Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

A Nation of Informers
New York Times ^ | 9/23/02 | ADAM LIPTAK

Posted on 09/22/2002 10:42:31 PM PDT by kattracks


WHAT should Eunice Stone have done?

As she was having breakfast at a Shoney's restaurant in Calhoun, Ga., one day earlier this month, she said she overheard a conversation among the three men in the next booth that alarmed her.

So Ms. Stone, a nurse from Cartersville, Ga., called the police and said that she heard the men discussing terrorism plans. As a consequence, law enforcement officials closed down the Interstate highway known as Alligator Alley and detained the men for the better part of a day. The men, who were Muslim medical students on their way to a hospital in Miami, endured a thorough search of their cars for explosives and intense public scrutiny before they were released.

Ms. Stone has been praised for her alertness as well as criticized for what civil-liberties advocates said was paranoia. She has hired lawyers. Yet Ms. Stone was clearly heeding the call of government officials, from President Bush on down, who have asked citizens to be vigilant and report anything suspicious.

It is hard to know how to calculate the costs and benefits of encouraging tips like that of Ms. Stone's, said Cass R. Sunstein, a law professor at the University of Chicago.

"There are two things to balance," he said. "One is the likelihood that you'll get good information that will prevent harm. The other is that you will get people in trouble who don't deserve to be or that you will create a culture of surveillance."

It is not difficult to identify in hindsight tips that should have been made but were not. After Sept. 11, 2001, for instance, a federal Department of Agriculture official in Florida was criticized for failing to report a charged encounter in 2000 with Mohamed Atta, believed to be the ringleader of the terrorist attacks. Other people came forward after Sept. 11 with stories about disturbing encounters with the hijackers that they did not report.

Last week, after the arrests of six Arab-American men from Lackawanna, N.Y., who are accused of being members of a Qaeda cell, New York state established a toll-free hotline for reporting suspicious activity. Information from within the Yemeni community in Lackawanna seems to have played a role in the arrests.

James McMahon, the superintendent of the New York State Police, said people should err on the side of passing along information, even if it is based only on "instincts and intuition."

But is it possible to be too vigilant? Does the flood of resulting tips obscure or even reduce, as the boy who cried wolf learned, the truly valuable information?

Even Gov. George E. Pataki sounded a little wary about the hotline when he announced it, asking people to use it "responsibly and with common sense."

Civil libertarians said that may be asking too much of the public.

"We will find ourselves falling into anarchy if we ask ordinary people to play the role that only law enforcement officials can play properly," said Anthony D. Romero, the executive director of the American Civil Liberties Union.

But others say such comments exaggerate and overreach.

"Informing in a country where thought crimes are criminal is one thing," said Charles Fried, a law professor at Harvard. "Informing in a country where the only crimes are menaces to public security in a physical sense is very different."

Mr. Sunstein said there was no need for alarmism. "I think our culture is strong enough that the likelihood that this will create serious problems for our freedom is very low,"` he said.

Those upon whom suspicion is cast have little legal recourse. It is permissible to contact the authorities with leads based on misunderstandings or ill-founded suspicions.

Various legal claims may be available in theory, experts said, among them defamation, infliction of emotional distress and malicious prosecution. But they are not likely to succeed. In most states and in most situations, plaintiffs must prove not only that the tip was false but that the informer knew or suspected that at the time and meant to harm the subject of the tip.

In the current environment, said Prof. Rodney A. Smolla of the University of Richmond School of Law, "there is not much realistic exposure to liability, though it would depend on the pointedness of the tip." A purposefully false accusation of training pilots for terror missions, he said, might be treated differently from the voicing of more generalized suspicions.

It gets more complicated when suspicions result in fights and imprisonment, as in the case of two men of Indian descent who were jailed in Arkansas earlier this month after a Northwest Airlines flight attendant grew concerned about their trips to the airplane bathroom. They may be able to sue the airline and the government for malicious prosecution or false imprisonment.

"It all turns on the question of probable cause," said Richard D. Emery, a civil rights lawyer.

Ibrahim Hooper, a spokesman for the Council on American-Islamic Relations, said untrained civilians are more likely to engage in racial stereotyping.

"There is a real chill in the Muslim community about what will be taken as an innocent comment," Mr. Hooper said.

And not all tips are made in good faith, he said.

"We've had reports of cases where people use tips as payback on the job," Mr. Hooper said. "We see it in custody cases, where people make all kinds of allegations against others if they're Muslims."

But false accusations are a part of law enforcement, Mr. McMahon said, and that is where police investigative skills come in. "Whether it comes in as a tip, a 911 call or over a seven-digit number, you're going to get false reports," he said.

If there are to be errors, Mr. McMahon said, they should be on the side of too much information.

"There are probably going to be a lot of tips that come in baseless," he said. "I'd rather hear about it."



TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-6061-8081-100 next last

1 posted on 09/22/2002 10:42:31 PM PDT by kattracks
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: kattracks
I'm with Eunice.
2 posted on 09/22/2002 11:01:11 PM PDT by Dialup Llama
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: kattracks
>Last week, after the arrests of six Arab-American men from Lackawanna, N.Y., who are accused of being members of a Qaeda cell, New York state established a toll-free hotline for reporting suspicious activity. Information from within the Yemeni community in Lackawanna seems to have played a role in the arrests.

Perhaps getting invited to an Al-Queda training camp, attending speeches by bin Laden and then laundering $87K in a casino also played a role?

3 posted on 09/22/2002 11:02:43 PM PDT by Dialup Llama
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Dialup Llama
Be vigilant! Profile! [And that doesn't mean slink around watching any turbined man you see. The community you save may be your own!]
4 posted on 09/22/2002 11:04:38 PM PDT by MHGinTN
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Dialup Llama
What should Eunice Stone have done?

Exactly what she did.

5 posted on 09/22/2002 11:06:18 PM PDT by kattracks
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: kattracks
"We will find ourselves falling into anarchy if we ask ordinary people to play the role that only law enforcement officials can play properly."

This woman didn't act as a law enforcement official. She simply reported what she had heard and let the officials take charge.

Ibrahim Hoppin, a spokesman for the Council on American-Islamic Relations, said untrained civilians are more likely to engage in racial stereotyping.

Well, duhhh... Somebody needs to engage in a little racial stereotyping -- including our law officials!!

6 posted on 09/22/2002 11:07:32 PM PDT by bjcintennessee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: kattracks
Exactly what she did.

I dont' know. It seems to me her son had a lot more sense than she did. It was obvious to him they were trying to get a rise out of her. Why couldn't see she it? She probably did. It just pissed her off.

7 posted on 09/22/2002 11:32:52 PM PDT by DentsRun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: kattracks
BTT
8 posted on 09/23/2002 12:03:05 AM PDT by crazykatz
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: DentsRun
It just pissed her off.

But the 3 stooges are not going to do it again huh? Try "joking" about a bomb in an airport.

9 posted on 09/23/2002 12:12:07 AM PDT by Texasforever
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Texasforever
But the 3 stooges are not going to do it again huh? Try "joking" about a bomb in an airport.

I wouldn't joke about a bomb in an airport (where there are armed guards around) but until the day I die I reserve the right to joke about anything in a hamburger joint over a cup of coffee and piece of pie.

10 posted on 09/23/2002 12:16:01 AM PDT by DentsRun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: DentsRun
Fine, then NO ONE, who ever hears anything even the slightest bit suspicious, should tell the police. FINE ! I hope that you won't complain any, should any of your friends / loved ones gets killed by a terrorist attack.

What would you have to say, IF Eunice had kept her mouth shut and those jerks did do something ? Yes, you would have heard about it. Others knew that she had heard them and the media would have been all over her, had something blown up, in Miami on the 13th.

11 posted on 09/23/2002 12:16:38 AM PDT by nopardons
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: DentsRun
I die I reserve the right to joke about anything in a hamburger joint over a cup of coffee and piece of pie.

Absolutely but be prepared to spend 12 hours on the side of the road. The woman did the right thing and the stooges are lucky that it was a woman instead of a table full of truckers that heard the "joke".

12 posted on 09/23/2002 12:19:14 AM PDT by Texasforever
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: DentsRun
Good, act like a jerk. I just hope that you pull a similar stunt and get ratted out. Then, maybe, just maybe, you'll grow up.

Yes, the First Ammendment garunteens us free speech. That freedom stops, when one decides to yell " FIRE " in a crowded threatre , for a " joke ".

13 posted on 09/23/2002 12:19:57 AM PDT by nopardons
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Texasforever
You are , of course, correct. Unfortunately, there are kids, here, who don't understand or care about what post 9/11/01 means.
14 posted on 09/23/2002 12:22:01 AM PDT by nopardons
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Texasforever
Lot of military bases around there. Too bad these three didn't do the USO thing and entertain the troops.
15 posted on 09/23/2002 12:23:03 AM PDT by CWOJackson
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: nopardons
What would you have to say, IF Eunice had kept her mouth shut and those jerks did do something ? Yes, you would have heard about it. Others knew that she had heard them and the media would have been all over her, had something blown up, in Miami on the 13th.

Her son could see those Muslims were jerking her around. Why couldn't she see it? I suspect she probably could. She just decided to report them anyway because they pissed her off. That's what happens when you give inordinate power to small minded people. Same thing with the airport inspects and air marshals--their power has gone to their heads. They pull guns on airplanes full of people, strip medal of honor winners of their prizes and humiliate young women by pawing through their underwear. Is this why we fought the American Revolution?

16 posted on 09/23/2002 12:23:29 AM PDT by DentsRun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: Texasforever
Absolutely but be prepared to spend 12 hours on the side of the road. The woman did the right thing and the stooges are lucky that it was a woman instead of a table full of truckers that heard the "joke".

If truckers want to listen in on my private conversations they're welcome to follow me home and voice their complaints to my 12 gauge.

17 posted on 09/23/2002 12:26:32 AM PDT by DentsRun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: nopardons
You are , of course, correct. Unfortunately, there are kids, here, who don't understand or care about what post 9/11/01 means.

I guarantee that 9-11 doesn't mean we give up all our freedoms to busybodies.

18 posted on 09/23/2002 12:27:36 AM PDT by DentsRun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: DentsRun
It's a damned good thing, that you weren't an adult, during WW I or WW II !

She said that they " might " have been playing a hoax. She felt that it was better to be safe, than sorry. You call that being " small minded " ? She had " power " ? Are yoy really this stupid, after being on FR, for such a long time ?

No, she did NOT report them, because , as you so ineligantly claim, she was pissed off. She reported their remarks, because she didn't KNOW if it was a hoax or for real. What part of " just in case ", are you having abject difficulty in comprehending ?

19 posted on 09/23/2002 12:28:51 AM PDT by nopardons
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: nopardons
Yes, the First Ammendment garunteens us free speech. That freedom stops, when one decides to yell " FIRE " in a crowded threatre , for a " joke ".

If her son knew it was a joke, why didn't she know it was a joke? In fact, she did know. She also knew, given the public's mood, that she could teach those Muslims a lesson they'd never forget. If she'd done it to blacks or jews we'd call it racism. Because she did it to Muslims here on Free Republic we celebrate it.

20 posted on 09/23/2002 12:30:23 AM PDT by DentsRun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-6061-8081-100 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson