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CAVUTO REPORTS THAT BUSH CONSIDERING SCRAPPING THE IRS CODE!!!
Fox News Channel | November 6, 2002 | n/a

Posted on 11/06/2002 1:39:57 PM PST by Tree of Liberty

Neil Cavuto just interviewed Mitchell E. Daniels, Jr., the director of the OMB, and Neil let it be known that he's hearing rumblings that Pres. Bush is considering a total re-write of the tax code and that SecTreas O'Neill is strongly pushing a national retail sales tax!


TOPICS: Breaking News; Business/Economy; Constitution/Conservatism; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 16th; amendment; bigsavingsaccts; fatpaycheck; goodbyejune5th; holdyourankles; internal; irs; liberalsscreechin; national; nrst; pipedream; putneckonhrblock; retail; revenue; sales; service; sixteenth; slavery; socialengineering; tax; taxcode; taxreform
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To: palmer
Well I hate to break it to you, but your state seems to
collect sales tax at flea markets:

http://policylibrary.tax.state.va.us/OTP/Policy.nsf

http://policylibrary.tax.state.va.us/OTP/Policy.nsf

It is collected at flea markets in California, but not usually added to the price by the seller.

http://www.boe.ca.gov/pdf/pub111.pdf

IMO the amount of sales tax lost at flea markets doesnt compare to that lost by legal manuverings by high priced tax lawyers.
541 posted on 11/06/2002 8:17:31 PM PST by rolling_stone
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To: Jim Robinson; Principled
To: Principled ~~ I know. Someone suggested they be excluded up front. I'm fine with that. Whatever mechanism can be sold to get this done is fine by me. 527 posted on 11/06/2002 7:52 PM PST by Jim Robinson

I guess I could agree to "whatever mechanism possible" to get this sold, but speaking for myself I would much rather receive a flat $200 per-month, per-person "basic necessities" rebate and decide for myself what my "basic necessities" are, than let some politician decide what sorts of food and housing constitute my "basic necessities" (and next thing you know, clothing, and next thing you know, medical care, etc.... exemptions and loopholes as far as the eye can see).

For this reason, I strongly support the HR 2525 "Fair Tax" proposal over the exemption-and-loopholes "Alan Keyes Tax" variety, and I hope that HR 2525 is the Bill which actually goes forward.

Incidentally, assuming a 30% Sales Tax rate, with a $200 monthly rebate, persons earning less than $8000 per year would be living essentially Tax Free, and persons earning less than $17,000 per year would be paying less in Sales Tax than they are now under Payroll and Income Taxes. The Middle Class and Affluent will likely see little tax advantage (as the rebate is dependent on household size, Singles and smaller households might pay slightly more, large households might pay slightly less), but I am confident we'll make it back in Time-and-Effort savings.

542 posted on 11/06/2002 8:18:13 PM PST by OrthodoxPresbyterian
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To: palmer
...think about the difficulties of collecting sales tax on illegal drugs.

Yeah...that's like the difficulties of collecting income taxes from illegal-drug dealers. In fact, there's not much difference, is there?

543 posted on 11/06/2002 8:18:39 PM PST by Principled
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To: palmer
So? seems to be the state's problem with dealing with sellers, not you as the final purchaser.

Only the seller is liable for remitting the tax, and held accountable as to the goods he sells.

There in lay the disincentive to cheat. The seller takes all the risks of selling at a tax free price to you. He doesn't know when it is worth your effort to turn him in for not remitting sales tax from your purchase of goods from him.

544 posted on 11/06/2002 8:19:32 PM PST by ancient_geezer
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To: Principled
"I'm glad "you're open", because you have lots to learn!"

I did read the links earlier and I'm getting a little more up to speed....
Of course, even if they were to decide to try to adopt a sales tax, we don't know that the details would be the same as in this plan.
We all know the devil is always in the details...

But I'm still open.... :^)
545 posted on 11/06/2002 8:20:10 PM PST by Route66
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To: Calamari
Mount McKinley, and a statue 20,000 feet tall!
546 posted on 11/06/2002 8:20:21 PM PST by Frank_2001
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To: Tree of Liberty
I'll believe it when I see it...but WOW.
547 posted on 11/06/2002 8:21:26 PM PST by Bloody Sam Roberts
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To: kapj
If we could tax liberal stupidity we could pay off the national debt.

That reminds me of one of Bob Dole's jokes: Dole was referring to his going-away speech to the U.S. Senate. "I said, 'Now let me tax your memory.' And Ted Kennedy jumped up and said, 'Why didn't I think of that!?'"

548 posted on 11/06/2002 8:22:05 PM PST by Thane_Banquo
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To: Stultis
"Doth the Ursinoid excrete in the sylvan glades?"


Priceless, I think I have heard this expressed in earthier terms, something about it seems so familiar.
549 posted on 11/06/2002 8:22:27 PM PST by RipSawyer
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To: rolling_stone
Whoops those links don't work, put in Flea Markets in the search area and you come back with this"


Virginia Tax administrative code"
23VAC10-210-570 Virginia Tax Administrative Code Fairs, flea markets, circuses, carnivals, etc


Rulings of the tax commissioner:
PD 85-66 Rulings of the Tax Commissioner 03/27/1985 Permission to collect and remit the sales tax for others
550 posted on 11/06/2002 8:23:01 PM PST by rolling_stone
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To: OrthodoxPresbyterian
THe rebates for HR2525 are higher than you're assuming. The rebates (last year) were something like $186 per parent plus $156 per child all per month.

It's based on HHS poverty levels.

551 posted on 11/06/2002 8:23:49 PM PST by Principled
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To: Tree of Liberty
I'll believe it when I see it, but if this is true, Dubya will go down in my book as a Presidential Hero.

My wish list (as far as taxes are concerned):
1) Repeal the estate (death), marriage, payroll, and capital gains taxes.
2) Institute a national retail sales tax.
3) Trash the progressive income tax, and institute a flat 5% federal income tax (no write-offs). If the retail sales tax is deemed sufficient to pay for the essentials, abolish the income tax altogether).
4) Abolish the IRS.

There are others, but I'm too tired to think about it.

Of course, for this to work, most social/welfare programs will have to be scrapped, as well as ALL foreign aid.

552 posted on 11/06/2002 8:24:18 PM PST by Mr. Mojo
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To: Route66
...even if they were to decide to try to adopt a sales tax, we don't know that the details would be the same as in this plan.

But that IS the plan. It's HR2525 and it's in congress right now. Do a thomas-loc search on hr2525. It is there now- exactly as written.

553 posted on 11/06/2002 8:25:32 PM PST by Principled
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To: agitator
A "national retail sales tax" is not constitutional

I am afraid you are incorrect. I quote Article 1, Section 8 of the United States Constitution:

"Section 8. The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;..."

The Miriam Webster Dictionary defines excise as "an internal tax levied on the manufacture, sale, or consumption of a commodity."

Thus as long as a national sales tax is uniform throughout the country, it is Constitutional.

554 posted on 11/06/2002 8:27:03 PM PST by Thane_Banquo
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To: Principled
Of course, since your car, house, and airplane are used, there would be NO TAX on them. Why would it matter if you used cash? 539 posted on 11/06/2002 8:15 PM PST by Principled

Personally, I think that all of these items should be included -- It would lower the overall rate. Real Estate sales (residential only, not even counting Commercial) constitute something like $1.2 Trillion dollars in annual transaction value. The inclusion of these items in the NRST schedule could potentially reduce the base rate from 30% to more like 20%, IMHO.

And it's not like houses won't sell, either. Banks will just include the Tax in the Total Mortgage amount (c'mon, almost nobody pays Cash for a house, the critics are just being silly) because Banks don't like to be in violation of the Law. And people will still BUY houses, because with no Income Tax, they can afford the Sales Tax.

It's not like most people are gonna "flip" their house in 3 months and lose the Tax they paid; the average residency in a home purchase is something like 7 years.


But that's a quibble on my part. I think that Home Sales should be included; I think that I am right about this; but I support HR 2525 whether or not it includes Home Sales in the tax schedule.

555 posted on 11/06/2002 8:27:11 PM PST by OrthodoxPresbyterian
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To: Irene Adler
That's the only major problem I see with such a system: a black market would spring up

You make it sound like we don't already have a black market or tax evasion.

556 posted on 11/06/2002 8:27:11 PM PST by Principled
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To: RipSawyer
Actually, the amendment did not remove the original wording which forbade such a tax, therefore the amendment is worthless since the constitution cannot be in conflict with itself.

That's not very good logic. If an ammendment can't override the original text what would be the point of ammending?

If an ammendment allows something that was disallowed in the originnal text then the ammendment rules. There does not need to be specific language to remove the original words.

557 posted on 11/06/2002 8:27:18 PM PST by mlo
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To: Principled
The problem is, we still have this pesky thing called the 16th Amendment - and that is the law of the land until it is repealed.

With a VAT/NRST, we could see an income tax brought back, and we get the worst of both worlds.
558 posted on 11/06/2002 8:30:29 PM PST by hchutch
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To: palmer
I read the FAQ. They don't explain how this stops registration of all ammunition sales.

Nor do they discuss how this will eliminate drunk-driving by bald headed men. (as a dear friend used to say).

There is no tracking of anything except gross receipts, palmer. No itemization, no listing of anything except GROSS RECIEPTS.

What's the paranoid bullet thing?

559 posted on 11/06/2002 8:30:45 PM PST by Principled
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To: mil-vet
I looked at what I spend in a retail sense, and I see what the "fair tax" people are proposing as a sales tax percentage, and I lose money!

look closer....your pay check will increase 7.65% due to no more ss deduction....add another 15-20% in income tax deductions and your already at 22 -28% increase in take home pay. I own a business with 20 employees and i can GUARANTEE retail prices will fall as well. See.....I match that 7.65% SS deduction not to mention corporate income taxes my business pays. Sure businesses would try to keep the windfall but a free market will guarantee that prices will level out below where they are now......

You will be FAR BETTER OFF with the NSRT.....

560 posted on 11/06/2002 8:31:58 PM PST by is_is
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