Oregon Firefighters set own blazes in bid to corral wildfires

You need to try again. I getting the famous little red X in a box in a box.

This is what happens when you don't allow roads, removal of dead trees and brush in a so called wilderness area:

But a curtain of smoke hangs from there south 25 miles to the California border and beyond, obscuring much of the 180,000-acre Kalmiopsis Wilderness.

"The wilderness is burning," Christiansen said. "We can't fight fire in there. It's too rugged."

"Greenie's from Hell" equals "Socialists in Drag"...MUD

Glad to see the Mud's humor motor is on high revs!!! ROFLMAO

Thanks, now I'm getting the picture. I can't figure why my computer does the red x in a box for a while on some of your replies.

That is one hot area.

Try right clicking the little x and then click on show picture in the tool bar that comes down.

EBUCK

It's because my image server is slow and the image loading routine has a timeout limit. If it takes to long to load the image IE just gives up on it.

EBUCK

This appears to be a fairly decent update from the latest Curry Pilot edition, for today:

THURSDAY MORNING FIRE UPDATE

Published: August 1, 2002

Dear readers,

We're hearing little updates from fire camps today as crews continue to work on the Florence, Sour Biscuit and Shelly Creek fires. No new alerts or evacuation orders have been issued overnight.

A West Florence Fire Camp for several hundred firefighters has been established at the fairgrounds in Gold Beach.

Forest road closure information is expected to be issued later today.

Oregon forestry officials say no significant changes took place over night. No backfire and burnout has taken place and the dozer line has not been reinforced, as the winds are still unsteady and shifting. Their release says 141,000 acres burned; others say 150,000. The biggest challenge has been reducing the anxiety level of folks in the area and controlling rumor, officials said in their morning release.

At the north end of the fire, Mary Stansell of the U.S. Forest Service said an initial attack line will be established just south of Oak Flat and Indigo Prairie today. Individual structure protection continues in the Oak Flat area.

At the south end of the giant Florence Fire, she said flames are still 5.5 air miles from Wilderness Retreat. It has not progressed any further than Vulcan Peak and Red Mountain.

Overall, the Florence Fire has moved to within 4 miles of Game Lake on the west flank, to Silver Peak on the north flank, to within five miles of Selma and Cave Junction on the east flank, and to Chetco Peak on the south flank. Successful back-firing has taken place on the ridges five miles west of Highway 199 above the Illinois Valley.

The Sour Biscuit Fire stretches from five miles south of the Florence Fire to six miles south of the California border.

Spotters have been placed in many locations, including at Quail Prairie Lookout, and Wild Horse Lookout.

Another community meeting for Illinois Valley residents is set for 7 p.m. Thursday at the Illinois Valley High School. The Illinois Valley remains under a possible evacuation alert, and voluntary evacuation has been encouraged for families with elderly, small children or disabled.

In Crescent City, exhausted firefighters are sleeping in tents at the fire camp at Del Norte High School., where a total of 879 crew members have come from around the nation

Del Norte County Supervisors are expected to declare a local disaster area for regions affected by the fire at their meeting this afternoon.

And the Gold Beach tourism industry is stressing that they are still under sunny skies, no threat from the fires and open for business.

Some of the standing situations:

-- Highway 199 remains closed from Jed Smith State Park to the Oregon-California border because of the 700-acre Shelly Creek Fire near Patrick's Creek Lodge.

-- The Rogue River Trail is closed from Graves Creek to Foster Bar. The BLM has also closed the Rainy Falls Trail and the Kelsey Pack Trail, both off the Rogue River Trail.

-- A variety of updates and maps is available at several Web sites. Look for them in links to this story at The Pilot's Web site, www.currypilot.com

It's amazing how much I learn on this Forum!! Thanks fer the video evidence...MUD

Muchas gracias, mi muchacho...can you sing the BobTheBuilder Song? Me and MUD Jr. can...

"Can We Build It?! Yes, We Can!!
Can We Build It?! Yes, We Can!!"

Well, that's all I know, but JakeyBoy can finish it!!

FReegards...MUD

This is interest from the Curry Pilot article I just posted:

A West Florence Fire Camp for several hundred firefighters has been established at the fairgrounds in Gold Beach.

The good news is the the Floristry Service is being replaced with the Forestry Service. They are putting these teams in to fight the fire on the N Side of the fire in the Agness area.

They can run the teams up and back with the jet boats if needed.

The bad news is that they apparently expect the fire to head north if not worked on.

Maybe you can wander down to the fair grounds and give us a first hand report.

****Are you really so sure about that? Remember, environmental law is authorized by treaties which supercede Federal Statutes. All this is, is a way for Dasshole to look good to his constituents for the election while accomplishing exactly NOTHING that would PO his real clientele.****

"Daschle’s legislation was tucked inside the defense supplemental spending bill, which passed the House July 23rd. It exempts South Dakota from the National Forest Management Act and the National Environmental Policy Act, and makes his action not subject to judicial review by any US court, thus handcuffing the same environmental activists whom his party normally assists to insure that active forest management is thwarted. “More than 20 lawsuits, appeals or reviews are blocking timber projects to remove fuel from the Black Hills,” writes Audrey Hudson in the Times. Daschle’s move not only thwarts the environmentalists’ utopian “pristine” forest policies, but provides relief for both the woodlands and the state’s beleaguered forest products industry, whose workers have suffered layoffs and depression."

HERE

So....yes, I would say that Daschle got FOR HIS STATE exactly what is needed for the other nat'l forests.

Carry.......you earlier posted that:
When the USFS settles they pay the RICOnuts for their costs. Now lest you think that the Forest Service bureaucracy wants it any other way, remember that 40% of the USFS budget is for legal expenses. More is spent satisfying consent decrees or documenting cases.

Do you think the USFS SEEKS out lawsuits on which to spend that 40% of their budget? I think not. Isn't that a bit like saying that if I bring a frivilous lawsuit against you, it is YOUR fault? I think the USFS is as sick of these lawsuits as you and I are. And it is the courts that require the USFS to pay the legal fees of these enviro nuts.

I don't think I am understanding your point on this budget issue.

Here is more from that Curry Pilot report I just posted as it pertains to Gold Beach and Agness:

The buffer against populated areas on the fire's east is the focus, but fire behavior analyst Erik Christiansen cautioned Wednesday that "the west side and the south side, we just don't have a handle on.

The new elite fire management team slated to take over the west side of the Florence fire near the Rogue River by Sunday could have its hands full.

"There could be some problems in Agness," said Lohrey, who noted that the blaze is burning within five miles of Bear Camp Road. "We've got quite a cushion over there, and we are assessing that today."

Stay alert and keep an eye and ear on what's happening to the East of you.

Southbound I5 north of Grants Pass at Sexton Pass:

Here is the California side of the fires in the SW Oregon and NW California area from the Eureka Standard:

Article Last Updated:
Thursday, August 01, 2002 -

Gasquet area fires grow, residents watch and wait
By John Driscoll The Times-Standard

GASQUET -- Residents of Gasquet and Hiouchi are holding tight as a giant border-straddling fire rages unchecked only miles from the tiny towns northeast of Crescent City.

The Sour Biscuit Fire, as it is now officially called, has grown since it jumped the Oregon border into California over the weekend. On the California side of the border the fire has sprung from 16,000 acres Tuesday to about 20,000 acres, and the fire as a whole has swelled to 33,000 acres.

"We're assessing the fire today and we're saying that there's not a current, immediate threat to the community of Gasquet," said Northern Rockies Incident Management Team spokeswoman Terry Knupp. The team is made up of a slew of agencies called in to handle coordination of large contingents of firefighters.

Knupp said she believes the fire is growing mostly in the northeast portion of the blaze, in an area called Holiday Mine, around High Dome. Nine hand crews, 96 personnel and two helicopters are fighting that fire.

The Sour Biscuit Fire has also come within about a half-mile of Simpson Timber Co. land. The company has carved a fire line on the border of its land to protect timber.

Another fire burning along U.S. Highway 199 has grown to 700 acres and has kept the highway -- which is acting as a fire line -- closed. The smaller Shelly Fire is currently getting more attention, with 41 engines, 17 hand crews, four bulldozers and five helicopters involved for a total of 879 people assigned to the fire.

The fire and another to the north called the Florence Fire that doubled in size to 145,000 acres Tuesday have sent ash and smoke far south into Humboldt County, giving the sunrise over the coastal hills around Humboldt Bay an orange pall. Another fire outside of Happy Camp has kept communities along the Klamath and Trinity rivers socked in by smoke.

The Sour Biscuit and Shelly fires have drawn about 1,000 firefighters and organizers to a camp at the Del Norte County High School set up over the past few days. As many as 1,000 more personnel may be arriving soon.

Gasquet and Hiouchi residents are still on 24-hour evacuation alert and were expected to be thoroughly apprised of their situation at a public meeting Wednesday night.

"We're kind of looking forward to that meeting tonight," said Karey Dean, whose husband is pastor of the Gasquet Bible Church on Gasquet Flat Road.

Dean said information has been scarce to date. She said the smoke may have pushed some people to leave the area for relief, but that no one has been forced to leave their homes. Little else has changed, she said, aside from churchgoers perhaps praying more fervently.

A firefighter reached at Gasquet's Wagonwheel Motel and Cafe, closed due to the fire, said the town woke up to an east wind thick with smoke. He said local fire teams have made contact with everyone in Gasquet and have given advice on how to protect their homes. They have also marked water sources in the area, like the 2,100-gallon portable tank he was setting up at the motel.

"Most everyone has their thoughts in order if and when they get the order (to evacuate)," said the firefighter, who requested anonymity.

The smoke and ash that has invaded Humboldt County is likely to stick around for some time, said Leonard Herr of the North Coast Unified Air Quality Management District. Herr said the smoke is being trapped in a recirculating air cell over northwestern California.

Satellite photos show streams of smoke from the California-Oregon fires moving to the southwest, into Humboldt County.

"It's not looking real horrible but it's not looking real good," Herr said. "I don't see much of a change anytime soon."

Herr said that people with respiratory problems should use common sense and stay indoors and avoid unnecessary exercise.

The Stanza Fire 10 miles outside of Happy Camp has burned 2,665 acres and is now 60 percent contained. More than 900 people are working to control that fire, sometimes using backfires to burn out fuels ahead of the approaching fire. No structures were threatened by the remote fire as of Wednesday evening.

Here is more from the California Side of the Biscuit fire.

Help arrives to douse county fires

By Kent Gray

Crescent City Triplicate staff writer

Firefighting crews from around the nation descended en masse on Del Norte County yesterday, as the two fires raging in the hills outside Crescent City rose to the number-one firefighting priority in the country.

Evidence of the new status was clear yesterday at Del Norte High School, where exhausted firefighters lounged on the grass and grabbed naps in a sea of tents, bulldozers, trucks and other equipment.

"Our focus is to go to the fire perimeter and see what we can do tactically to stop the fire where it is," said Wally Bennett of the U.S. Forest Service. Bennett was given command of the firefighting efforts last night and heads the Northern Rockies National Incident Command Team from Montana.

"The direction I got was to focus our efforts on the Biscuit-Fire Zone II, which is what we are calling it now, on the California side and the Shelley Creek Fire," Bennett said yesterday, as he marshaled the effort from the bustling high school command center.

Bennett said a combination of fire breaks and a direct assault on the two fires is being implemented. Nine hand crews with two helicopters and six more ordered have been assigned to the Biscuit Fire. The Shelley Creek Fire has 41 fire engines, 17 hand crews, four bulldozers and five helicopters assigned, with 879 total in personnel.

An assessment of the fires yesterday showed the Shelley Creek Fire had tripled overnight and now has spread to 700 acres, the Forest Service reported. The larger Sour-Biscuit Fire, now only a few miles from the giant Florence Fire in Oregon, covers more than 33,000 acres.

"The tactics are recommended by the operations chiefs, and I look at it and see where it all fits in with the overall strategy," Bennett said.

"I'm really strong with operations, plans and logistics," Bennett said. "I have a heavy staff – I brought 57 people with me. Generally, we have more folks and we can move quicker in our operations."

Bennett, who just arrived from fighting a fire in Colorado for 18 days, said every fire presents its own challenges. In Del Norte County it's the weather.

"That's different," Bennett said about the often cool and humid ocean breezes. "The problem we're having here is with our aviation operations. There is a very narrow window of opportunity to view the fire. In the morning there is fog. Shortly after that (is gone), the smoke moves in."

But the coastal breeze is a blessing too, Bennett said, because it is helping protect the Low Divide Road area, a rural mountainous area near the Oregon border. "It's helping. Right now there doesn't appear to be a real threat on the west side of the Biscuit Fire to the residents," he said.

A fire break was cut above Low Divide Road along a line that is generally just inside the Smith River National Recreational Area boundary. Bulldozers from Simpson Timber Company accomplished the task. Bennett said this would be one "anchor" from which to attack the fires. He said this secondary line was still a good distance from the fire perimeter.

"From a safety standpoint, we want a good solid anchor that is safe and then start flanking the fire. This will involve water work with helicopters and fire retardant at times," he said.

Bennett said his team is assessing the best vantage points on the other fronts, but that effort is hampered by the poor visibility.

"It is very smokey on the east side. And it's not a very clean burn – very spotty – so it's difficult to get a handle on where to start," he said.

Linda Szczepanik, incident commander of the Northern California Team, has been conducting aerial reconnaissance for the firefighting effort. Szczepanik is also coordinating the immediate operation against the Shelley Creek Fire, burning along Highway 199 near Patrick Creek Lodge.

"Linda will run by us what they have planned," Bennett said of the Shelley Creek operation. "She will run it by us to make sure we are on the same page. So far they've done everything the same as we would do.

Incident commander Paul Broyles from Idaho has set up a base camp south of Cave Junction and is coordinating Oregon operations with Bennett, he said yesterday.

****This is why we may have to kill all of the damn lawyers to even stand a chance with these greenies.****

If we use bow and arrows maybe it would look like the greenies 'did in' the lawyers! That way we get rid of BOTH.(evil grin)

Actually fire would be good or wooden stakes used as one would to really kill vampires.

On the Lars Larson program the reporter on scene just reported that the backfires so far have been set with no problem.

Now with the high wind time of the day in that area (2 to 7 pm), they have stopped all back fires and have massive air support to put out any southern push of the fire as the winds come on strong from the north.

Hopefully they had a good day and the back firing will prove a success tonight in halting the southern flow of the fire.

I'm out of here for a while.

Take care.

If anyone has some live reports of the Illinois Valley Wilderness Tinder Box Fires, please post them.

There is a real lack of real news from the Oregon tv, radio stations and newspapers.