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Calif. Bishop To Gov. Davis: Pick Abortion Or Communion [formal excommunication?]
National Catholic Register ^ | Feb, 2-9, 2003 | WAYNE LAUGESEN

Posted on 01/28/2003 12:31:41 PM PST by Polycarp

Calif. Bishop To Gov. Davis:
Pick Abortion Or Communion

 


National Catholic Register
Feb, 2-9, 2003

by WAYNE LAUGESEN
Register Correspondent

SACRAMENTO, Calif. - The message is blunt: Abortion hurts women and is the direct killing of children, and any politician who promotes such a heinous thing shouldn't receive Communion.

That's what Sacramento, Calif., Bishop William Weigand said to Gov. Gray Davis.

But Davis said he's going to continue to receive Communion anyway.

Bishop Weigand repeated his opinion twice: Once in a pro-life Mass marking the 30th anniversary of Roe v. Wade and once in an interview with the Register on Jan. 27.

In the Mass, Bishop Weigand explained that one cannot be Catholic and pro-abortion.

"I have to say clearly that anyone - politician or otherwise - who thinks it is acceptable for a Catholic to be pro-abortion is in very great error, puts his or her soul at risk and is not in good standing with the Church," Bishop Weigand said. "Such a person should have the integrity to acknowledge this and choose of his own volition to abstain from receiving holy Communion until he has a change of heart."

Davis has taken exception to Bishop Weigand's statement and says he will neither stop taking Communion nor renounce legalized abortion.

"The governor is a faithful, practicing Catholic who attends Mass in West Hollywood," said Russ Lopez, his spokesman. "We don't like abortion, but we do like choice on the issue. I'm wondering why the bishop is making a concerted effort to exclude and push away those Catholics who favor women having choice."

On Jan. 27, Bishop Weigand told the Register that he is considering formally forbidding Davis from receiving Communion if Davis doesn't change his mind on the issue.

"We're studying that right now," the bishop said. "That time could come. That time could be very near, especially with his statements that say he doesn't have to give one inch. He has manifested publicly a hardness of heart - an in-your-face hardness of heart response."

The bishop said that because of the public controversy he does not expect Davis to attend a Red Mass, a traditional Mass celebrated for members of the legal profession, he is celebrating Feb. 12. But if the governor does attend and approach the bishop for Communion, the bishop said he will give him a blessing and ask him to see him after Mass.

Bishop Weigand said he wants to follow canon law carefully, saying it requires two official admonishments before forbidding Communion. He said he has made attempts in the past to personally counsel Davis in his faith "since he obviously doesn't understand the faith." He said it was important to do this since Davis is a public official publicly espousing Catholicism.

There were two meetings scheduled between Davis and the executive committee of the California Conference of Bishops for this purpose. Both meetings were cancelled by the governor.

Bishop Weigand said he has tried to counsel the governor in a way that wouldn't embarass him, but the issue went public when a Catholic orphanage refused to allow Davis to visit its campus. The bishop said he wanted to make it clear that it's impossible to be both pro-abortion and Catholic.

Lopez said Davis has not been swayed one bit regarding his position on legalized abortion, nor has he considered avoiding Communion.

"I, myself, thought I would live and die Catholic," Lopez said. "Now I don't know. It depends on how ugly this gets. They're obviously trying to beat us up, and we're not backing down. The Church has so many problems right now that I'm surprised the diocese is embarking on something that's this exclusionary and divisive."

In the 30 years since its legalization, abortion has become the most common surgical procedure in America. More than 1 million mothers have abortions each year. The babies who are aborted are distinguishable as boys or girls within hours of their conception and have beating hearts within 10 days.

Bishop Weigand said Davis has "gone public saying that the bishop shouldn't be guiding people in the faith."

"This is very curious to me," Bishop Weigand said. "He's obviously not very informed about the teachings of the Church."

The Church has defended the lives of the unborn since the early days of the Church, according to the Catechism of the Catholic Church (No. 2271). It quotes the Didache, a liturgical book from the first century after Christ's death, as saying, "You shall not kill the embryo by abortion and shall not cause the newborn to perish."

The catechism adds: "A person who procures a completed abortion incurs excommunication latae sententiae, 'by the very commission of the offense' and subject to the conditions provided by canon law" (No. 2272).

Abortion laws should be seen in terms of equality and human rights, the catechism says.

"The inalienable rights of the person must be recognized and respected by a civil society and the political authority. … The moment a positive law deprives a category of human beings of the protection which civil legislation ought to accord them, the state is denying the equality of all before the law" (No. 2273).

Also, the Vatican's Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith on Jan. 16 specifically addressed a Catholic's role in political life in its document, "The Participation of Catholics in Political Life," which called politicians and voters to be "morally coherent" and not lead "parallel lives" between one's personal and public life.

"Living and acting in conformity with one's own conscience on questions of politics is not slavish acceptance of positions alien to politics or some kind of confessionalism," the document said, "but rather the way in which Christians offer their concrete contribution so that, through political life, society will become more just and more consistent with the dignity of the human person" (No. 6).

Orphanage Shuns Davis

In December, Msgr. Edward Kavanagh of the Sacramento Diocese told Davis and his staff they were not welcome to deliver Christmas gifts to children at St. Patrick's Home for Children, directed by Msgr. Kavanagh, because of the governor's pro-abortion stance. As a result, the children received their gifts from Davis at the Capitol.

"Msgr. Kavanagh has also suggested that Gov. Davis should be excommunicated over this abortion issue," Lopez said. "Well, that's not up to the monsignor, and the governor plans on remaining a Catholic while at the same time defending a woman's right to an abortion."

"The majority of Californians support our pro-choice agenda," Lopez said. "I, personally, have had a lot of supportive comments."

Most Hispanics, however - the fastest-growing and largest minority group in California and the rest of the nation - don't support Davis in this fight, said Marcella Melendez, president of the national Hispanics for Life organization.

"The bishop is 100% correct to be doing this," Melendez said. "It's his job to correct us when we stray from the teachings of the Church and to call us to repentance. You cannot be a faithful Catholic and be pro-choice on abortion. It simply isn't possible. The governor is putting political expedience ahead of his faith."

"The prohibition of God and the law of nature is abundantly clear: 'Thou shalt not kill,'" Bishop Weigand said in his homily.

"We know it is not politically correct to be pro-life; but right and wrong, good and evil, are never revealed in a poll," he said. "All human life is sacred. A true leader stands up for what is right, not for what is popular."

Wayne Laugesen writes
from Boulder, Colorado

 


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TOPICS: Breaking News; Culture/Society; Extended News; Front Page News; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: catholiclist; vaticanmeddling; whatdotheywant
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1 posted on 01/28/2003 12:31:42 PM PST by Polycarp
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To: *Catholic_list; .45MAN; AKA Elena; al_c; american colleen; Angelus Errare; Antoninus; ...
Bishop Weigand told the Register that he is considering formally forbidding Davis from receiving Communion if Davis doesn't change his mind on the issue.

"We're studying that right now," the bishop said. "That time could come. That time could be very near, especially with his statements that say he doesn't have to give one inch. He has manifested publicly a hardness of heart - an in-your-face hardness of heart response."

The bishop said that because of the public controversy he does not expect Davis to attend a Red Mass, a traditional Mass celebrated for members of the legal profession, he is celebrating Feb. 12. But if the governor does attend and approach the bishop for Communion, the bishop said he will give him a blessing and ask him to see him after Mass.

Bishop Weigand said he wants to follow canon law carefully, saying it requires two official admonishments before forbidding Communion. He

Courage is a beautiful thing.

2 posted on 01/28/2003 12:33:31 PM PST by Polycarp
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To: Polycarp
"I, myself, thought I would live and die Catholic," Lopez said. "Now I don't know. It depends on how ugly this gets. They're obviously trying to beat us up, and we're not backing down. The Church has so many problems right now that I'm surprised the diocese is embarking on something that's this exclusionary and divisive."

The Church's teaching on this has NEVER changed. As a life-long Catholic you, Mr. Lopez, should know that. No excuses.
3 posted on 01/28/2003 12:40:13 PM PST by Desdemona
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To: Polycarp
I wonder if this will spread...
4 posted on 01/28/2003 12:44:50 PM PST by babygene (Viable after 87 trimesters)
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To: Polycarp
"We know it is not politically correct to be pro-life; but right and wrong, good and evil, are never revealed in a poll," he said. "All human life is sacred. A true leader stands up for what is right, not for what is popular."

Can't be summed up any better than that. Would that all leaders of the Church had such courage.

5 posted on 01/28/2003 12:45:40 PM PST by chimera
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To: Polycarp
Courage is a beautiful thing.

Indeed. We need bushels more of it from our Church leaders.

6 posted on 01/28/2003 12:48:47 PM PST by yendu bwam
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To: Polycarp; Pyro7480
Bless this bishop and bless the priest that wouldn't let Davis come to the orphanage! We need more of this in the Church.

Pyro, check it out.
7 posted on 01/28/2003 12:51:34 PM PST by Bigg Red
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To: Polycarp
thanks for the ping! This is a wonderful move....I am so sick of the "catholics" who only buy into what they want and thing the rest is negotiable.
8 posted on 01/28/2003 12:54:08 PM PST by SunnyUsa
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Comment #9 Removed by Moderator

To: Bigg Red
Bless this bishop and bless the priest that wouldn't let Davis come to the orphanage! We need more of this in the Church.

And this protestant freeper says, "Amen."

10 posted on 01/28/2003 12:56:32 PM PST by TomSmedley
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To: Bigg Red
I've seen the article about this over the past several days. It's about time a bishop started taking action against so-called "Catholics" in positions of power. My bishop in Wilmington, DE kicked out Biden's campaign kickoff in a local parish hall for his pro-abortion stand. We need to see more of this!!
11 posted on 01/28/2003 12:57:36 PM PST by Pyro7480 (+ Vive Jesus! (Live Jesus!) +)
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To: Polycarp
Here's hoping this catches on with the Catholic Church USA. Representatives like Kennedy and Mikulsky should start choosing a faith which mirrors their beliefs.
12 posted on 01/28/2003 12:57:41 PM PST by Sgt_Schultze
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To: Polycarp
The bishop is, of course, correct.

We must pray for the conversion of the governor's heart.

13 posted on 01/28/2003 1:00:21 PM PST by B Knotts
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To: Polycarp
Excellent! Nothing like a bit of intellectual honesty. If Gay Davis wants to support slaughtering infants, it's hypocritical and dishonest for him to pretend to be Catholic. Likewise that Lopez character. The Church isn't a democracy.
14 posted on 01/28/2003 1:01:49 PM PST by ArrogantBustard
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To: Thud
Give the Bishop a white rag to replace his hat, get him to grow a beard and send him to Iran. He'll fit right in.

Why? Is the "right" of mothers to kill their babies fiercely protected by "feminists" in Iran? Geeze, that country's more screwed up than I thought.

15 posted on 01/28/2003 1:03:01 PM PST by WaveThatFlag
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To: Polycarp
Davis has taken exception to Bishop Weigand's statement and says he will neither stop taking Communion nor renounce legalized abortion.

Let's see -- Davis stopped taking Communion for the 15 years prior to his marriage being formalized by the Church. Yet he thumbs his nose at the suggestion he stop taking Communion because he's o.k. with killing babies.

Curious standard of pick and choose, I'd say.

16 posted on 01/28/2003 1:04:13 PM PST by workerbee
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Comment #17 Removed by Moderator

To: Thud
If you truely believe what you just wrote then clearly you can't distinguish between right and wrong. I'm very sorry for you.
18 posted on 01/28/2003 1:08:17 PM PST by MoGalahad
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To: Polycarp
". . . I'm wondering why the bishop is making a concerted effort to exclude and push away those Catholics who favor women having choice."

I'm not even Catholic, and I'm pretty sure the Catholic Church doesn't look kindly on women choosing to kill their babies.
19 posted on 01/28/2003 1:11:12 PM PST by Xenalyte
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To: Polycarp
In the 30 years since its legalization, abortion has become the most common surgical procedure in America.

More common than tonsillectomies? I'm finding that hard to believe.
20 posted on 01/28/2003 1:12:22 PM PST by Xenalyte
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To: Polycarp
"I, myself, thought I would live and die Catholic," Lopez said. "Now I don't know. It depends on how ugly this gets. They're obviously trying to beat us up, and we're not backing down.

Well, fine, you can make that choice. Mr. Lopez is obviously seeking the approval of men and places that ahead of his relationship with God. He is free to make that choice, but he will pay a high price for choosing poorly.

The Church has so many problems right now that I'm surprised the diocese is embarking on something that's this exclusionary and divisive."

The only problem the church has had in dealing with this issue is a short supply of guts in facing up to the problem of public figures openly defying the teaching of the church. Sounds like they're in the process of addressing that issue.

And they're not "embarking" on anything that hasn't always been part and parcel of Catholic doctrine. They're just trying to do a better job of informing members of the consequences of their choices. So, in that sense, they're practicing a Catholic flavor of "pro-choice", stay in the church and continue to receive the sacraments, or not.

21 posted on 01/28/2003 1:13:16 PM PST by chimera
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To: Polycarp
Davis has taken exception to Bishop Weigand's statement and says he will neither stop taking Communion nor renounce legalized abortion

Talk about arrogance
Typical egotistical politician
Politicians like used car salesmen are a special breed
22 posted on 01/28/2003 1:14:16 PM PST by uncbob
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Comment #23 Removed by Moderator

To: Xenalyte
They rarely do T&A's any more, antibiotics are generally prescribed instead.

There are 4400 abortions daily, or approximately one every 20 seconds.

I think vasectomies are the other most common procedure.

--Dr. Kopp

24 posted on 01/28/2003 1:16:35 PM PST by Polycarp
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To: workerbee
Communists are atheists anyway...but to court political favor with Fellow Travellers and the ignorant.
25 posted on 01/28/2003 1:18:10 PM PST by onedoug
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To: Polycarp
The California electorate has some dark problems, but the ecclesiastical Catholics there shine like a cluster of brilliant stars.
26 posted on 01/28/2003 1:24:52 PM PST by .30Carbine
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To: workerbee
Curious standard of pick and choose, I'd say.

The hallmark of a Cafeteria Catholic...

27 posted on 01/28/2003 1:25:13 PM PST by COBOL2Java
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To: Polycarp
Thanks for the ping. This is such heartening news! Praying that we'll see more of this...
28 posted on 01/28/2003 1:31:00 PM PST by COBOL2Java
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To: Polycarp
"This is very curious to me," Bishop Weigand said. "He's obviously not very informed about the teachings of the Church."

This is true for so many catholics!! Were they aware, the abuses would stop.

Go Weigand!!! We're behind you ALL THE WAY!

29 posted on 01/28/2003 1:31:27 PM PST by NYer (Kyrie Eleison)
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To: Polycarp
Yeah! He's my Bishop!

From the little I know about Bishop Weigand, he has always been publicly a very strong advocate for the unborn, but he also seems shy in a way, not really a public speaker. He has really impressed me.

One thing that struck me is that the Bishop said he has been trying to resolve this with Davis privately, but Davis refuses to meet and he had no recourse, after the orphanage incident and the attacks by the Governor on Monsignour Kavanaugh to address the matter publicly.

It makes me think that there might be more of this that is going on, and I think it's only right that the Bishop's try and solve these situations in private whenever possible. The Church is not out to embarrass anyone, and doesn't want to excommunicate anyone. But to call yourself a faithful Catholic over and over, but denounce the teachings of the church, eventually something has to give. Davis has brought this problem on himself. He didn't have to bring his religion up into the public arena -- there are many pro-abort Catholics in the Legislature who simply don't talk about being Catholic (they KNOW what they are doing is wrong, so not talking about it they think it can go away). But Davis made a POINT to say it's OK to be Catholic and pro-abortion. He has NO right to say that.

I wrote Bishop Weigand a letter after the pro-life mass, and anyone in the Sacramento Diocese, please write him and pledge your support for his statements, and whatever decision he makes. This can't be an easy time for him, and he needs the support of the faithful.

God bless.

30 posted on 01/28/2003 1:40:28 PM PST by Gophack
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To: Gophack
Address please? I'm in NYC, but I'll gladly write the man.
31 posted on 01/28/2003 1:47:09 PM PST by WaveThatFlag
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To: Polycarp
"I, myself, thought I would live and die Catholic," Lopez said. "Now I don't know. It depends on how ugly this gets. They're obviously trying to beat us up, and we're not backing down."

We lived out in California for a while, and attended mass there. It struck me that the Catholic Church in California has far more sway over property than over souls. I suspect the real "faithful" could easily fit into a tiny fraction of the churches.

32 posted on 01/28/2003 1:53:49 PM PST by madprof98
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To: Gophack
He has NO right to say that.

Actually, it's a free country. He has the right to say that.

However, it's a completely false statement. He knows that. He's lying, when he says that.

And it's a free country. The rest of us (including Bishop Weigand) have a right to say that Gay Davis is a liar.

33 posted on 01/28/2003 1:54:27 PM PST by ArrogantBustard
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To: Polycarp
"I'm surprised the diocese is embarking on something that's this exclusionary and divisive."

Nobody was more "divisive" than Jesus when it came to dividing sinful behavior from sinless behavior. Clearly the bishop is not cowed by Davis' PC malarkey.

34 posted on 01/28/2003 2:02:03 PM PST by MrLeRoy ("That government is best which governs least.")
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To: B Knotts
We must pray for the conversion of the governor's heart.

Amen.

35 posted on 01/28/2003 2:50:25 PM PST by Siobhan (+ Jesus, I trust in you. +)
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To: Polycarp
Three cheers for Sacramento, Calif., Bishop William Weigand.

I'll be sure to call his office and thank him for his couragous stand on this issue.

36 posted on 01/28/2003 2:55:58 PM PST by Smogger
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To: Polycarp
The Bishop's words are admirable, but Davis attends Mass in Santa Monica, the domain of Cardinal Mahony. You think Mahony is going to deny him communion or excommunicate him?

Davis hates Sacramento and spends as little time there as possible.

37 posted on 01/28/2003 2:58:06 PM PST by Scupoli
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To: Polycarp
"The governor is a faithful, practicing Catholic who attends Mass in West Hollywood,"

This should tell everyone all they need to know about Davis's Catholic beliefs. Of course they will give him Communion there - it is Sodom of the south!

38 posted on 01/28/2003 2:58:15 PM PST by CA Conservative
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To: Smogger
I am not Catholic, but my girlfriend is, and she is also a lawyer. She invited me to the Red Mass, and I promised to go with her just to be supportive. Now I am looking forward to it! Here's hoping I get to see Gray Davis and all of the other pro-abort Catholic politicians refused Communion!
39 posted on 01/28/2003 3:00:58 PM PST by CA Conservative
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To: Polycarp
How does one contact the good bishop to encourage and thank him?
40 posted on 01/28/2003 3:12:15 PM PST by Notwithstanding (Are you pro-abortion because you were involved with one?)
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To: Notwithstanding
Ave Maria School of Law BUMP
41 posted on 01/28/2003 3:13:24 PM PST by davidwendell
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Comment #42 Removed by Moderator

To: Polycarp
Abortion hurts women and is the direct killing of children, and any politician who promotes such a heinous thing shouldn't receive Communion.

There goes all the "catholic" Democrat politicians. Most of them use the word "catholic" as a political shield. "See? We're with God, too."
But....By their fruits we will know them.

43 posted on 01/28/2003 3:20:10 PM PST by concerned about politics (Anti-war is really anti-Bush. It's the votes, stupid!)
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To: Xenalyte
IMO it's the removal of wisdom teeth.

More common than tonsillectomies? I'm finding that hard to believe.

44 posted on 01/28/2003 3:20:52 PM PST by Thud
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To: CA Conservative
St. Vincent's was the only church in that area with a website:

January 28, 2003

St. Victor's Catholic Church is an urban community of faith located in the heart of a busy and heavily populated metropolis. We seek to follow the Lord and live the good news--the gospel--according to our ancient Catholic tradition. We welcome all, regardless of race, nationality, gender, socio-economic class or sexual orientation. We believe in the power of the gospel to transform our lives and society around us, even in the most cosmopolitan of settings. We are a city on a hill. We are the light of the world. We are the salt of the earth. We are located in West Hollywood and serve residents of that city and the surrounding areas of Los Angeles.

We are pleased to offer an outstanding music program to complement our liturgy. We provide more than 1,000 meals each month to the poor and homeless. We seek to serve the outcast of society, those marginalized through economic status, social disapproval or any kind of discrimination. God does not discriminate. We invite you to join us in our service to God and neighbor, especially those in our midst who are shunned by the rest of society. All are welcome at St. Victor's. Come home to St. Victor's.


Our society continually reinforces messages of exclusion and hatred toward gay and lesbian individuals. Unfortunately, this spirit of ridicule and judgment has also at times seeped into the Church. More than a few times we have heard shocking tales of gay and lesbian Catholics being excluded by priests, thrown out of their homes, fired for no cause and ridiculed in our Catholic schools. The pain caused by such ignorance can last a lifetime.


At St. Victor's, we extend an invitation to members of the gay and lesbian community to join us, just as they are, and to heal these wounds of shame. We encourage gay and lesbian Catholics to rediscover their birthright to membership in the People of God, a right bestowed by their baptism. Thus we all share in the dignity of being called sons and daughters of God


"We are subjected to every kind of hardship, but never distressed; we see no way out but we never despair; we are pursued but never cut off; knocked down, but still have some life in us; always we carry with us in our body the death of Jesus so that the life of Jesus, too, may be visible in our body." —2 Cor. 4:8-10


visit the AIDS Memorial Chapel at St. Victor's
NEXT HIV MASS: SEPTEMBER 16, 2 p.m.


Q. If I decide to go to confession, do I have to confess things that I do not believe are sins?

A. You should only confess actions or lack of actions that your conscience tells you are wrong. If you are conflicted about something, talk to the priest about it. Tell him why you don't think it is wrong. He will help you work through your feelings and resolve any conflicts you may have. If you are not conflicted about something, or if your conscience is genuinely confortable with a perticular course of action, why should you bring it up, unless you are truly bothered by it? The confessional is not for debating; it is where you come with sincerity to reconcile yourself with God and the faith community.




45 posted on 01/28/2003 3:22:59 PM PST by Jeff Chandler ( ; -)
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To: Polycarp
Governor Davis,

Your spokesman Russ Lopez is making you look foolish and uneducated as a person who professes to be Catholic. As in the past on other issues you are choosing political expedience over principal and faith. There is no subjective opinion on abortion in the Church. It is not choice it is life. Slavery was once a legal practice and was rejected under moral pressure and a devastating civil war. You are a public figure that is making the Church look as bad as the unfaithful priests that have sinned and hurt innocent children. It was not the Church that failed but sinful men poorly representing the Church and our faith. Christ said to those that are given much, much is required. For those in public office there is no middle ground in following and representing the faith. Remember that you answer to Christ and not just his representative Church on earth. You have obviously not read Humane Vitae nor studied Church doctrine. I support the Bishop William Weigand in calling you to either clarify your statement on abortion or to stop receiving our Lord in communion. I hope the Church does the same to the dozen U.S. Senators such as Edward Kennedy and others that are equally leading millions of Catholics astray and risking their souls for not defending our faith and innocent life.

My e-mail to the governor.....

46 posted on 01/28/2003 3:23:50 PM PST by Mat_Helm
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To: davidwendell
Big Ave Maria Law bump.
47 posted on 01/28/2003 3:25:09 PM PST by Notwithstanding (Are you pro-abortion because you were involved with one?)
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To: Scupoli
Ah yes - Roger Taj Mahony. Now, there is a man who is more hypocritical than even Gray Davis. I have been wondering just when we would hear from the Reverend Roger on this matter. The silence has been deafening. Strange, one would have expected the Reverend Roger would be speaking up in support of his fellow bishop. You have to ask yourself where is the media in soliciting Roger's comments on this matter. Oh, I forgot. In LA, the LA Times is the media. Guess I won't hold my breath. Don't you just love it.
48 posted on 01/28/2003 3:26:14 PM PST by CdMGuy
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To: madprof98
"We lived out in California for a while, and attended mass there. It struck me that the Catholic Church in California has far more sway over property than over souls. I suspect the real "faithful" could easily fit into a tiny fraction of the churches."

I just returned from about 6 weeks in southern California, and I found the parish I attended to be bulging at the seams. The parish contains about 3,000 families, and even though the church is quite large, there is standing room only at the 6 Sunday masses. Two are in Spanish, two in Vietnamese, and two in English. The pastor and priests are all very orthodox, and the masses are reverent and prayerful. The diocese is Orange County. Good for them!

49 posted on 01/28/2003 3:27:36 PM PST by redhead (A' course it's Pete! Jist lookit 'im!)
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To: Thud
Be careful about reposting the comments of others that your church has ***heads too.

Gee, I thought your post was deleted because you compared a Catholic bishop who objected to a politician's misrepresentation of a voluntary organization with murderous theocrats.

50 posted on 01/28/2003 3:28:25 PM PST by Jeff Chandler ( ; -)
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