Smallpox vaccinations urged (MSNBC) - Offer to general population represents a shift in policy

http://www.msnbc.com/news/817382.asp ^ | 10-5-02 | MSNBC

[templar]

It's based on previous experience with DryVax by Wyeth during the 1970's.

You seem knowelegable about this. Could you explain to me why the reactions to the DryVax would be the same as the Smallpox vaccine? I keep remembering swine flu for some reason, when I think about this.

[Thud]

The chief of the Soviet Union's smallpox weaponization program defected to us. His anglicized name is Ken Abilek. The enhanced, bioengineered, weaponized smallpox developed under his direction is terrifying. Here are its effective differences from natural smallpox:

Natural: 7-15 day incubation period (typically 10-12 days), 40-60% morbidity (40-60% of those exposed will contract it - say an average of 50%), 10-30% of those who contract it will die assuming enough medical care to keep them from dying of something else (20% average lethality).

Enhanced weaponized: 1-5 day incubation period (typically 3 days), 60-90% mordidity (average of 75%), 30-50% lethality (average of 40%).

So weaponized smallpox is about 50% worse than that found in nature and worse, its incubation period is only about three days. The latter means that vaccination won't save you if you've already been exposed. This stuff is a fucking disaster!

[Thud]

Read Ken Abilek's _Biohazard_ and Jonathan Tucker's _Scourge_.

[Robert_Paulson2]

yup...

I posted an article... didn't say I agreed with it...

[Robert_Paulson2]

flamethrowers would probably work.

roflmao... indeed.

[Vic3O3]

vaccine ping!

[bonesmccoy]

You may be confusing the vaccines. Swine flu is definitely different than cox pox (which is the virus in the small pox vaccine). Dryvax is a live virus, which is why the public health guys are concerned about side effects). DryVax is the small pox vaccine.

[bonesmccoy]

I am familiar with Alibek's comments.

[janeliberty]

Thought I heard they cut the regular vaccine dosage in half or thirds. They may not know the effectiveness of this diluted vaccine.

I found it interesting that those treated by chemotherapy are not eligible for the vaccine due to a weakened immune system.

Sure is ironic, how chemo can help treat cancer, but is a detrement when it comes to smallpox.

[BearCub]

any prophylactic antibiotic that is effective? Is it something a five day regimen of antibiotics would possibly prevent the spread of?

Ebola = virus. Antibiotics to not treat/prevent viral diseases.

[STARWISE]

We are at risk for an abundance of threats, there is no doubt. We have to live with it from now on until the war on terror succeeds in disabling all the anti-American evil and Satanic animals in the world. All types of bio-chemical hazards are out there that could be used against us. We must keep praying for our courageous President, brave relentless military, and frontline defense personnel in security and healthcare, and be ever alert. God Bless Us All.

Check this out .. and here's the URL: Botulism Study

"Botulinum Toxin as a Biological Weapon ............

.........Objective The Working Group on Civilian Biodefense has developed consensus-based recommendations for measures to be taken by medical and public health professionals if botulinum toxin is used as a biological weapon against a civilian population.

Participants The working group included 23 representatives from academic, government, and private institutions with expertise in public health, emergency management, and clinical medicine.

Evidence The primary authors (S.S.A. and R.S.) searched OLDMEDLINE and MEDLINE (1960–March 1999) and their professional collections for literature concerning use of botulinum toxin as a bioweapon. The literature was reviewed, and opinions were sought from the working group and other experts on diagnosis and management of botulism. Additional MEDLINE searches were conducted through April 2000 during the review and revisions of the consensus statement.

Consensus Process The first draft of the working group's consensus statement was a synthesis of information obtained in the formal evidence-gathering process. The working group convened to review the first draft in May 1999. Working group members reviewed subsequent drafts and suggested additional revisions. The final statement incorporates all relevant evidence obtained in the literature search in conjunction with final consensus recommendations supported by all working group members.

Conclusions An aerosolized or foodborne botulinum toxin weapon would cause acute symmetric, descending flaccid paralysis with prominent bulbar palsies such as diplopia, dysarthria, dysphonia, and dysphagia that would typically present 12 to 72 hours after exposure.

((NOTE: diplopia = double vision; dysarthria = a motor speech disorder; dysphonia = neurologic voice disorder that is characterized by jerky, strained, strangled and sometimes unintelligible speech; dysphagia = difficulty or discomfort when swallowing.)

Effective response to a deliberate release of botulinum toxin will depend on timely clinical diagnosis, case reporting, and epidemiological investigation. Persons potentially exposed to botulinum toxin should be closely observed, and those with signs of botulism require prompt treatment with antitoxin and supportive care that may include assisted ventilation for weeks or months. Treatment with antitoxin should not be delayed for microbiological testing.

JAMA. 2001;285:1059-1070 This is the fourth article in a series entitled Medical and Public Health Management Following the Use of a Biological Weapon: Consensus Statements of The Working Group on Civilian Biodefense.1-3 This article is the only one in the series to feature a biological toxin rather than a replicating agent.

Botulinum toxin poses a major bioweapon threat because of its extreme potency and lethality; its ease of production, transport, and misuse; and the need for prolonged intensive care among affected persons.4, 5 An outbreak of botulism constitutes a medical emergency that requires prompt provision of botulinum antitoxin and, often, mechanical ventilation, and it constitutes a public health emergency that requires immediate intervention to prevent additional cases. Timely recognition of a botulism outbreak begins with an astute clinician who quickly notifies public health officials.

Botulinum toxin is the most poisonous substance known.6, 7 A single gram of crystalline toxin, evenly dispersed and inhaled, would kill more than 1 million people, although technical factors would make such dissemination difficult. The basis of the phenomenal potency of botulinum toxin is enzymatic; the toxin is a zinc proteinase that cleaves 1 or more of the fusion proteins by which neuronal vesicles release acetylcholine into the neuromuscular junction.8 ...."

[Hila]

Trusting the administration on this issue may be fine, yet, the government itself keeps bringing the accountability issue of how risky the vaccinations may be. And then, the terrorists may use something else which is not fought by smallpox vaccines.

[GOPJ]

If American citizens are vaccinated, there's almost no chance they'll bother using smallpox as a weapon. Why bother? On the other hand, if it could kill millions of us, they'll use it.

Although they have no way of knowing the likelihood of a smallpox attack, health experts fear such an attack because the virus is so contagious and so deadly.

"Although they have no way of knowing the likelihood of a smallpox attack, health experts fear such an attack because the virus is so contagious and so deadly."

[southland]

I will get the small pox vaccination ASAP. No point in ignoring the potential problem. When they start spreading diseases why let one easily thwarted bring us down??

[bonesmccoy]

Yep... ready the physicians and nurses of this country for bioattack... I'm getting our office prepared and ready for a January assault. This is no joke. I think doctors are the worst prepared people for this war. I'm even thinking of joining the US Public Health Service so I can get into uniform and speak at the hospital meetings with more authority than the old-liberal lunkheaded HMO stooge physicians (who still don't realize that there is a war on... those doctors are too busy driving Porsche's and thinking they can smoke their way to enlightment).

[pgkdan]

This article is nonsensical garbage and you put your mental stability at risk by reading such dribble. The President and his administration are not interested in scaring the American people into submission, and I have heard several assertions that Saddam has smallpox. Give it a rest...George W Bush is not Bill Clinton, if he thinks there's a serious risk to our population I'm willing to accept that at face value.

[pgkdan]

tests show any residual is plenty effective... even up to 45 years I read last week...

Where did you read that??? On that same whack job website you posted from earlier? The CDC and other sources say that you're wrong on that score. Ever see pictures of a smallpox victim? Are you willing to bet your vaccine is still effective with that as the ante?

President Bush deserves our support on this. I'll bitch and moan and complain every single time I think he's caving to the dims on their social agenda, but I'll never give an inch of ground to anyone who claims that W is anything less than an honorable, decent and good man who has the best interest of his country at heart...period.

[Robert_Paulson2]

please take a look at:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/763775/posts?page=17#17

I said, and I quote...
"I don't agree with Reese."
got it? that is what I said.

we post articles here... and discuss them, even if we don't agree with them at times.

POSTING does NOT equal AGREEMENT... thanks for understanding.

and I never said Bush was Clinton. sheesh.
or that there is NO RISK of small pox...

[Robert_Paulson2]

Study: Smallpox Vaccine Protects For 50 Years
Microbiologist Says Revaccination Unnecessary
Updated: 9:46 a.m. EDT August 29, 2002

New research says people who received smallpox vaccinations at birth can rest assured in the event of an outbreak.



SMALLPOX
Smallpox FAQs
Smallpox Diagnosis Online
CDC Smallpox Resource Center


Dr. Jeffrey Frelinger, a microbiologist at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, observed that people who received the smallpox vaccine years ago still had a high level of immunity.
In the fall of 2001, Frelinger and his team conducted a formal study to determine how long the vaccine protects people. The results are published in the Aug. 29 issue of the New England Journal of Medicine.

"When Sept. 11 happened, we realized somebody might care about this," Frelinger said. "With the whole anthrax thing, this might be useful information to have out there in the world."

The team tested blood samples from 13 laboratory workers who had been vaccinated they work with the weakened virus in the vaccine. Four had been vaccinated less than five years ago. Another nine individuals had been vaccinated either between five and 35 years earlier or more than 35 years ago.

He tested immune response and discovered that people who were vaccinated up to 35 years ago had enough immunity to protect them. Even after 50 years, there is protection.

"It might not be enough protection to keep you from getting sick. It's almost certainly enough protection to keep you from getting killed," Frelinger said.

If a smallpox outbreak occurred, Frelinger believes the government may not need to revaccinate.

"Instead, worry about people who were born after 1972, who've never been vaccinated," he said.

New government proposals do not call for mass vaccinations; however, in the event of an outbreak, people who are not vaccinated are expected to quickly use up the stockpiled doses.

The government has enough vaccine in hand for 75 million people, with more on the way.

---

next time dan, please do be a little more polite and knock off with the "whack job" insults... This by the way... IS a CDC source... the New England Journal of Medicine published the study, and they say, fifty years. This is hardly a "whack job" article. And we discuss reese pretty often around here... posting one of his articles is "fair game" and does not indicate agreement with its content... fair enough?

[Robert_Paulson2]

Old Smallpox Vaccine Shows Resiliency
A small study finds it generates an immune response even 35 or more years after it was given.

By Adam Marcus

WEDNESDAY, Aug. 28 (HealthScoutNews) -- People who received the smallpox vaccine more than three decades ago still appear to have substantial protection against the deadly virus.

Researchers have found that while a fresh inoculation may offer the best defense against smallpox, even immunization that occurred 35 years ago or longer retains most of its potency. They report their findings in a letter appearing in tomorrow's issue of The New England Journal of Medicine.

The durability of the vaccine has been a wild card for health officials, who are considering a return to widespread smallpox vaccination to blunt a possible terrorist strike with the microbe. The United States abandoned routine immunization against the virus in 1972, and the World Health Organization declared the infection eradicated in 1980. However, the United States and Russia have preserved samples of the virus, and intelligence experts fear that rogue states like Iraq and North Korea may have obtained supplies of it to use as a bioweapon.

To meet that threat, the Bush administration has set about stockpiling enough smallpox vaccine to cover every American.

Earlier this year, an advisory panel for the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) recommended that mass vaccination wasn't necessary and could lead to hundreds of deaths from complications of the inoculation, which involves scratching the vaccinia virus underneath the skin with a tiny pitchfork-like device.

Instead, the group's guidelines produced an estimate that roughly 15,000 health and emergency workers first to respond to a smallpox outbreak might need the vaccine most. Yet, some officials reportedly are urging that as many as half a million people receive it.

The government has yet to announce its decision regarding the panel's recommendations. Bill Pierce, a spokesman for the Department of Health and Human Services, which oversees the CDC, said his agency had given itself a deadline of the end of September to determine its course.

"We're still in the time frame we said we'd be in," he said.

Pierce said officials were aware that smallpox vaccine could remain effective for many years, and would use that information in its decision-making.

In the new study, which fell out of an HIV experiment, University of North Carolina immunologist Jeffrey Frelinger and a colleague looked at the durability of the smallpox vaccine in 13 lab workers who handle the inoculation.

Of those, four were immunized not more than five years ago, while nine received the vaccine six to 35 years ago and longer. Looking at the response of immune agents called CD8 cells to the vaccinia virus, the researchers saw that people who were immunized recently tended to have the strongest reaction to the vaccine. Yet, those vaccinated more than 35 years ago had only about a third less reactivity, on average, than the recent recipients.

"That's actually pretty resilient to [a virus] you haven't been exposed to for 30 years," said Frelinger, who bared his arm for the study as a volunteer.

Frelinger said policy makers may want to consider his results in prioritizing how smallpox vaccine is distributed, should that prove necessary. "You would want to vaccinate unvaccinated people first," he said.

The study also may be of some comfort to those who've already had at least one round of smallpox vaccine in the past, he added, since their risk of an adverse reaction to the inoculation likely is lower than that of someone naive to it.