Lower drinking age to 18

The Lantern (Ohio State U.) ^ | 11/27/02 | Joe Pirone

[quietolong]

What is underage drinking in the military? When I was in you could go to the E club drink all you wanted. or go to the commissary and buy what you wanted. all you need was your “ green card “

[Long Cut]

The current regs mandate that no military personnel may drink alcohol if said drinking violates CIVILIAN law in the area where such drinking takes place. Here in the States, it's the magic "21".

It's ironic, because when we deployed to places like Italy or Spain, the drinking age was 18 and the base E-clubs acted accordingly. Then, once returning home, those who had had no troubles at all were suddenly lawbreakers. The fact that the military knuckled under to the MADD crowd rankles all of us.

[SoDak]

I suppose a case could be made that the states shouldn't rely on federal money for highways.

They've already collected our tax money for roads, it's just that as soon as they get it, it now magically is theirs to wield as a weapon. It's like working, getting your check, and handing it over to a third party so that they can tell you what to do, or you won't get your allowance.

[AFPhys]

For what it's worth, my two cents is that if someone has a high school diploma they ought to be able to drink. There is enormous pressure on every college campus simply due to the two different populations due to the age "21". I accept that there will be more traffic deaths, etc., and that is unfortunate, but death is part of our existence here.

[GunRunner]

Resectfully, you're anser is the most wise and most forthright I have heard. There is NO, i mean NO, good and viable conservative argument against what you said.

[Morgan in Denver]

I can offer two specific examples.

While stationed in Germany, where the drinking age was when someone was tall enough to reach the bar, I met and knew many Germans who drank almost daily yet remained adult in handling it and dealing with it. There was not pressure to drink since everyone could do it anyway and drinking was not considered "cool" by ones peers.

The other example was in college. My fraternity brothers did a pledge sneak, traveling from Oklahoma to Kansas in order to drink legally. Kansas drinking age was 18 and Oklahoma 21. Once in the Kansas bar, the Oklahoma kids made total fools of themselves, acting immaturely and bordering on getting into trouble. The Kansas kids, of the same age, simple sat there enjoying their beer and not causing any problems. The difference was stark, and the Kansas 18 year olds showed the maturity of an adult and I must admit I was more than a little embarrassed about my friends.

The nanny-state simply refuses to deal with reality. When talking about the riots in Ohio last week, Alan Combs, of Hannity and Combs, suggested the solution was to eliminate the sale of beer or other alcohol, removing the temptation. Typical liberal Democrat, he would punish everyone in a dumb attempt to solve a problem. Sean Hannity's retort was to simply enforce the laws. The guest, whom I can't remember, said if a couple of looters were shot it would send a signal on being serious about such behavior. Of course, Combs became unglued on the very thought of one of these criminals actually paying a price for their actions. Heaven forbid that someone should actually take responsibility for their actions.

[Morgan in Denver]

I know you are making a joke but it's close to the same thing Thomas Sowell talks about when he discusses the "anointed" class. In the Kennedy world, they are above the law so anything to keep the masses in line is okay since they don't have to abide by the same rules. So, no, ole' Teddy could do whatever he wants to do.

[B Knotts]

This is an amusing thread. All these people earnestly arguing to Illbay how the drinking age should be lowered.

You're not going to convince him, though, as he favors total prohibition of alcohol. Go ahead; ask him.

Personally, I favor a more mature approach to alcoholic beverages than we currently use. The current model encourages irresponsibility and binge drinking. This is one of the few areas in which I think the Europeans have a better approach than us.

[Darksheare]

But if you lower the drinking age, the liberals will try to lower other age limits as well. They will want to lower the smoking age, the age of consent, just about anything.
And it will set a precedent that will have consequences no-one will want to deal with. Or take responsibility for.
That, and the "Legalize poT" crowd will want to be pampered as well.

[quietolong]

What Bravo Sierra. No wonder we haven’t gotten Osom yet;) When did they start this up?
Let me guess the C&C was Billarey. Shows what happens when you have piss poor leadership at the top!

Not even a Nuke the Talaband send off party! God when Iran did the hostage thing we had a Nuke Iran party and finished off 4 large shit-cans full of Mo-Jo plus a S L of Beer. LOL

Just pulled up your home page

If guns are outlawed, can we use SWORDS?

You in VP 47 ? I was an AO in 19

[Long Cut]

Honestly, I don't know WHEN the military began taking orders from MADD. I'd bet that it was shortly after Tailhook, though. More stupid regs and policies flowed from that overblown fiasco than any other that I can recall.

It was that way when I joined in '93. I was 25 at the time, so it didn't affect me one way or the other, but not being able to take ALL my men out for beers is really chafing, especially when they've damn well proven themselves, in my book. Worse, like I said, we lose too many fine Sailors who simply wanted something that, until some magic date in the '80s, they could have had. Underage drinking, in some commands, leads to loss of a stripe and pay, possibly more. In any case, the Sailor now has little motivation to stay on and ship over after such an experience.

I was in VP-8, the "Fighting Tigers", for my first tour, and I'm an Instructor now at "The Pro's Nest". My next tour is to be the USS JOHN F. KENNEDY (CV-67). I'm an AW. Nice to meet ya, Shipmate!

[Mr. Mojo]

Sorry, already tried it. The highways were bathed in blood.

I'm for making everything age 17 -- driving, drinking, and legal adult age. To help prevent the high fatalities on the highways, I'm in favor of mandatory jail time and drivers license revocations for anyone driving above the .1 limit.

[Long Cut]

", I'm in favor of mandatory jail time and drivers license revocations for anyone driving above the .1 limit."

What an idea...punish an actual harmful ACT instead of an activity which MIGHT lead to it! Oh, and establish an absolute, all-inclusive age-of-majority, and EXPECT them to act like adults at that age!

I think you've got something, there. My only change would be to raise the BAC to .12. The lower numbers exist only to facilitate the arrest of those who have had 2 drinks, hardly enough to sauce a normal-sized person. Gets revenue for the police and the insurance companies, though.

[AppyPappy]

I have to agree. Lower the age to the age of responsibility. 18

[AppyPappy]

The states all raised 'em again.

The states raised the age when the federal government blackmailed them with free "gobernment" money. They were going to cut off the free goberment money if the states didn't raise the age.

[Mr. Mojo]

My only change would be to raise the BAC to .12. The lower numbers exist only to facilitate the arrest of those who have had 2 drinks

I'd go for that. ...And I'd imagine there isn't much of a difference in impairment between the two figures.

We're on the same page; it's all about personal responsibility. You said it best -- "punish the crime, not the activity that might lead to the crime." Drinking heavily in one's home might lead one - a weak brain-dead - to beat one's wife, or to drive drunk, but should drinking be outlawed because of that? Of course not, and that failed policy has already been tried. It's now time to apply the same standard to other drugs.

[quietolong]

Ewwwno A GayW ;)
Some BS That means stateside most first termers can’t have a beer. I guess there are to stay in the barracks and study there Natops;)
But can’t say I’m shocked I saw this BS coming a long time ago. We’ve had a peace time military too long. I enlisted in 75 Still just winding down from Vietnam. And a War time military. And I could see the change over. It went from those who knew there Job the best getting advanced. to Those who could put the best crease in there uniform and brownnose getting advanced.
After returning from my first WestPac from Kadena. Being still the new Guy just made E3 Got sent TAD to AIMD We made a shop that had a RFI rate of 105% and would get the work for the month out in a week. So other than repair work that came in we had most of the month to play.
Sometimes for training day we would head over to the E-club sign our Chief in and have a pitcher of beer as we went over that weeks training subject. Then on Fridays in was secure early head over to the golf club for Beer, Ship Caption, Crew and all the chicken wings you could eat. Then at nineteen hundred hours. head over to E-Club for the striper’s
I remember one time we went over to the Club to hold training. Later in the evening after school was out. us E4s had to hold our Chief back from kicking some kids ass that pissed him off.
Well it’s getting late here.
BTW what’s the The Pro's Nest ?