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To: Apple Pan Dowdy
In your post to me, you made some sense, and partly made my argument for me. You stated that man's brain cannot conceive of God, that only our heart/soul can. Well the feeling I get reading Ecclesiastes or certain Buddhist or Taoist texts, or even watching Star Wars might be the divine in me. However, if it's beyond the brain's ability, certainly there's no real need for the Bible, at least not for much of what appears in it.

You also said God would operate much like "the Force" would. In what I see around me, the order of the universe, I freely admit I don't know with certainty what lies beyond the pale of current human understanding. This could be a Force, or a God of some kind. This doesn't instantly validate the very specific Christian or Jewish vision of God. It would only validate some kind of loose theism.

If God wanted me to know His plan he'd have a way of telling me that trumped all else. If I wanted to save someone's life or soul, I'd hardly expect them to believe something written far before their time, I'd simply tell them. Or I'd have said something that would show knowledge beyond the achievements of that time(like Jesus inventing the airplane in 20 AD, or at least drawing one)

I was a Christian once, then a Jew. Now I'm an agnostic mostly. To me, whatever divine or Godliness exists manifests itself in the great triumphs and tragedies of my life and of humanity. The sorrow of losing my father, of not being able to work things out with someone who should be my wife and the joy of having someone as special as my mother, my friends, having loved so strongly before and knowing it shall happen again, all these are signs of the Divine. When I hear "Journey to the Line" from Hans Zimmer and my eyes fill with tears, this is the Divine.

The great things already exist for me, my life is not empty. I appreciate your concern, and I have no quarrel with how you've debated your side. Good fortune to you, my friend.

170 posted on 11/24/2001 2:44:07 PM PST by Skywalk
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To: Skywalk
Thank you for your kind words. I wanted you to know that I didn't debate with you because you angered me (for that was not the case)......... but rather because I saw in your words a sincere open mind that is searching for the truth, whatever it may be. And so I wanted to toss out a few ideas that you could think about.

On the other hand, I also enjoyed reading your arguments because it helps me understand why the concept of "the God of the Bible" is so difficult for many to accept. I can understand your points because I was once there. I grew up in a liberal-Christian home, went to college, decided to question all that I had taken on faith to be true. I too had a major problem with blood atonement, original sin, all those concepts which seemed to be contrary to a "loving God". I poured throught he scriptures looking for answers. Then I turned to writings on other religions hoping to maybe find my answers there. Looking back now I know with all my heart that the searching was a good thing even though it made me feel excited one minute then very confused the next. The rest is a bit too personal to write about here, but I will say that circumstances led me to a day when I was on my kneees crying out to "whatever God there may be" out there listening. Saying, "Who are you? If you are real then convince me!" Trust me, my friend,.... He did convince me!

I know that this does nothing whatsoever to sway your mind. How could it, for it was my experience not yours. But what I am saying, my friend, is.... keep on searching, God is patient. You will find your answers one day.

Peace and God's Blessings go with you always.

188 posted on 11/25/2001 4:47:42 AM PST by Apple Pan Dowdy
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