AM PDT by ArrogantBustard
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To: BibChr
We'll always give it a shot!
18 posted on 10/23/2001 9:41:11 AM PDT by alancarp
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To: VeritatisSplendor
Here's a fascinating read you might want to make regarding one of the 'prophets Mohammed cited as preceding him in the list which includes Jesus as merely a speaker/prophet, not the son of God ... Idris (from the egyptian pantheon of imaginary gods) the Prophet of Islam?
19 posted on 10/23/2001 9:43:47 AM PDT by MHGinTN
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To: VeritatisSplendor; OWK
There's a reason Allah's messenger seems to have the same personality as bin Laden and other creeps. Compare to the personality of Jesus. They're clearly messengers of two different Gods. I'll let you read and figure out which God is the true king of kings, and worthy of our praise.

Is Islam a Religion of Peace?

20 posted on 10/23/2001 9:45:13 AM PDT by spycatcher
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To: MWS
Good addition to the debate...thanks
21 posted on 10/23/2001 9:47:25 AM PDT by spycatcher
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To: spycatcher
I find it interesting that you ignored my earlier post.

Don't you find it at all peculiar that the only thing that seperates your vehement belief in your God, and their vehement belief in their God, is the geographical accident of your birth?

Had you been born elsewhere, you'd be every bit as convinced of the "truth of Allah" as you are currently convinced of the "truth of God". Doesn't this give you even a moment's pause for consideration?

22 posted on 10/23/2001 9:50:07 AM PDT by OWK
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To: spycatcher
See what the reaction is if one insists to a Muslim that the God of Abraham is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, as HE identifies HIMSELF.
The seed of promise and no other road.
23 posted on 10/23/2001 9:54:54 AM PDT by WalterSkinner
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To: OWK
"And so it goes.." Who knew that Linda Ellerbee was posting here???
24 posted on 10/23/2001 9:58:11 AM PDT by Sam's Army
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To: alancarp
More power to you. I gave up long ago; talking to an unreflecting amalgam of reflex cliches can't win a niche in my schedule.

Dan

25 posted on 10/23/2001 10:02:43 AM PDT by BibChr
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To: BibChr
I gave up long ago...

Translation: I can't refute his points.

26 posted on 10/23/2001 10:05:20 AM PDT by OWK
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To: OWK
Ha! The ignorant fools. Their puny moon god is no match for our mighty sun god.
27 posted on 10/23/2001 10:09:30 AM PDT by Wm Bach
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To: Wm Bach
You mean Rah?... rah, rah, rah, al ilah, sis boom bah
28 posted on 10/23/2001 10:13:46 AM PDT by MHGinTN
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To: spycatcher
There is much about Islam worthy of condemnation. I have observed on other threads that Mohammed consciously rejected the Gospel to which he undoubtedly had access--his Egyptian wife, Mary, was a Christian whom he abused for not accepting his false teachings. Thus Islam at its root is antichrist as the Holy Apostle and Evangelist John the Theologian used the word in his epistles. Mohammed copied what he liked about the traditional Christianity of his day--head scarves for women, prostration during prayer, some reverence for Jesus of Nazareth--to strengthen his lies.

Nonetheless, let us be honest in our critique of Islam. Allah is the Arabic word for God, used before Mohammed by Arabic speaking Christians, and still used in Arabic language Christian liturgies. There are some who argue that features of Mohammed's false teachings are drawn from an Arabian pagan moon god, but to say "Allah" is this moon god is absurd.

Incidentally tomorrow is the feast of St. Harith and the martyrs who died with him. St. Harith was the Christian leader of a city in what is now Yemen, who, with most of the citizens of his city were martyred by Arab pagans in 524. The city was retaken by the Ethiopians with assistance from the Empire, and was a pilgrimage site until its churches in honor of the martys were destroyed by the Muslims. (More proof that the attempt to credit Mohammed with giving the Arabs monotheism is a lie. He corrupted the Christian monotheism they already had.)

Thy martyrs, Harith and his companions, O Lord have received from Thee crowns of life and incorruption, for armed with Thy strength, they vanquished the tyrant and overcame the demons' strenghtless presumption. Wherefore by their intercessions grant our souls great mercy.

--the Troparion of the St. Harith and his companions

29 posted on 10/23/2001 10:14:20 AM PDT by The_Reader_David
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To: OWK
Nope, I'm not into cultural relativism. I would have read the Old Testament of Abraham and figured out that God and Allah are different.

And I would have at least seen Ghandi as preferable to the schizo personality of Mohammed. Mahatma Ghandi said, "It is a constant torture to me that I am still so far from Him whom I know to be my very life and being. I know it is my own wretchedness and wickedness that keeps me from Him."

That would have led me to Christianity and Jesus. Just look for the truth and let that guide your beliefs, don't mold truth to fit your preconceived notions.

30 posted on 10/23/2001 10:22:54 AM PDT by spycatcher
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To: spycatcher
I would have read the Old Testament of Abraham and figured out that God and Allah are different.

That flies in the face of reason.

Had you been indoctrinated into the Islamic tradition as a youth, you would worship Allah and read the Koran today. But instead, you were indoctrinated into the Christian tradition, so you worship God and read the Bible.

If you don't recognize this truth, then I submit that you are deluding yourself.

31 posted on 10/23/2001 10:26:57 AM PDT by OWK
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To: OWK
On the other hand, St. Ahmad and St. John the Dervish, two Turkish saints, were indoctrinated in Islam from youth, taught that the God of Abraham is identical with Allah-as-conceived-by-Mohammed, and yet became Christians and were martyred.

Why do you think that religious belief and theology are always the result of indoctrination when there are clear counter-examples?

32 posted on 10/23/2001 10:35:23 AM PDT by The_Reader_David
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To: OWK
Don't you find it at all peculiar that the only thing that seperates your vehement belief in your God, and their vehement belief in their God, is the geographical accident of your birth?

Had you been born elsewhere, you'd be every bit as convinced of the "truth of Allah" as you are currently convinced of the "truth of God". Doesn't this give you even a moment's pause for consideration?

I'd like to raise the possibility that there would be more worship of Yahweh and Jesus in geographic areas occupied by islamics if they would end the practice of killing Christians.

33 posted on 10/23/2001 10:38:44 AM PDT by Freebird Forever
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To: The_Reader_David
On the other hand, St. Ahmad and St. John the Dervish, two Turkish saints, were indoctrinated in Islam from youth, taught that the God of Abraham is identical with Allah-as-conceived-by-Mohammed, and yet became Christians and were martyred. Why do you think that religious belief and theology are always the result of indoctrination when there are clear counter-examples?

Just as there are handfuls of those raised in the Christian faith, who later converted to Islam.

The fact remains, that the odds are overwhlemingly in favor of the indoctrination of youth. If you were taught by your elders to be Islamic as a youth, then you will very likely embrace the Islamic faith. Likewise for the Christian faith.

Hence, the difference between the choice to embrace Islam or Christianity, is overwhelmingly correlated to the geographical accident of one's birthplace. And whether Christian or Islamic, the defenders of the respective faiths are equally convinced of the "truth" of what they were taught as children.

Why is this such a hard thing for you to admit?

34 posted on 10/23/2001 10:41:57 AM PDT by OWK
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To: Freebird Forever
I'd like to raise the possibility that there would be more worship of Yahweh and Jesus in geographic areas occupied by islamics if they would end the practice of killing Christians.

Just as those of the Islamic faith would assert that there would be more worship of Allah, had the crusaders not come.

And so goes the ebb and flow of theistic history...

35 posted on 10/23/2001 10:45:40 AM PDT by OWK
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To: spycatcher
There is something about all this hate you are spreading that you should keep in mind: what goes around comes around.
36 posted on 10/23/2001 10:47:04 AM PDT by Who is George Salt?
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To: spycatcher
According to the koran, Allah has NO gender, so he can't be the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob!
37 posted on 10/23/2001 10:50:03 AM PDT by Prodigal Daughter
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To: OWK
The fact that I'm even attempting to seriously understand how Islam is supposed to be a "great religion of peace" and that I read and admire Mahatma Ghandi makes your point silly. It's just that I found out in several seconds that I have zero admiration for Mohammed, and question who gave him his wacky ideas.

Unfortunately for relativists, Christ happens to be unique, essential, infallible, and easily superior in character to all men who ever lived. Millions that aren't even Christians realize he was the greatest man in history, but just don't want to accept his hard truths and unique claim to be the lamb and son of God. So they just say he was the greatest of all the prophets.

38 posted on 10/23/2001 10:51:11 AM PDT by spycatcher
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To: BibChr
Let's see, a moon god is the origin of Allah, the god of Islam; and a (Latin) word for moon gives us an English word for craziness: lunacy.

Yeah, that seems to fit.

39 posted on 10/23/2001 10:52:34 AM PDT by Petronski
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To: Freebird Forever
Yeah, slaughtering Christians sure keeps the conversion rate down!
40 posted on 10/23/2001 10:52:35 AM PDT by spycatcher
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To: OWK
Into what faith were you indoctrinated?

If you rejected it, does that make you nothing more than contrarion?

Would you have been a contrarion if born in an Islamic country? (If so, it would not have been for long.)

Of course, if you were born in an Islamic country, you wouldn't have been you. You would have been someone else. Thus, at best the question is foolish.

At best.

41 posted on 10/23/2001 10:55:35 AM PDT by AmishDude
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To: spycatcher
So you submit, that in spite of the overwhelmingly long odds against, it... you (being somehow special) having been raised and indoctrinated in the traditions of the Islamic faith, would have rejected that faith in favor of Christianity.

Sorry, but I don't think you're being honest with yourself.

42 posted on 10/23/2001 10:55:59 AM PDT by OWK
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To: OWK
If you don't recognize this truth, then I submit that you are deluding yourself

"The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork. Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge. There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard. Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world...."

Who is deluded?

43 posted on 10/23/2001 11:00:10 AM PDT by Bryan24
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To: AmishDude
The question addresses the statistical likelihood of one's faith.

It is very clear (to all but the most delusional of observers) that the indoctrination of one's youth determines the likely faith of one's adult life. That doesn't mean there aren't exceptions (nor did I suggest otherwise).

My point is that the odds are overwhelmingly in favor of those standing in defense of the "truth" of Christianity on this thread, being the same ones standing in defense of the "truth" of Islam had they been born elsewhere.

Why would anyone of sound mind seek to deny this?

44 posted on 10/23/2001 11:00:52 AM PDT by OWK
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To: OWK
Christianity believes that Jesus Christ is the God of Abraham. Islam doesn't. This is the fundamental difference.

If Islam claims to worship the God of Abraham, and Isaac... why did they keep the crescent moon as their "logo"?

45 posted on 10/23/2001 11:01:13 AM PDT by kjam22
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To: spycatcher
The Muslim notion of what God is like is false in many ways. Pre-Moslem Arab Pagans may have worshipped a moon god as "the God".

Nevertheless, "Allah" is now simply the Arabic word for God.

Arabic speaking Christian converts say "Allah"; Maronite Rite (Lebanese) Catholics say "Allah"; Maltese (a language related to Arabic) speaking Christians say "Allah"; and Moghrabi (Moroccan, though now mostly in Israel) Jews say "Allah". In ordinary speech, anyway. Some may pray in other languages.

46 posted on 10/23/2001 11:01:50 AM PDT by Salman
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To: Bryan24
Who is deluded?

Those who would deny that the faith into which individuals are indoctrinated as youths, overwhelmingly determine the faith that they practice as adults.

That's who.

47 posted on 10/23/2001 11:02:48 AM PDT by OWK
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To: OWK
The fact remains, that the odds are overwhlemingly in favor of the indoctrination of youth. If you were taught by your elders to be Islamic as a youth, then you will very likely embrace the Islamic faith. Likewise for the Christian faith.

What was the 'indoctrination' of YOUR youth?

48 posted on 10/23/2001 11:07:18 AM PDT by Petronski
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To: Who is George Salt?
It's not hate, it's finding out the truth. Nice attempt at stifling debate though -- just call your opponent a "hater."

I actually see many adherents of Islam as cult victims. I don't hate them, I feel sorry for them and am trying to understand the hook and whip that keeps them in line. The violent ones though, as you say... "should keep in mind: what goes around comes around." These people are nothing but criminals and will face "Infinite Justice." Unfortunately most Muslims seem to be silent or supporting the demonic violence aginst the infidels. Of course to you that *isn't hateful* right?

49 posted on 10/23/2001 11:07:50 AM PDT by spycatcher
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To: kjam22
why did they keep the crescent moon as their "logo"?

Same reason the jews keep the Star of David around... ancestor's worhip of Ishtar.

50 posted on 10/23/2001 11:07:58 AM PDT by Wm Bach
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